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mothers with young children are the most discriminated against at work

436 replies

paddingtonbear1 · 28/02/2007 09:48

I haven't actually found this in my company, and it's very small - only 18 employees. But I can imagine if I looked for another job, I might find it hard to get one, being a mother still under 40. I couldn't believe some of the comments in the 'have your say' on the bbc website though - most people seem to think that women who can't afford to stay at home shouldn't have kids at all! That would be me then! I don't think in this day and age, with mortgages and other rising costs, that's practical. I don't take advantage though, fortunately dd isn't sick very often, and dh does his share.
I think most of the people making the comments were men, or people with no kids...

OP posts:
funkimummy · 06/03/2007 16:34

I'm a WAHM. I regularly prostitute myself by cleaning the house though. It's either that or suffer with chronic eczema!

I don't have any 'staff' either

VeniVidiVickiQV · 06/03/2007 16:46

Xenia, a great deal of your argument is based on your assumptions about what certain large groups of people in society are like, and often working from stereotypes.

I think it is great for a person to have a job that interests them, but, to say that men prefer women with interesting jobs.....I dont think so. They'd prefer someone who was interesting, or funny, or beautiful, or sexy, or caring, or possibly rich , but not for the interesting job. No. That's plain weird actually.

Judy1234 · 06/03/2007 16:59

Yes, but all the time government try to do that forcing by subtle means either by putting out propaganda that women at work harm their children or by saying your benefits will be stopped if you don't work or whatever the Government's then current plan might be.

Of course men prefer working wives - they dress up, look smart, tend not to put on so much weight, have more money and have a fascinating day to talk about....

paulaplumpbottom · 06/03/2007 17:04

I think I have explained this to you before but obviously with all of your hard work you can't retain everything.

SAHMs don't let themselves go, I put on my makeup and dress nice every day. I also have plenty of interesting things to chat to DH about.

funkimummy · 06/03/2007 17:07

Xenia,

I think you're information is somewhat warped there. You are obviously blinkered, bigoted and opinionated.

VeniVidiVickiQV · 06/03/2007 17:11

Cliche!

jellybeans · 06/03/2007 17:44

I keep hearing '4/5 women mothers of under 5s work,' but around me there are very few of them, I am not sure that these statistics give an accurate picture of everywhere, statistics can be very skewed. Most of the mums in my DS's reception class are SAHM's even if (shock horror!) they have no younger child at home. LOL at some of the extreme views on this thread and the mass generalisations and people feeling they need to be an employee to have value to society, maybe they are just another cog in the wheel?

mishw · 06/03/2007 19:24

ARRRRGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my god - I still can't believe you Xenia, you are sounding more and more pompous as the posts go on. How dare you tell any person what is right for them whether it is a woman or a man.

My grandmother once asked my parents what they wanted me to be when I grew up and they answered 'happy', they didn't care what I did as long as I did it well and was happy. Well you know what I am happy, I don't think I'm better off but I feel my family are better off than me going off to a job that is paid very little and is quite stresfull and being quite grumpy at home. Can you say the same for your children. Earlier on someone asked you what you would do if your DD wanted to be a stay at home Mum, what about if they went into the childcare sector or any other poorly paid job - would you be happy or do you think that the only worthwhile job is one that is paid well and enables you to hire help and pass over your responsibilities to someone else?

And I think you'll find that most men would prefer a woman who is happy whether that is going out to work or staying at home. You obviously have very warped ideas maybe from your own experiences.

paulaplumpbottom · 06/03/2007 19:29

She isn't even married, I doubt she knows what our DHs want

Judy1234 · 06/03/2007 20:23

I'm not certainly not very well qualified in keeping men happy, that's true.

Anna8888 · 06/03/2007 20:46

Well then stop having so many opinions about what men want from women. My partner's ex is a marketing director, used to be in toothpaste, now she's in windscreens. Interesting? Glamorous? Sexy? Don't think so. I'm a former consultant and academic researcher (which I can go back to anytime, the market for executive education and consultants is huge) and can talk to my partner about business at his level (he's CEO of a retail company) which his ex just couldn't do.

But of course, that's not the mainstay of our relationship. We find each other attractive, fun, stimulating, do loads together and have great sex... (oh, and Xenia, work clothes just aren't sexy, I love being at home so that I can at last dress up).

