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Camber sands tragedy

229 replies

bibbitybobbityyhat · 25/08/2016 11:41

What on earth has happened at Camber Sands? Are there insufficient life guards or something? I am not prone to hysteria but I would not be going to that beach anytime soon. Such a terrible event, somewhat buried by other news yesterday and the string of drownings in the last week.

OP posts:
TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 11:10

Bobo that is unfair. I live by the sea and have visited many beaches in the camber sands area. I am fully aware of the dangers presented by the sea and exercise obsessive caution. However the reason i found this situation so upsetting as when we recently visited camber i was taken by surprise by the sheer speed that the tide came in. Luckily for us it was just a case of grabbing our towels and moving up the beach.

There are multiple holiday parks at camber and have been for as long as i can remember, so hardly rural. The beach was PACKED and lifeguards would be pissing in the wind trying to keep everyone safe.

I did not see any obvious sinage re dangers specific to the area. Most people are pretty responsible around the sea but i would have listed camber as a safe LOOKING beach from my visit.

We wont return as i wouldn't feel safe with dd swimming in the sea.

We have lifeguards on a section of our beach however we don't use that particular area as we take responsibility for our own safety. I am obsessional about staying in depth and avoiding areas i know (through local knowledge) to be hazzardous.

Bobochic · 26/08/2016 11:11

motherducker - education about how to use the sea properly ought to be embedded in our education system, IMVHO. An island nation where transport to the beach is accessible to anyone needs to prepare its DC for all eventualities at the coast.

TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 11:12

also remember that most lifeguards and the rnli are manned by volunteers.

Bobochic · 26/08/2016 11:14

Of course Camber is rural! The fact that there is some tourist infrastructure there doesn't mean there is no large town nearby to bear the costs of policing occasional hordes. It's not Brighton.

TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 11:16

no but it felt busier!!

i do totally agree with you re safety in the sea though. water safety in general is preetty much lacking in our education system. That needs to be addressed.

ingeniousidiot · 26/08/2016 11:16

Our local beach has small sections that have lifeguards - we only go in the sea when the tide is coming in and within the flagged area. I always take a beach chair down to the waters edge and watch my kids from there - 11&9 and very good swimmers (galas etc). I'm always amazed by the small size and lack of ability of some children left to their own devices as parents sit back up at the top of the beach (warmer and sheltered from the wind).
I think the lifeguards presence makes people lazy. I find it difficult to watch my two, even though they're told to stay together - I had a panic when one was missing - and they were only in about 2'6" water (he was walking towards me on the beach).
I'm scared of the sea - I can see it from my bedroom window - it's a killer.

DoinItFine · 26/08/2016 11:17

If a beach isn't safe for swimming I would expect warning signs in a first world country!

Agreed.

Although someone upthread said there were flags. Which is weird, because unless it is always a red flag, you couldn't put red and ywllow flags on a beach with no lifeguards, surely?

The worrying thing about this is that it is doubtful that they were swimming. They might have just gone for a walk out too far.

How could anyone unfamiliar with the area anticipate that?

KoalaDownUnder · 26/08/2016 11:29

Apparently they had gone out to a sandbar to play football, when the tide came in.

The father of two of the young men has been quoted as saying 'Neither of my boys could swim'.

It's so very sad, but it's also shocking that people who can't swim would head out onto a sandbar like that.

It demonstrates a real lack of understanding of, and respect for, the sea.

ElleBellyBeeblebrox · 26/08/2016 11:34

The last day we were there the orange flag was up, and clear signs saying "NO INFLATABLES". I couldn't have counted the number of dinghys, rubber rings, lilos etc that we saw.

DoinItFine · 26/08/2016 11:34

It demonstrates an understandable lack of understanding of a particularb kind of beach from very young men from a huge city not by the sea.

I had lived by the sea all my life, but the speed with which the tide comes in at Camber is surprising to me. I am familar with flat beaches of that type, but there are variatiojs specific to that location that I think would have taken me by surprise.

Football on a sandbar on a sunny day :(

What a lovely thing to do.

But way too dangerous.

RIP

DoinItFine · 26/08/2016 11:36

Anyone who takes inflatables into the sea really is making an obviously poor decision.

Unless they think they are in a giant sandy swimming pool.

Pangurban1 · 26/08/2016 11:42

I always thought you knew if there is a lifeguard at a beach 'cos they put the flags up. Safest between the red and yellow flags.

A loss of life is tragic. The sea is treacherous and a graveyard to many. We have to take some personal responsibility and sensible precautions to keep ourselves and our children as safe as we can.

Maybe a sign outlining the danger of rip currents at beaches. And to keep an eye out for the tide coming in.

TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 11:45

i disagree koala - it would appear perfectly safe for me to do this if i was unaware of the speed of the tide. The tide goes out a long way in camber, much further than our beach which takes six hours to come in/go out. So i eould have assumed plenty of time.

When at camber i sent Dp to get something from the car. five minutes walk if that. The tide was OUT. thought we'd found a spot to spend the afternoon on the edge of the sand. By the time he returned we had had toove a significant distance up the beach amid mich mirth panicing to grab the bucket and spades! FIVE MINUTES! !!!

motherducker · 26/08/2016 11:48

- education about how to use the sea properly ought to be embedded in our education system, IMVHO

I agree, which makes all these comments re the boys being somehow partly to blame all the more infuriating, how were they to know?

TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 11:51

totally agree motherfucker. its victim blaming.

This was a tragic accident, no more than that.

KoalaDownUnder · 26/08/2016 12:01

It is not victim blaming at all.

Nobody is 'blaming' them for dying a horrible, premature death. That's a terrible thing to say.

People who can't swim should stay close to the land, and not head out to sand bars.

It is possible for something to be a 'tragic accident' and for there also to be human error involved.

specialsubject · 26/08/2016 12:07

this is very, very sad. All the more so because it was avoidable. Someone says 'how were they to know?' but there's plenty of information on sea safety about. And if some of them couldn't swim (if that is the case) they should not have been in the sea.

if people want lifeguards, they need to be paid for. That means an admission fee for the beach. With 25000 people there on a busy day, how many lifeguards would be needed? Not practical.

While the family are understandably devastated, blocking off the beach for everyone else doesn't help.

BTW for the person asking about the Med - it has virtually no tide so the problem of suddenly changing water level doesn't arise.

MrsSparkles · 26/08/2016 12:16

Most of the beaches near me (East Kent) have lifeguards - I believe its a requirement for a blue flag. I'm really surprised there aren't any at Camber, not that people seem to observe swimming between the flags anyway.

I don't always (in my local beaches) but have grown up by the sea, so know them well. would never dream of it in a beach I don't know. I've seen THE RNLI saying it would be impossible to save everyone, especially when they swim outside the flags but expect to be rescued anyway.

vv sad though and a unnecessary waste.

DoinItFine · 26/08/2016 12:22

People who can't swim should stay close to the land, and not head out to sand bars.

They were not only close to the land, they were on the land.

You can be on Camber Sands beach and not even be able to see the sea.

Being caught out by the tide on an enormous, flat beach is not something most people would consider likely.

Although I agree it is not victim blaming to point out human error in relation to the natural world, I think these lads were very unlucky and that the dangers would not have been obvious to most people.

KoalaDownUnder · 26/08/2016 13:14

No, the mainland. The seafront, with shops and buildings and car parks on it. The part which is never encroached upon by water, as it has permanent structures on it.

That is the part you need to stay on if you cannot swim. The other part can quickly become 'not-land'.

This is what people need to be educated about.

Lweji · 26/08/2016 13:23

They were not only close to the land, they were on the land.

As KoalaDownUnder says.

They were on wet sand. That is not land. That is a surface that will be under water.

And at certain times, during the month and the year, the tide rises more than the day before. Sometimes quite a bit more, particularly if there are bigger waves. It gets worse in flat beaches, as a 1 cm rise could be several meters of surface under water. That's just a few minutes.

The problem with all this is that it takes experience that most people never acquire. Or will forget if just given lessons about it.
There will always be sad deaths like these. Sad

TheoriginalLEM · 26/08/2016 13:23

Koala that is a fair point but on my visit to camber i didn't see a sign saying how quickly the tide comes in. it looks completely flat and i imagine that the sand bars are quiet subtle.

i have just heard on the news that there will ne lifeguards on camber sands this weekend. RNLI VOLUNTEERS!

DoinItFine · 26/08/2016 13:31

The seafront, with shops and buildings and car parks on it. The part which is never encroached upon by water, as it has permanent structures on it.

You are seriousky arguing that people who can't swim should never go to the beach??

SeaEagleFeather · 26/08/2016 13:43

I wonder if some tv public safety adverts with safety info would help. I suspect quite a lot of people simply don't know the sea can be dangerous and beaches can be treacherous. Especially if they come from land-locked countries.

Some people might skip the ads, but at least the info is out there and some of it might seep in.

Peregrina · 26/08/2016 13:50

I don't watch TV all that much, but I went to the cinema at the weekend and there was a big RNLI safety advert. People probably think that getting into difficulty in the water won't happen to them. According to the RNLI a significant number who need rescuing aren't swimming or in water, they e.g. get swept into the water by rogue waves.