Russell Brand, Jonathan Woss and Andrew Sachs

[JoolsToo]

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/celebritynews/3263328/Russell-Brand-and-Jonathan-Ross-joke-radio -phone-calls-just-werent-funny.html

Have we not had a discussion about this? I'm surprised.

Seedy, sordid, unfunny little men pad obscene amounts of money to be obscene.

What's your view?

It was said on the titmarsh show earlier that the show was pre-recorded and that they had passed it with Andrew Sachs before they put it out.

Andrew Sachs now appears jolly embarassed about the whole thing

I expect he told his agent "look tell people I didn't think it was a great idea"

then his agent said "Andrew Sachs didn't like it"

then someone woke Gordon Brown up

etc

these things escalate

I've no desire to make it personal either TC

Jools & sobernow - I couldnt agree more.

If you dissect any comedy it isn't funny

What about the rape of an old woman? Little Britain does it and wins awards. You can't break it down and analyse it and ban what's BAD. Comedy isn't that simple, is it? Break down Jo Brand's acts and they are probably just as 'misogynistic' and 'offensive' as anything that Brand/Ross do.

I think it is legit to be offensive and even misogynistic if the humour is thoughtful and subversive or satirical, and above all very funny. But not when the offensiveness is just mindless, and not when it is targeted at a determinite individual who has done nothing to merit the attack.

Andrew Sachs interview here

He seems LOVELY I wish he was MY Grandpa

He is so lovely in that interview. Funnily enough he was on Radio4 yesterday in the 'Running Away' prog. He was completely lovely in that too.

only probably? that's a very non-commital meaningless statement MP. Not like you at all

What crap about women does she think it's acceptable to spout?

I'm afraid I'm not aware of her spoutings. Satanic sluts' musings on the rights of women aren't next to the Germaine Greer on my shelf...

probably

yuck

those bloody wishy-washy humanists have infiltrated my brain

Well, that's it really NOTLT. This wasn't edgy. It didn't push at any boundaries or look at something a different way.

It was simply unkind.

D'you think it's legit to be racist as long as it's thoughtful and subversive and satirical and funny, too?

LittleBellaLugosi, possibly. If it was a satire on rascism, almost certainly.

god yes

especially if you are black/asian/of an ethnic minority

as long as it's FUNNY obviously

So I'm racking my brains to think of examples here?

Here, littlebella

Actually Manuel in Faulty Towers is quite funny.

......... although not an accurate portrayal of the Catalan minority I would argue!

Actually Manuel in Faulty Towers is quite funny.

......... although not an accurate portrayal of the Catalan minority I would argue!

oh bugger my pc hasn't got audio, but I'm presuming that's the restaurant scene from goodness gracious me?

That's not racist, doesn't count.

Yes manuel is funny.

But I bet he wouldn't be allowed today.

to my mind, the problem is that it was offensive, unfunny, and horribly lazy boardcasting from two people who are paid a huge amount of money - most of us have to live up to an employers expectation, these two are simply either too lazy or have become too arrogant to come up with some new, edgy, thoughtful/satirical humour. (any 12 year old can call up an old guy and swear!)

if i was their boss i would be looking for some new young talent, these two are fast becoming 'chip-paper'

Oh, yes! The Spanish govt actually complained about Manuel, as a racist stereotype. But actually the comedy lay (mostly) in a stereotype of an Englishman and his racist perceptions of a Spanish waiter.

I couldn't agree more .... but the complication comes in the interpretation not the intent. Just as Alf Garnet's racism was actually supposed to be a satire on bigotry but didn't always come come across that way!

Actually, I find Ross and Brand both very funny and interpret any misogyny as self-deprecating on their part but obviously others take it at face value.

I haven't heard the broadcast so really can't comment on whether it was funny or not but I suspect it wasn't.

Fruitstick - the worst things they said were that on hearing their messages, Andrew Sachs might want to hang himself, they also "joked" about breaking into his home while he slept to sexually abuse him.

I find it hard to believe that any normal person would find that funny or acceptable. And I am amazed anyone would try to justify it.

I suspect that the BBC will axe the junior producer and Russell Brand's radio show to be seen to really do something while trying to hang on to Jonathan Ross and the senior executive who signed off on the show.

I'm no trying to justify it, nor have I at any point ... merely pointing out that I haven't heard it and neither (I suspect) have most of the 18,000 who complained.