David Cameron: It is your fault if you are fat and poor.

[FairyMum]

Has anyone commented on the David Cameron-speech on moral neutrality? He is a price-dick, isn't he?

I know a lot about food deserts -- ignorance about what constitutes a healthy diet is a bigger problem than access issues (that's what the relevant researchers, the people who actually coined the phrase food desert, say).

I hate the way the press in this country distort the news, politician's words.

I'm sick of the arguement that obesity is a result of lack of education - my DH and I are both overweight, both of us are very well educated, and could both write disertations on currently accepted standards of nutrition, approaches to weight loss etc. We are fat because we are happy to be so, we accept the consequences, and we dont need lecturing. Any additional costs on the NHS we may make in the future, will be heavily outweighed by the pension savings resulting from our premature deaths.

I haven't bothered to read all of this thread because it would just make me angry, so just read the first page.

I am fat - apparently my fault, although for me and my four sisters and my mother we have severe PCOS which when it was undiagnosed and not treated caused us to put on weight even when eating healthy.

I was attending slimming world and was doing really well at losing weight (at which point I was only a couple of stone over my apparent ideal weight) but then I came off the pill as I needed major surgery, at which point PCOS kicked in and everyother week (when I was ovulating or having a period) I would put on between 5 and 7lb therefore wiping out the weightloss from the weeks in between and even increasing my weight over what it was before.

So maybe this was my fault? I should have got medical diagnosis and treatment quicker? However I can't afford to go private (as I am poor) and so waited on the NHS. I am not complaining about the NHS because the reason for my surgery was potentially life threatening (but thankfully wasn't) and was treated better than I could have hoped for, and so for my PCOS I was willing to wait as I understand that there are people that have an urgency for treatment and count my blessings.

After my surgery I was often home on my own, and being somewhat less mobile than normal I had to rely on what food I could get my hands on, the majority of which wasn't as healthy as I'd liked!

I am also poor. I am a professional young person who bought first house a year ago with DP (also professional) and to be quite blunt it is financially crippling us with the price rises of everything - so this too apparently would be my fault. Despite having worked hard in my short life, having 3 jobs while at uni so I didn't leave with any debt. We are so poor that the 2 most natural things inthe world that we would like to do (getting married and having our own children) aren't possible at the moment and probably won't be for at least a few years yet.

So I am very cross with the state of this country that would allow two young professional people who work hard for everything they have to not be able to enjoy a bit of that life and also at the people who think we deserve it!

Just one final point... I went to a few cheaper supermarkets/shops this week just to try and cut back on some more money and do you know what I figured out? If I live on processed and frozen food from places like iceland I would save myself a fortune in food as its a lot cheaper than the fruit and veg and stuff I buy.

So who is to blame here? The people who can't afford to eat and feed their family healthy food and have to rely on this rubbish for a decent quality of life? Or the people who make it difficult or them to eat healthy on low income?

(ok I'll breathe now....)

I don't think he said that everybody who has a weight problem was to blame for it. I think he's saying that, in general, people don't feel that they have to take responsibiity for choices they make or face up to behaviour that isn't really morally acceptable because everyone is too pc to point it out.

Or perhaps I've missed the point...

it's hardly surprising, though. i mean, it's a common Conservative belief that poverty is the fault of the bearer.

what's so sad is that this idea still persists.

and may well be elected PM.

i casn understand people being fat and intelligent and welathy or poor

i always find it hard to understand that people can actually like being fat

a lot of people over eat for emotional reason (including me), not because they are actually hungry

I don't know (m)any people who like being fat, I don't,

If you over eat due to money worries, lack of decent opportunities job wise, family worries and a politician has a go at you it makes you want to slap them

tazmosis I think you've summed it up perfectly

I'm sure if we were to think of many Americans, we would be very quick to say that they themselves are to blame for their largesse. Why would the same not be true for Brits?

I know! Let's force feed him deep fried mars bars

Really the UK has got itslef into a right mess - who caused it all I'm not sure - the tories when with the "get on your bike" stuff or Nu Labour nanny state - proably a bit of both. To me ( as a non economist) it's simple. Increase the tax thresholds and reform benefits so it more worthile for average people to work. Make childcare tax deductible (is is here in Belgium). Stop spending money on useless wars and stupid vote grabbing initiatives. Spend the money on cleaning hospitals and on Education Education Education - gov thought of that one after all. Forget about A* A'levels for all and everyone getting a university place. Reintroduce apprenticships so the less academic amongst have a chance of making something of themselves. We all need a plumber/builder/electician/childcare from time to time after all! DC should start thinking about what he can feasibly do to change things - I believe he had a point that people don't take enough responsibility these days - but it's quite abother to think up realistic policies that can make a difference - we don't need another soundbite....there have been plenty of them over the last couple of years!

