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Dominic Cummings Covid evidence

996 replies

Newtonianmechanics · 31/10/2023 09:17

Is anyone going to watch this man give evidence today?

Apparently there is a vigil in Barnard Castle ahead of this.

The shopping trolleys emoji seems to mean they think Carrie was controlling Boris from the last few days. Wonder if this will feature.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
28
minou123 · 07/11/2023 19:03

bombastix · 07/11/2023 18:47

This is nothing to do with Cummings but during COVID I saw a woman giving her very small children and a few others a party outside her flat.

Two police came and gave her advice. She looked absolutely terrified. I looked at them until they went away. What a horrible country we became during that time.

The fact was if you could read the guidance appended to the law there were many exceptions. Just not many for little children. They suffered a lot and because they were children, they couldn't say much against it. Awful time.

I don't know if this is helpful, but they soon will be announcing more modules for the Inquiry.

So at the moment, there are 6 modules:
Module 1: Preparedness - already done
Module 2: this is split into 4 parts, 2, 2A, 2B, and 2C. But essentially looking at the Government decision making.process - this is where we are now.
Module 3: Impact to the NHS
Module 4: Vaccines
Modules 5: Procurement (PPE contracts etc)
Module 6: Care Sector

BUT
They will be announcing more Modules soon.
I think, the Modules from 7 onwards will be things like:
Module on Track and Trace
Module on the Finance support response (grants/loans)
Module on children/young persons education - Gavin Williamson will be in the hot seat for that one.
Module on the policing the Covid restrictions.

Etc.

So there is a long way to go.

This is very much an in depth, line by line review.

We should, maybe in 2025, hear from the police about thier involvement with Covid and why they took the decisions they did.

MidnightOnceMore · 07/11/2023 19:13

bombastix · 07/11/2023 18:37

I agree. These "fines" of people should never have happened. I hope that eventually everyone is pardoned and the money returned. It was iniquitous what was done to people, all glossed with guidance. A shabby cruelty on those "caught".

Yes the fines were a disgrace. They were draconian and have really ruined some people.
Especially disgusting given what was going on in 10DS.

AutumnCrow · 07/11/2023 19:23

Indeed. Were fines disproportionately directed at particular demographics; and if so, why? Because they were 'easy'?

MidnightOnceMore · 07/11/2023 19:34

AutumnCrow · 07/11/2023 19:23

Indeed. Were fines disproportionately directed at particular demographics; and if so, why? Because they were 'easy'?

Bias plus more noticeable law breaking?

Have a loud party in a flat, people report it. Have a quiet gathering in a roomy detached house, people may not notice.

And then the police target certain 'types' of people so they are more likely to get caught.

MidnightOnceMore · 07/11/2023 19:42

Found today's evidence just as revealing. The fact Lister kept saying they thought it was not serious in the early stages just shows the problem with Johnson's bloody boosterism - I clearly remember discussing 'might it be serious' in the early stages - only a FOOL would conclude anything at the early stages.

They could have used that early period to develop what they needed.

Lister showed how gung go they were.

DuncinToffee · 07/11/2023 19:51

Remember, they laughed at Italy

jgw1 · 07/11/2023 20:06

EasternStandard · 07/11/2023 17:20

Yes I had an issue with public opinion creating the outcome we had to the extent it did. I think the comms approach created a feedback loop where people demanded more restrictions and did not see the damage

I posted in the minority, obviously it did bugger all but hard to watch all the same.

Brexit, I’m not sure what to say about that as another topic, but to link it back to thread title Cummings was a factor, as he was in partygate

A significant part of the problem was I am sure you will agree a complete lack of leadership skills at senior levels in the government. With the Prime Minister more interested in skiing, writing books and taking the views of newspaper owners than considering the needs of the country and planning ahead.

minou123 · 07/11/2023 20:56

I am catching up with todays hearings, as I couldn't watch it live.

Just watching Simon Ridley (Civil Servant, was a private secretary, then became head of Covid Taskforce)

Clearly setting up the Taskforce in May 2020 was an achievement.
Before then, from Jan 3020 to April 2020, the whole thing was a mess; nobody knew what the other departments were doing, endless meetings with No 10, and everybody thinking their department should be a priority.

Setting up the Taskforce, (who had control and brought everyone together to a central point and they knew who was doing what), was a good idea.
What is making me giggle a little is its very typical Civil Service - everyone is taking credit for the idea of setting up the Taskforce

Simon Ridley, is talking about how it was his idea, Helen McNamara claimed it was her idea, Simon Case said it was his. And Dominic Cummings, very much claimed the Taskforce was his brilliant idea.

Anyone who works in the Civil Service will recognise this.

If you don't work in the Civil Service, I'm sure you may have seen it as well - there is a good idea and as soon as it works, everyone comes out the woodwork claiming it was their idea. 😁

minou123 · 07/11/2023 21:02

Tomorrow's hearing is:

10am
Lord Mark Sedwill - was the Head of the Civil Sevice

2pm
Justin Tomlinson MP - was the Minister for Disabled people

I am particularly looking forward to hearing from Mark Sedwill, he was my ultimate boss.
I'll be interested if the KC touch upon partygate.
Mark Sedwill wasn't partying but he should have known about it because they used his office to hold one of the wild parties.

MidnightOnceMore · 07/11/2023 21:48

DuncinToffee · 07/11/2023 19:51

Remember, they laughed at Italy

Quite.

And Johnson wanted to be injected with it to show it was nothing to worry about - it actually nearly killed him.

