The Rich According to the Guardian

[Judy1234]

www.guardian.co.uk/money/2008/aug/04/workandcareers.executivesalaries

Dittany - Don't you have any wealthy friends or family members? Are they all awful? What an odd life you seem to lead.

Am ROFL-ing at Quattro's descriptions of the STBB lawyers/accountants/Counsel.

"Better laws so that rich people can't avoid the taxes the rest of us have to pay."

Dittany- not as easy as it sounds. Closing tax "loopholes" is a moving target and complicated by cross border business. The UK govt does NOT have full control/jurisdiction over all thepeople/entities that operate in the UK. There are so many practical difficulties. The notion of fair taxation is not entirely objective. Many of us would have been offered well known schemes that allow you to effectively buy losses so that you can reclaim Income tax. This facility was set up with good reason but is subject to abuse. A nd yes the IR is trying to close them dowm.

PS I didn't take the schemes up more because I didn't want to take the risk and to a lesser extent because it didn't feel entirely right.

Anyone who says that we don't need taxes is living in dream land. The only question is how much taxation is fair..you will be here all day arguing that.

My personal view is that the UK is a fairly balanced (but not perfect) model.

riven - in answer to your question, I don't think you can go from being domiciled to non-dom while you live in the UK. I am non-dom because I came from another country. When I get citizenship I will become domiciled.

In any case, it makes no difference to the income I earn in UK. Income tax and NI etc is still deducted through PAYE - same as everyone else.

There are other people who will know more about ISAs, but you can get a cash ISA (mini ISA) which is like a savings account, but you are not taxed on any interest you earn. There are some reasonable ones around - have a look at moneysavingexpert.com

I think that you can take certain steps to establish your non-dom status e.g. buy overseas burial plot + point out that your dad is non-dom + keep overseas clubs/trips/contacts going. Currently I am presumed to be UK-dom but I can establish my non-dom.

Non dom can make a difference for Inheritance and Capital Gains tax but less of a difference for Inc tax these days, I THINK as I am NOT a tax expert.

Dittany - "How would it be living an odd life not to have wealthy friends? The majority of the country don't"

I'm not sure that's true. You come across as more than a bit chippy to me; perhaps you are not very open to having friendships with anyone who differs from you.

Did you go to school?
Did you go to University?
Have you ever had a job?

Lots of people from my (state) school went on to become very successful and some of them very wealthy.
Ditto university.
I've worked with people who have gone on to become very successful and wealthy.

LOL Xenia at not needing infrastructure.

No electricity.
No clean running water.
No telecommunications.
No roads.
No medical care.

?

Plus a large charge has been introduced to claim non-dom for In tax (I THINK) so only worthwhile for really wealthy. We really need a tax acctnt/barrister to put us right on these issues.

Re: ISAs, the problem is that the govt tried to make these more accessible for less well off (lowering thresholds etc) but the poor tend not to have savings culture so it is still the middle classes that take advantage of these. So who to blame?

Xenia must be winding you all up if she is saying all these things.

my theory on Xenia: in RL she is a kind but shrewd business person. She is forming the Xenia brand as a sort of arch right leaning antogonist that she will commercialise in time. Like that US radio host (Laura somebody, i think) who is a key opinion former who has even caused the senate to back down on legislation. Xenia- I have some more ideas on how you could use the brand.

ToughDaddy - Have you got the hots for Xenia?

'Mind you I am the one who bought an island with no infrastructure on it. I don't really seek or desire luxury.' Hahahahahahahahahahahahah Quote of the week.

cocolepew -

Swedes- I don't like many of her views but I have a soft spot, yes

Dittany - It's not a personal attack at all. I'm just saying that I find it odd that you don't, and your friends don't, have any wealthy friends.

calm down guys, this is just a discussion and you need to consider other people's views if you are going to get something out of the discussion.

Off to Hamleys now for some cheer.

see i always imagine Xenia in very high heels, stern glasses and perfectly coiffed hair, drumming her fingers on the desk. Is that the image you've got too TD?

Another vote here for quote of the week

'Mind you I am the one who bought an island with no infrastructure on it. I don't really seek or desire luxury.'

Priceless.

Dittany - I am narrow-minded and unimaginative. You are very observant.

Swedes/Ditts- both of you go to your room.

Hey Ruty- you are on to something there

Swedes I've always found you to be intelligent and sympathetic.

Dittany, your argument can be summed up as follows:

"RICH PEOPLE ARE BAD. VERY BAD. THEY ARE ALL AVOIDING TAX. IT DOESN'T MATTER THAT I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT TAX AVOIDANCE IS, I STILL KNOW THEY ARE ALL DOING IT. BASTARDS. AND THEY ARE ALL SUPERIOR. I KNOW THEY ARE ALL LIKE THIS EVEN THOUGH I DON'T KNOW ANY RICH PEOPLE. IT'S NOT FAIR."

Which is not a terribly grown-up argument.