Those same people that DC refers to are the probably the ones who have seen their local industries systematically dismantled by government - for example, steel industries, coal mining and the shipyards - what we're seeing now is the consequences of government policies in the 80's. Loss of self respect in a generation of fathers, for being unable to provide for their families & a generation of kids brought up to think that the state provides. I know that not everyone brought up in this backround will end up fat and poor - (I, for example am slightly overweight, have enough money to pay my bills, eat nice food and go on holiday once a year, however I can't remember my dad working after I was aged 4.) however , growing up in this kind of environment puts you more at risk of depression for example, and that makes it that bit harder to get out of the house and hunt down that healthy fruit and veg, never mind have the energy to think what to do with it...

I hate the fake and calculated way in which he tries to appeal to the 'PC gone mad' brigade - 'ooh, ooh, I don't know if I dare say this - you can't say anything these days.' The thing about no one in goverment using the words right and wrong is idiotic - if anything, the government talks about right and wrong way too much. Morality is for parents to teach, not for the government to get involved in.

Because what the government and Cameron have in common is that they're both statist at heart. Cameron is apparently very much into the idea of using government to get people to change their behaviour, and I find that insidious (not to mention the fact that we've had 11 unsuccessful years of it already).

PS - sorry had a chardonnay or 3 and spelling gone out the window! And I went to one of those elusive Grammar Schools! Someone earlier made the point - I grew up on a sink council estate but was apparently clever enough (no extra coaching for the 11+ in those days). Personally I was a complete lazy arse and wanted to go the local sec mod with my mates but they (parents) were having none of it. If there is one difference that probably changed my life it was that one - and I will be eternally grateful.

I agree with him TBH. We do need to take responsibility for ourselves. I'm fat, this because I eat far too much and don't exercise. It is my own fault. I'm also always skint, again my fault, partly because I dropped out of college over and over again because I as to lazy to finish a course and get the qualification, and also because I'm to lazy to get a hard working job that pays well, I'm also crap with money.

There you go my name is ysbab and I'm taking responsibility for being fat and poor.

Personally I think many of the poverty posts on here are overstating the case. Whilst it is certainly the case that there is an underclass who for fairly specific health/ education related reasons, are unlikely to ever be able to meaningfully participate in the workforce, they are a very small minority and clearly can't account for the majority of the obesity epidemic. After all, around a million eastern europeans have been absorbed into the economy in the past few years. Of course many of them don't earn a "living wage" but a sizeable portion do.

lol ysbab....i love your name!

Well most people seem to agree that personal responsibility has a direct effect on your life and health it just seems it deopends who says it whether or not it is acceptable.Why is it ok for one person to say it and not another(DC)

Noddy -I think the problem has been that the title of this thread does not acurately reflect what DC said.

Yeah, these prejudices are so deepseated it's amazing. My brother went to Eton and works full time for a homeless charity and has essentially devoted his life to doing what he can to help the vulnerable in society.

I find it extraordinary that just because DC went to Eton, his views on poverty and so onaren't taken seriously. Most politicians, people in public life and journalists have had a very comfortable upbringing (as did Gordon Brown). Camilla Cavendish who has just written the stuff in the Times about children being taken away by DSS is as posh as you like. Even Polly Toynbee sent her children to independent schools. Can't for the life of me why Eton rather than say a nice middle class Grammar or a third rate public school for that matter makes such a difference.

Absolutely chocolatedot. People make judgements based on half the facts. If your brother went to Eton then he must be a rich tosser?

MN is very bad for this.

i agree to a point with what DC said but its a blanket statement that doesnt cover everyone!!

most people are overweight through thier own fault, myself included, but some people have medical reasons and others simply cannot afford a healthy diet, i include myself in that too! i am losing weight atm as dp isnt in a position he can help with food costs anymore, i dont eat lunch por breakfast so that i can afford better food for my dds.

most people are poor/living on benefits because they cant be bothered to work/go and get qualifications etc. some people cant work due to high childcare costs, low wages and lack of suitable jobs, i have been looking for work for two months now and i havent even found a job with suitable hours to apply for for yet!! and childcare is out fo the question as id end up with even less than i have now!! yes i would get upto 60% of childcare paid for but that other 40% would cripple me due to childcare places being limited here so the costs are higher!!

he should look at the situation closer and make it easier for those who want to try and get fit and get a job and then maybe his blanket statements will be better recieved by people!!

There is personal responsibility, and then there is using personal responsibility as a cloak to cover shameful prejudices that should have died out a long time ago.

And my fear is that DC falls into the latter camp.

I have a real problem with people who are as detached from the reality of most people as both Gordon Clown and DC are.