Organ Donation Opt Out

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Just seen on the News that it is hoped organ donation will become 'Opt Out' rather than 'Opt In' by 2020, if the change in law gets through the final stage in the Autumn.
About time, IMO.
It was changed in Wales in 2015
Research shows that 80% of people would be happy to donate their organs, but currently only 37% have got round to signing up.

People who choose to, would still be able to register to 'opt out' , but this will hopefully mean more organs available for the 6000 currently on the waiting list.

Donor families say whether or not they would be open to receiving a letter or card from donor recipients, Kr. If your mum wasn’t able to write to her donor’s family, it might be that the family requested no further contact.

Opt out makes me uncomfortable. Maybe more opportunities to choose would be more appropriate. If organ donation was included as a standard part of all government paper work (driving licenses, passports, electoral register, benefits forms, school registration forms, University enrolment, standard question at the beginning of all GP appointments etc) and a suitable register created it would have a similar effect without assuming consent and is also more useful in that it would ensure that people who changed their minds would not be caught out with out dated information. It would also eliminate the whole resentment element of opt out. Might be too expensive though.

@Ethelswith - apologies for my sheer desperation to save my child's life and get as many organs going through the system as possible, if I could give him my own lungs I would.

I personally don't get peoples attachment to their organs once they're dead. Or their loved ones either (and yes- I have been through donating organs of a loved one)
I also don't agree with NOK being able to override if you are on the register. I have told my family I am an organ donor, it's not up to them to change that once I'm gone.
The government are purely doing this to save more lives. No other reason.
For the person that said they would opt out as they don't want their organs going to a foreigner. Shame on you.

Health tourists would be foolish to come here for an organ anyway - other European countries have far higher donation rates than we do!

Brilliant news. My brother was killed in a car accident. He spent three days on a ventilator before it was turned off. My parents were in no fit state to think straight and their gut reaction when organ donation was mentioned was 'no, no, no!!' I feel sad every day that my brother was not allowed to live on. Opt out is a much better option for grieving families I think. My mum regrets her decision but just wasn't ready for that choice to be made.

I still don't understand why:

1. potential donor signs up to system. Choice is recorded safely somewhere (who remembers when driving licenses had a space for a signature ?).

2. Potential donor sadly dies.

3. Upon receiving the body, the hospital check records. Find opt-in to system.

4. Take organs, as donor intended ?

Especially since there's no property in a dead body I don't see why there has to be a stage 3a, where a chance to ignore the donors wishes appear ? It just rather seems to underscore that there's no reason to sign up, since your wishes might not be respected.

About time. I saw a plaque in our local hospital stating only SIX transplants took place in 2017 there. That's disgraceful imo. An opt out system in no way removed anybody's choice. If anything it will give them a kick up the arse to opt out if they feel that strongly.

I don't know if it will still work tho...do NoK still have final say upon death or does this new system overrule that? Always had an issue with that, i carry a card as do my children (i have made that decision on their behalf until they are old enough) but if i died my OH would get ultimate say even if it goes against my wishes. Seems pointless signing up

Sorry missed a page (wifi having a slow day). I didn't realise that NoK wishes can be overruled if a card is held

But can you imagine how that could actually go down in practice? I don't think anyone involved in organ retrieval would feel able to go through with it against the family's wishes. It would be incredibly traumatic to do it in direct contravention of their wishes.

There is an incredibly low retention rate for organ donation nurses - most last about 2 years before moving on to another job. In part this is because of how difficult it is to go through the process with grieving families day in, day out. Add to that forcibly removing donors from there family - you'd have no SNODs left and then the whole system would grind to a halt.

If you opt out you should never be allowed to receive a donor organ Well I'd like to think this goes without saying. You either believe in organ donation or you don't. You can't have it both ways.

I don't think relatives should be allowed to override consent if the person involved had explicitly made their wishes clear.

reallybadidea you make a very fair point. I don't know what the answer is to that one. It just seems a very pointless exercise for someone to make the choice of opt in/opt out if it can be overruled.

I have been very honest with my family; i ever get the call that they have, god forbid, passed & their organs could be useful, i will give my permission. If for any reason they do not want to donate & get the arse with me saying yes, they need to ensure i'm not named as their first NoK. Thankfully there is only one who doesnt like this idea & he has a partner as his NoK. I don't understand this whole attachment to organs when dead thing, especially when I read how many people die needlessly whilst waiting for the organs that people - selfishly imo - want to be buried/cremated with

do NoK still have final say upon death or does this new system overrule that?

