Charlie Gard 12

[muckypup73]

This is a thread following the legal and ethical questions raised by the recent court case involving Charlie Gard.

Please could we refrain from insulting or otherwise "bashing" his parents. It isn't in the spirit of Mumsnet and will get the threads removed.

Please could we also remember that at the heart of this case is a terminally ill baby and his heartbroken parents. There are those participating in and watching this thread for whom these issues are painful. Please let's try and be mindful of them when we post. This isn't a place for name calling or trivialising the very real pain they feel. Many parents of severely disabled children are on here.

Lastly, here are some hopefully useful reference points of facts surrounding the case.

13 July GOSH position statement on latest hearing (includes update on Charlie's condition):
www.gosh.nhs.uk/file/23611/download?token=aTPZchww

7 July GOSH statement on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/news/latest-press-releases/latest-statement-charlie-gard

June 2017 Supreme Court decision:

May 2017 Court of Appeal Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2017/410.html

April 2017 High Court Decision:
www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/Fam/2017/972.html

GOSH FAQ page on Charlie:
www.gosh.nhs.uk/frequently-asked-questions-about-charlie-gard-court-case

*Trampire" that is horrible.

that picture of th judge is horrific

itshould b taken off

also the naming of the italian doctor do ca not realise thyre breaching a court order

Sos waiting around in hospitals is the pits especially when like you, you aren't feeling good, I hope it doesn't take too long.

I have no idea why US is going after the NHS? Obamacare was not NHS, it's republicans in power now and they won't do fee for all healthcare system anyway.
For all the slagging C&C do of GOSH & NHS, I have wondered if they were in US doing the same jobs they do here (postman & carer) would they have had insurance cover to support Charlie on ventilator for these many months? I know until they have an outcome and a closure they will not be able to reason, but hope in years to come they are able to reflect.
The silence from our government/politicians is equally suspicious. They probably want NHS reputation destroyed too
It's interesting their family spokesperson is a former UKIP candidate who is probably close to Nigel Farage who seems to be very pally with Donald Trump & works for Fox.

My above post should have said 'free for all' but thinking of it, it is 'fee for all'

Trampire, That 'Killbaby' image is so wrong. Shameless ill- informed exploitation..I wonder if the family ever regret going so public?

Farage said on LBC radio that he ''supports'' CY because he 'believes in parental rights'

So the rights of the child doesn't matter to Farage?

@opinionatedfreak. Great informative post.

Do people who "support parental rights" just not think that through, or do they actually agree that children are possessions of their parents?

I imagine I know which NF falls into, but I mean in general.

Though it can't be a coincidence how many people seem to be saying that their child was "stolen" by CS/put up for "forced adoption" who say they believe in parental rights at all costs.

Online...thanks for that.. will look at the 'Dunning Kruger Effect'..

The silence from our government/politicians is equally suspicious.

It's not suspicious at all. It would be absolutely wrong, legally and constitutionally, for any politician to make any public comment while the matter is subject to the courts. I'm glad to see that no reputable British politician has been so misguided.

Tara - Just my anxiety here - Ds2 came and woke me this morning, to inform me that ds1 was stood on the bathroom window sill. "Awning" style of window was open too. I thought we were past "don't climb on the windows"!!

taratill, its the worst time of the year for our children,somany changes in summer term, sam at christmas x

I'm not sure that anyone is breaching a court order in naming the Italian doctor. They had to apply for specific permission for Dr Hirano not to be named initially, which implies that doctors other than the GOSH ones aren't covered by any generic court order.

So, even if you could mend a broken brain, should you,?

Provided that it does not radically change someone's personality, yes. My mother had a small part of her brain damaged by a stroke, as a result of which she can no longer write, she has no understanding of numbers, she slurs her speech slightly and her vision on the right hand side is affected. And she's utterly miserable. If it were possible to repair that, I would absolutely go for it.

Court order only usually applies to the country it's in anyway. To the extent that persons under gagging orders in England have even been allowed to be named in Scottish press before.
That was difficult to discuss here!

stating on wright stuffhe has been granted a green card

as host pointed out it doesnt mean anything because uk court order stands

Trampire that is truly truly awful. There are no words.

I have joined this thread late.

Thanks for the sense on this thread.

My son has mitochondrial disease. He was diagnosed by the same team at GOSH as Charlie. I support the hospital 100%. They were wonderful for our son and family.

I hope his family are able to have some peace in their last days with their son.

I'm not sure that anyone is breaching a court order in naming the Italian doctor. They had to apply for specific permission for Dr Hirano not to be named initially, which implies that doctors other than the GOSH ones aren't covered by any generic court order.

From the first court hearing:
I start by just reminding everybody that this case is subject to agreed reporting restriction orders that have been made in order to protect the anonymity of the medical team and those that have given second opinions, both here and abroad.

Those restrictions have been continued, so if the Italian doctor is one of those that have given second opinions, both here and abroad then he is covered by them. If it's a different doctor, then he isn't.

Hirano was also originally included in the restrictions; the press asked for permission to name him, saying his identity was known in the US. Dr Hirano agreed to be named: wonder if he's now regretting that.

Saying Hirano's identity is known in the US is a somewhat specious argument; it's such a small field I'm sure anyone could discover who any of them are with a couple of minutes Googling.

hi mitomum

if you dont mind me asking how is your son and how are you finding this case

That's good hear Mitomum.

This whole case had prompted me to donate more money to GOSH to hopefully help more people like you (and other illnesses of course).

Not naming any of them, when they are so easily google-able, does seem a bit pointless

Sosetuento, Lonelymummys DD isnt at GOSH but another hospital, however she is doing really well :) there are videos of her dancing and smiling, you'd have no idea how seriously ill she was just a few days ago (and still is really, as it isnt something she will ever recover from). I think she may get home in a few days.

Transpire that image is really disturbing

I have sympathy with Connie Yates saying she's an expert. When we spent a long time in hospital the Drs used to say I was an expert in my own child (as I was there each day). But as a pp has said, I didn't have the background medical knowledge beyond that I'd picked up/researched on the internet.