What does everyone think about the new 'declare your parents education' UCAS rule?

[NotanOtter]

Seems a heap of proverbial to me....

surely some families are academic and the child of an academic professional may share the genetic attributes...
scary stuff really ...
you wonder again if the lunatics have taken over the asylum ( am i allowed to say that or is it un pc )

It seems total twaddle to me. Luckily I have a masters degree, dh has no quals whatsoever so we're covered both ways!

its excellent as a disincentive maybe thats what they are aiming for

The really stupid thing about it is that a degree doesn't actually make a great deal of difference to your income any more. You are most likely better off being an electrician or a hairdresser and buying a house younger than coming out of a crap university with a dodgy sounding degree and a strong regional accent.

Before anyone cries foul, I did used to have a strong regional accent.

It is discrimination, pure and simple.

I agree with Edam and SP. I come from a family where it was absolutely assumed I'd got to university, and indeed probably to the university where my parents had met. I was very aware, when I got there, that I'd had it pretty damn easy in that respect. And that's with going to the sort of school where very few people went to Oxford.

I think they should go even further. I think anyone who has been to university or even if they have parents who've been to uni, they should be made to wear weights tied to their feet to slow them down. Nothing major, just a little handicap, if you will, to give the slower people a chance.

People with PhDs or Masters degrees should be required to tie together their two middle fingers on each hand when they work. That would even things up.

I think this is rather foolish. DH has a PhD and I have a degree so will that mean my children are likely to be discriminated against? Both DH and I were the first in our families to go to University so having achieved this will our own children now find it harder? What is the point in exams and interviews? Would it be better for us not to give our children opportunities like learning an instrument or visiting the theatre? Where will it all end? My family couldn't be more working class - I would hate to think that it was on that basis that I gained a university place.

Scenarios involving people who have become very successful financially and have not been to university and as such have been able to educate their children in top public schools will complicate the issue. Will it matter if the parent's degree is Oxbridge or red-brick, medicine or hotel management? It is not simple. Where will all this interference end?

Mind youMI, it was assumed that I would go to university as well. And both my parents left school at 14. My grandfather was working as a miner at the age of 12, By great gran couldn't read or write.

But in spite of, no actually because of, their lack of formal education they were utterly determined that we should have more chances in life than they had.

There are good parents who care about their kids, and bad uns who don't.

parental education is a red herring.

I teach kids and hardly any of their parents have been to uni, Virtually all of them wanbt bettwe for their kids

There'll be a question on how and when you were weaned before you know it...

Re: Prince Charles you're right - blimey, the first member of the royal family ever to get a degree?!

Mind you, it is making me think there is no smoke without fire. Is there any hard evidence that middle class children are getting an unfair advantage at the moment?

I can see both sides of this tbh. I agree absolutely with edam's point (I live in Germany, where the education system is absolutely riddled with institutional social discrimination - worse by far than the UK, IMO - to the degree that I don't want to put my children in it, although we are unlikely to actually be discriminated against), but OTOH automatically 'positively discriminating' on the basis of parental education does seem to provide a lot of potential for over-generalisation.

Didn't/doesn't the UCAS application ask for a reference from school? Wouldn't that be more the place to indicate where a student has overcome adverse circumstances to do well at school, rather than simply drawing conclusions from parents' education?

It's very hard not to take these things personally isn't it? I feel quite affronted that it's assumed that neither me or DH would support the DCs as much as a university educated set of parents. I'm really rather pissed off about that actually.
Oh actually maybe tha fact I'm a uni drop out means I semicare, so maybe I'll give him support on alternate days

(and yes, I know I'm being irrational, but it's really irked me)

I think there should be a concerted effort by all students this year/whenever it comes in to put something nonsensical e.g

My parents are aliens

Like the Vulcan religion thing on the census.

Jedi Knight

Sorry, not much time, but (once again ) I agree with SenoraPostrophe. No-one is going to say 'Oh sorry... your parents both have PhDs, so you can't come in, even though you have 3 As at A'level'. But it may be a way to give a little more leeway to applicants from disadvantaged backgrounds (e.g. to allow them a slightly lower A'level points score).

Mind you, if I could get rid of some of the timewasters I have to deal with every year - who get into university on the basis of decent (but not outstanding) A'levels from private schools which have obviously coached them to hell and gone, and then who don't think that attending classes, doing any work, reading books or, indeed, doing anything except getting pissed/playing rugby/shagging is important - then I'd be most grateful. [rant emoticon]

However, anyone who thinks this can somehow counter the damage done to equal opportunities and the attempt to widen participation in HE by the introduction of fees is living on Planet Zog!

there are quite a few schemes atm to broaden the range of people going to uni, so it's not just doctors & teachers kids who go. some unis are giving mini courses/days fo uni experience to try & interest kids who might not consider going because their parents didn't. however, i think almost everyone has realised that for certain careers uni is a must & that far more people go, so i'm not sure that these events actually work.
it's impossible to have a system which allows for people with special circumstances, but doesn't thereby rule out someone else. there's examples of pupils getting 5 a grades at a level, but being refused a place at oxbrige - there is a limit on places & how do you decide which should get in?
pupil a - 3 grade c's but parents have no money & they've supported themselves thorugh a levels, or
pupil b - 2 bs & a c - private school education?

which child is more deserving & how do you decide?

Ah yes, thank you. Jedi knight My excuses for not knowing this are:

• we were living temporarily in Australia in 2001 where they also had a census that year (which we completed thereby messing up the possibility of tracing our family for future generations) but to my knowledge there wasn't that option

• I've never seen Star Wars, Close Encounters or Lord of the Rings, etc.

The problem is that because A levels are so easy there is no other way to discriminate. Ideally they should be taking the person who would benefit most from the university place, regardless of background. However if you have exams which don't give you a chance to show ability it's hard to work out who that would be.

There's a lot more to it than just knowing if your parents went to university. Certain grades will still be required. At over-scubscribed universities, they will then look at other factors such as school education and parents' education.

This is certainly how it was all to be when I worked at a russell group university a couple of years ago.

I think it's fair enough.

I don't like it.

BUT I can see a pattern at Uni- all the kids seem to be from middle class famillies whereas us amture students are from W/C backgorunds (I know my Uni isnt quite representative btw). So I wonder how many of us would have done it at 18 (and therefore had a much more professional first 20 years) if we'd born into a M/C family, or at least one where there was a history of Uni?

FWIW I was desperate to go to Uni at 18, but Dad wanted me to go work in a factory (I didn't, but didn't get to go to Uni either). Sister went and lasted 18 months, due to finances.

So whilst i don't think its on at selection, i think for student retention it has a value if they know the history- support etc

You know what? It makes me really regret having been the first person in my family to have gone to university. I am sure that this is going to disadvantage my own children.

I really don't think it will disadvantage my children at all. (and me and siblings were first in ours)

Well I do. There is no other point at all in knowing otherwise.