As far as I am aware there can't be a law that NoK have a "final say" since there's no property in a dead body. Which is why "last wishes" can be (and are more often than not) be safely ignored.

So they wanted a burial, but we cremated them ? See you in court...

But can you imagine how that could actually go down in practice? I don't think anyone involved in organ retrieval would feel able to go through with it against the family's wishes. It would be incredibly traumatic to do it in direct contravention of their wishes.

What about the wishes of the deceased ?

Seems all the opt-out way of doing things is tell people that no-one cares what you think/thought when you're dead. Which, while pretty true, is a touch demoralising and depressing.

I don't think relatives should be allowed to override consent if the person involved had explicitly made their wishes clear.

It's so easy to say this and so difficult to do in practice. Imagine being the person to wheel a family's loved one to an operating theatre to die, with the family screaming "no, don't do it".

If you opt out you should never be allowed to receive a donor organ what a stupid thing to say. Do people really want to live in a country where the treatment you receive depends on what you are prepared to give? So if you don’t give blood you lose your entitlement to a transfusion? Not on the bone marrow register? No entitlement to certain cancer treatment.

Where would people like it to end?

It should be down to the individual. So with the new opt out system, if you feel that strongly about not donating, get your arse in gear & opt out. Then if you die, a quick tap of a computer will show this & your whole body can be sent to the morgue. If the computer says you haven't opted out, then to me you clearly aren't actually all that bothered anyway so why shouldn't several people have a chance to live?

My one family member who wants to be buried with everything deliberately hasn't signed up for donation...if the new system comes into play i don't know if he will opt out, although i won't be reminding him! We either have a choice or we don't...it isn't opt in/opt out that removes that choice imo

“The opt out system is to catch those that actually don't give a shot what happens to them upon death but haven't got around to signing the register.
The most important thing we can do is speak to NOK to let them know your thoughts on organ donation.”

This is why it doesn’t make sense- if you don’t get around to registering as a donor why would you get around to having the conversation with yourNOK? It’s not an opt out system if your family can override it anyway.

As for saying that opt outters shouldn’t get a donation - as I said above most people won’t need one so this is irrelevant. However, that short sighted stroppy POV is so far away from the principle of organ donation that you’re doing it a disservice

If you opt out you should never be allowed to receive a donor organ

What about people who are "opted out" because of intrinsic medical reasons. DW (for example) has MS which is no-no for donation of any kind. Although I suppose preventing her from receiving an organ might be some peoples idea of legal euthanasia ?

Given the current grumbles about how bad the blood donor system is (there's a thread on AIBU), maybe this discussion is moot anyway ? There won't be the resources to harvest organs

“If you opt out you should never be allowed to receive a donor organ”

This doesn’t even make sense as the poster is talking about her young child needing a transplant. Her young child who is not a donor and hasn’t yet contributed anything to society. Under these your rule your child wouldn’t have a chance of getting an organ.

I can't understand why we don't already have opt out. If people are so anti donating surely they will take the time to opt out?

So many people though who are willing to donate just never get round to registering.

I have been on the register for probably 40 years. They can have anything of mine if it helps someone else. I am religious but know that I do not need any of my organs once dead.

I would quite happily donate my body to medical science but my DH doesn't want me to so I won't. He is fine with organ donation as he too is on the register.

I think it is wrong that next of kin can override a person's wishes. If someone is happy to donate then their family should respect that.

People saying that they are on the register but will opt out if that become law sound like stroppy children.

Thanks for this thread OP, have just opted in as it's something I've been meaning to do for a while.

I can understand the pov of if you refuse to donate you opt out of receiving tbh. The key to me is the word REFUSE; if you genuinely cannot donate for medical reasons for example, then that is different to not wanting to for x y or z. Same with blood donation

There is absolutely no need to opt out of you believe you can't donate for medical reasons. Firstly, a full medical history will be done before any donation is considered so if there is a reason then it will be discovered. Secondly things change and what would is a contraindication now may be considered ok in the future. Thirdly even if your heart, lungs, liver etc are not transplantable, things like corneas, heart valves and tissues may be.

So don't opt out unless it's for personal reasons!