Not understanding broad Scots accent "racism"?

[Ponders]

I hesitate to say this is PC gone mad - but this is PC gone mad

Alex Ferguson & Kenny Dalglish would generally benefit from subtitles on the rare occasion they agree to an interview - why is it racist, FFS? There are dozens of strong British accents which can be hard to understand if you're not local to them!

Collins should not have "made a grovelling apology" (if he actually did )

They had both been complaining about the sound for some time according to the article. They never said anything about accents or dialects just that they couldn't hear. It was the "racist" response that said it was to do with accents.

But why would he say translate, then, Tink? Why would someone else be able to hear better?

But this is a storm in a teacup, agreed.

Blotted - I haven't read this particular book - Dialects by Peter Trudgill, but have just scanned it on google books, as Trudgill is always really really good and knows his stuff. It's an introductory text, and may be part of what you're looking for.

This may be even better, also by Peter Trudgill.

I can imagine that if the acoustics were poor, someone familiar with the accent being spoken would be better able to pick up what was being said (and "translate" it for the ignorant southerners)

Habbibu - not everyone uses a more formal register when it might be helpful. I can imagine that at some Labour party regional meeting, one or two delegates might be quite assertive about speaking in their own local accent. In Barnsley, for instance, I would expect a few members of the audience to speak in VERY broad accents that can be tricky for people outside the area to understand - I lived only a few miles away but closer to Huddersfield as a child yet have real problems understanding very strong Barnsley accents/dialect.

No, I can imagine people sticking to their accent, but not speaking in the same dialect as they would in the pub, say, unless they were deliberately trying to be obtuse.

Ponders, maybe. Translate still wanky thing to say (as is racist in this context). Am surprised at Caird Hall, mind - wonder if they were using acoustics as a cover for not understanding accents?

Someone from Dudley would need translating to TinkerBelle's Brummie Mummy (sorry, couldn't resist) and to most people in the UK they're the same. Dudley has it's own dictionary! I do ask my friends to translate sometimes.

Anyway, I don't know why he used that word or thought someone else could hear better. I do think it can be used though, he heard something mumbled and someone turned it into something he could understand.

I've just thought of Kenny'd "humph mumph rumph and all his friends knowing exactly what he said

I guess though there is a bit of the "you're in Scotland, you daft bugger. What exactly were you expecting?", and a certain irritation with SOME English people who think that English English the Right Kind - same people who use England and Britain interchangeably and get v. huffy when they are (politely) corrected. That prob. borders on chippiness too, but there's a fine line.

Does anyone remember that clip of the Scottish fisherman who always used to turn up in "It'll Be All Right On The Night"? He really was unintelligible!

the one who spoke at a mile a minute even though they kept asking him to slow down, UQD? (was he Scottish? I remember him but had no idea, from the clip, whether he was Scottish or Irish)

To be honest I can't remember if he was Scottish or Irish either. But I do remember him being incomprehensible!

Nae wonder they weren't understood if they were in Dundee. I lived near there for 5 years and ahd to say "eh?" to anyone who spoke to me from there.

Interesting veiws on what makes racism though. As a Scot living so far south that I'm almost in france, i have encountered what I would term racism on a frequent basis, often direceted at my accent and I 'm supposed to take it on the chin.

I laughed at the comment "There are certain common elements to a Scottish accent". Where I'm from, you go 20 miles in one direction and you hear what you think is Glaswegian, you go 20 miles in another and you hear people saying " oo hid a day off skill the day", where they use the word "oo" as a substitue for "we". So they will say "oo'r gan tae the pub". "oo'll hav tae get a move on".

Erm, could you lot stop writing with your silly accents please? I can't understand a word you're all saying!

shall i translate rhubarb

Ray Collins was being a nob when he asked for a translation but he was not racist.

One thing that has been overlooked is that the meeting was in the Caird Hall in Dundee. That puts together wierd accustics (Billy Connelly likened it to playing in a tunnel) and the Dundee accent. Not a good combination.

I am from Dundee and I sometimes have bother understanding some of the folk from the toon.

I have since lived in Germany where my DH once witnessed two German guys speaking English as they could not understand each others dialect.

HOW is it racist? It's not racist. racism is about thinking someone is inferior to you, based on their race, colour whathaveyou.

Are you deciding to not be able to understand an accent because you have secret loathing? Are you making the choice to refuse to allow your brain to interpret the sounds?

stupid.

not racist,racism is prejudice against identifiable skin colour.

perhaps it could have been better put though

but me thinkey this is a chancer thinking Wahey lets see how far i can take this then and belly aching for no particularly good reason

We were shown a film at work made by young people in london - not being from london another woman and myself founf it exceptionally difficult to understand the heavy accent used by the young people in the film - not cockeny btw! i can't lable it - sorry - i don't know what it is - i suspect it derives from a cultural mix of people over time.

my colleague mentioned this and was ROUNDED on by all at the table with " you can't say that, its racist, how dare you...omg!"

to which i countered - if i said " put wood in th'ole" would you know i was asking you to close the door?"

its about accents not racism.

Must admit I do find very broad Scottish accents hard to understand, probably because I don't know many Scottish people. I used to find some Asian/Indian accents hard to understand but after 4 years of working with a lot of Indian/Asian Doctors I'm now very good at understanding the accent.

I rememebr once years ago I was selling a car and someone from Birmingham rang up and asked me something about the car. He had an Asian Brummie accent and I couldn't understand what he was asking. I wasn't too bothered as the car was sold anyway beut he said he still wanted to know out of interest "?????????". After getting him to reapeat it a couple of times I was still none the wiser so fibbed and said it was DHs car and I didn't know the answer as I don't know much about cars. Afer putting down the phone the penny dropped that he was asking if it was a left hand drive or not.

The bloke was being offensive and snobbish rather than racist wasnt he - after all Scots is a recognised different language (not just an accent) but is only really used by the 'working classes' and somewhat looked down upon by the middle classes.

I read a good study recently about this - people complained about the use of Scots in episodes of River City as they said it didnt reflect the real use of the language. The producers were keen not to use it as well because it reflected on the characters and distracted from the plot .

'but is only really used by the 'working classes' and somewhat looked down upon by the middle classes. '

Maybe in Edinburgh, but plenty of people with plenty of money use Scots, particularly among themselves, in many parts of Scotland and don't give a rat's fat arse about 'class'.

It's not seen as something to be looked down upon or a class thing here in the Highlands, of course, they don't suffer snobby pricks like Collins here gladly, either, thank f*ck.

Again, I don't think he's racist, but he is a twat.

Fair enough expat and interesting too - I was just quoting the study from memory...cant dig it out though unfortunately.

Gaelic is a different language yes,but a Scot speaking english isnt another language

language is the composition of words,symbols,to form meaning and communicate

dialect is regional differences in spoken language