Judy1234 · 06/03/2007 21:05

Well the sex wears off and if you then have a model of mother at home whose principal interest is the child and domestic things you get a bigger and bigger gulf between the woman and the man, whereas if they have interesting work stories to exchange the relationship tends to be better.

robbosmum · 06/03/2007 21:23

i would like to think that i am more than work!!!! my dh loves me cos i have a great sense of humour, i am fun to be with, i would have these whether i worked or not, incidentally i vwork and am a little bit porkier than i would like

Zog · 06/03/2007 21:27

Haven't read whole thread but just read this article - interesting, especially the recruitment company

Tortington · 06/03/2007 21:43

the sex doesn't always wear off.

some men even respect the job their partners are doing in the home, equally some women respect the job men do in the home.

still theres no choice for some people. and interesting jobs are few and far between - then theres the people who, becuase of the society in which we live have no CHOICE but to work - most i would wager uninteresting jobs.

Judy1234 · 06/03/2007 22:24

Zog, I read that today and my heart sinks. Yet another article suggesting all working women want is short hours and flexible working. Some women want to do proper jobs and succed at them. Yet all these articesl always say there is only one thing women with women want and that is not to do the full job. No wonder employers have the wrong idea. We need some headlines - women want longer hours because they want their men home first and in the kitchen and Women strike to be the principal wage earner; or More men than women request flexible working for child care reasons etc etc.

mishw · 06/03/2007 22:38

Wow - you're right Xenia, that's so unfair, there is someone out there lumping all working women into one group, you'd never catch someone on here doing that with any other group of people (like sahm for instance) would you!

paulaplumpbottom · 06/03/2007 22:39

Oh dear you mean they are stereotyping?

chipmonkey · 06/03/2007 22:54

Actually, as a working mum I find it very hard to look decent. I have often unwittingly gone to work with a lovely big dollop of baby-sick on my black jacket! And I'm often too tired for sex.

Judy1234 · 07/03/2007 08:07

Yes, how often do you see an article saying women want to do the job there is and they have organised childcare and don't want to work part time? I don't think apart from what I've written I've ever seen that and yet vast swathes of women are quite content to work in normal jobs and aren't acheing to spend 5 hours a day covered in baby sick and they're more than grateful for proper full time work on normal terms.

Tortington · 07/03/2007 08:11

piss orf - why the fuck would i want longer hours for eff all pay? jesus.

Tortington · 07/03/2007 08:19

you have taken on speaking for working woman kind - xenia the voice of the working woman - when thats truly rubbish - your assertions are just rubbish.

i work full time - have done work hard - going no where in my career becuase - i dont play golf - where they slapp each others balls. - i am planning to re-train and circumnavigate this.

HOWEVER - a big HOWEVER, what comes first - job or kids?

kids

for men - some think like that - but equally ask them to chose between career and family - and 'large swathes' would chose career.

whereas i bet my arse - most women think that the job is topay the bills, but the kids come first.

why then would we want longer hours - why compete with men on their terms?

i think you will find that the best way forward is to make them compete on ours.

not longer hours, not ball slapping, but a country who accepts that children come first - families come first.

Judy1234 · 07/03/2007 08:32

c, lots of women do, even mothers and want that and their position is never shown so employers believe they are all wanting to cut back their hours and hence thread topics like this arise. If employers knew many working mothers aren't after shorter hours but instead want to be the best worker in the company earning the highest salary in charge of everyone else etc then we might get a better press.

Anna8888 · 07/03/2007 08:56

Xenia, OK, YOU wanted to work full-time when your children were little and you seem to think that the only interests one can have in life are either children and home OR work. Well, in fact, one can have plenty of other interests outside one's family and work. But of course, you started your family very young and you probably felt very hemmed in by it. I had my daughter aged 38, and before that I'd seen the world, lived and worked in many countries, I have friends all over the place (who I talk to and see regularly) and generally get up to lots of things and continue to do so. If I worked full-time I wouldn't know my children (and, from your comments, you don't seem to have a clue about what KNOWING one's children means) and my relationship with my partner would be going nowhere fast because I'd be too knackered to do the work necessary to keep our life moving forwards.

Stop trying to force your extremely dull life model down everyone else's throat and get an imagination.

HaHaBizarre · 07/03/2007 09:34

Quote Custardo "whereas i bet my arse - most women think that the job is topay the bills, but the kids come first.

why then would we want longer hours - why compete with men on their terms?

i think you will find that the best way forward is to make them compete on ours.

not longer hours, not ball slapping, but a country who accepts that children come first - families come first."

Excellently put.

Why are employers getting away with people working unpaid extra hours? Why is that the norm? Why does our time only become precious to us after we have children? Why isn't over-time paid to those who work beyond their 40 hours. That way, those who have more time on their hands could earn some extra cash. Those who are time-poor (often parents or carers) wouldn't have to feel guilty for working their contracted hours.

Why aren't employers employing more people to cover the work if a job cannot be done in 40 hours by one person? How can it be that every job takes exactly 40 hours (or more) to be done well? What's wrong with an employer forming a job that equates to 30 hours of work per week?