The whole thing is making me feel simultaneously mad (because of the extreme dysfunction) and not mad (because the dysfunction is at least clearly visible).

beguilingeyes · 07/11/2023 23:03

MidnightOnceMore · 07/11/2023 21:48

Quite.

And Johnson wanted to be injected with it to show it was nothing to worry about - it actually nearly killed him.

The whole thing is making me feel simultaneously mad (because of the extreme dysfunction) and not mad (because the dysfunction is at least clearly visible).

I don't believe for one minute that it nearly killed him.

BIossomtoes · 07/11/2023 23:07

They didn’t take him into hospital for shits and giggles. He looked dreadful so I think he was pretty ill. I find their behaviour and attitudes completely abhorrent but they had nothing to gain by lying about how poorly he was.

minou123 · 07/11/2023 23:56

Just watching Lord Udny-Lister evidence.

I know the press have focused on BJ wanting to inject himself with covid on TV, and the "let the bodies pile high" comment.
Both shocking.

But the other thing I think is outrageous, is BJ and Lord Udny-Lister arrogance towards Scotland.

Scotland was and is entitled to make their own decisions in terms of health.
The fact BJ and Lord Udny-Lister accuse Scotland of "political game-playing" when Scotland wanted to make their own decisions is simply outrageous.
Then to "punish" Scotland by refusing to meet with them and delegating to Gove by Zoom, is just insulting.

The pure arrogance that Scotland should have fallen in line with BJs decisions just because, you know he is Prime Minister and therefore his word is the final say, is against the whole ethos of devolved administration.

Quite astonishing.

I need to go to bed.

minou123 · 08/11/2023 00:10

The Scottish woman is giving him shit now 😁

MidnightOnceMore · 08/11/2023 04:13

beguilingeyes · 07/11/2023 23:03

I don't believe for one minute that it nearly killed him.

I suppose 'nearly killed him' is a bit strong, it was a turn of phrase rather than a medical assessment.

Johnson was admitted to intensive care. At midday on Sunday, he was discharged, following seven nights in hospital, three of them in intensive care.

He was very unwell by all accounts. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/17/boris-johnson-and-coronavirus-inside-story-illness

His hospital stay definitely shows he would have been a muppet to be injected with the virus to show how 'harmless' it was.

MidnightOnceMore · 08/11/2023 04:14

minou123 · 08/11/2023 00:10

The Scottish woman is giving him shit now 😁

Yes this was a tense exchange. Lister appeared to contradict himself by saying the rule of six was based on scientific guidance as well as saying the number was arbitrary.

minou123 · 08/11/2023 07:09

MidnightOnceMore · 08/11/2023 04:14

Yes this was a tense exchange. Lister appeared to contradict himself by saying the rule of six was based on scientific guidance as well as saying the number was arbitrary.

He contradicted himself a few times, which was very frustrating to watch.

He would say something really outrageous, like "BJ wanted to inject himself with Covid on live TV", but then try to down play it.
He couldn't remember when BJ said it. One minute it was when covid hit Italy, but then he changed his story saying it was before Covid hit Italy.

He couldn't keep his story straight

minou123 · 08/11/2023 12:04

Mark Sedwill is explaining the role of Civil Servants and Special Advisers is some great detail, if anyone wants to understand how it all works.

It would be quicker if he told the inquiry to watch Yes Minister! or Thick Of It 😁

bombastix · 08/11/2023 12:18

I can see why Cummings and Johnson wanted Sedwill out. He wouldn't allow them to take decisions in their little No 10 fiefdom. I'm sure this meant he was toast as soon as he asserted ordinary constitutional principles which every other government would have bothered with.

AutumnCrow · 08/11/2023 12:36

Sedwill agreeing that certain earlier steps might have avoided the duration (and severity) of the lockdown.

Looking forward to seeing the ghastly Justin Tomlinson being questioned at 2pm.

AutumnCrow · 08/11/2023 12:44

'The shielded' - 1.5 million. Sedwill talks of food parcels.

(Very naive back then, I would say, as to what being in that 'segmented' cohort meant. )

bombastix · 08/11/2023 13:27

You can see from the emails how determined Cummings was to make decisions excluding the Civil Service.

There is also the question about Johnson's fitness to be PM after having COVID himself. Sedwill was elegant and said "stamina", but you wonder how much insight Johnson had into what was being done.

jgw1 · 08/11/2023 13:52

bombastix · 08/11/2023 12:18

I can see why Cummings and Johnson wanted Sedwill out. He wouldn't allow them to take decisions in their little No 10 fiefdom. I'm sure this meant he was toast as soon as he asserted ordinary constitutional principles which every other government would have bothered with.

Please remember that the answer to all covid lockdown problems is having a Cabinet Minister for children.

jgw1 · 08/11/2023 13:55

bombastix · 08/11/2023 13:27

You can see from the emails how determined Cummings was to make decisions excluding the Civil Service.

There is also the question about Johnson's fitness to be PM after having COVID himself. Sedwill was elegant and said "stamina", but you wonder how much insight Johnson had into what was being done.

The cynic wonders if Johnson's insight into what was needed was sufficient before he got ill that it could be impaired.

EasternStandard · 08/11/2023 13:58

jgw1 · 08/11/2023 13:52

Please remember that the answer to all covid lockdown problems is having a Cabinet Minister for children.

Still at it I see.

Any mention of children. It was the same during the pandemic I’m sure, bad show.

Poor Dc with such lack of care from adults.