Burkini banned in France

[LifeIsGoodish]

Instead of teaching people to behave with respect to each other.

Burkini banned in France

For those saying well if it's a choice then they can just choose not to wear it. Well why should they?

Maybe because, in these difficult times, it might improve community cohesion? There may or may not be a place for teenage-style petulance, but somehow I don't think this is it

'diversity' is an uneasy concept for humans and society's cohesion is best served without diversity

I'm reminded of an American friend who said "I question this thing about diversity - what I want to see is unity ...

Thankfully the French High Court has overruled the burkini ban. Vive la liberté!

"Diversity' seems to be artificial for humanity, as we see played out daily." Said the fascist.

I see it rather differently diversity is a gift for people and societies. Everyone benefits from the freedom to choose who you want to live and how you wish to dress.

Vive la France! I'm buying shares in a burkini company immediately.

I wonder if this will lead to other bans being challanged

Sadly this is good news for La Pen too

Go France! I'm very happy about this.

I hope no burkini wearers are made to feel unsafe, though, by people thinking they'r ebeing 'political' by harassing them!

I'd like to religion evolve out, I don't like it, I have been damaged by highly religious parents, who in turn were damaged by The Holocaust and it made them convert their religion and become deeply anti-semetic and made me utterly miserable in a very strict, frankly horrid home.

But taking it away, while would make me happy, would be wrong for millions. So, hopefully it'll 'evolve' away.

Basically anything is good for racists/misogynists/homophobes. they twist anything any way they want to.

I hope most French men people realise harassing Muslim women at the beach will change nothing WRT to terror attacks.

Yay.

Unfortunately only one town at a time, and in relation to the other towns, someone has to take them to court. Sigh.

If anything, such bans can only make people less safe, not more.

Thankfully the French High Court has overruled the burkini ban

And that's absolutely fair enough ... no need to throw bombs or burn flags, just do the democratic thing and present your case, accepting that if it has merit you may get your way and if it doesn't you may not

Two things I wonder about, however: will there be any appreciation of the availability of proper process from those who are so quick to damn France - and would there have been ready acceptance of the decision if it hadn't gone this way?

Sadly this is good news for La Pen too

Yes, I agree - the very last thing we need is extremism piled on extremism

And if reports that the majority of the French support the ban are true, maybe that will increase Le Pen's chances

"Diversity' seems to be artificial for humanity, as we see played out daily." Said the fascist.

Sigh. Oh, well. If you are determined to misunderstand and misrepresent.

I'm reminded of an American friend who said "I question this thing about diversity - what I want to see is unity ...

This is so obvious that I'm afraid that it's under the radar for many. Let's keep plugging away.

*MrsTerry&
"'m buying shares in a burkini company immediately."
Are you serious?

If yes, could you please talk me through how this is done or pm me? I have never bought shares but would like to buys shares in the BUrkini industry.

I'm reminded of an American friend who said "I question this thing about diversity - what I want to see is unity And who gets to decide what this unity looks like, how is it enforced, how is free will and creativity curbed so that 'unity' is upheld? Four interestingly your politics are more in line with extremist Islamic ideas, after all ISIS want unity not diversity.

I was joking but it's one I think Australian women who markets a lot of them!

The US has a melting pot and Canada has a mosaic. I vastly prefer the latter. Assimilation is overrated.

Pretty, "I cannot see why anyone would wear a banned garment unless it was a political statement or protest."

I'd wear a burkini in a heartbeat. Have been keen since Nigella (but hers had a good peak to keep sun off face; I'd fold hood thing down to swim). I'm not albino, but have very fair, type 1 skin. The slight looseness gives extra uv resistant material to increase protection.

I suppose a loose swim tights with loose rash vest with soft peaky cap I could shove into my waistband if swimming in the water.

Thing is this whole debacle has made it more like Pretty said. The garment itself is a good idea for people who are in danger of burning. It has an actual protective function. It is not comparable with a burqua or that thing the taliban had with a little mesh to see through and the aim of which is to conceal and there was no peripheral vision. It also does not impede movement or hinder the wearer.

Yasmin Alibhai-Brown is interesting on this subject. She seems sceptical about how this level of covering for women has increasingly come into the religion and showcased as a extra virtuous thing and it is only newly a necessity to women from areas that did not cover themselves up to this level before. I suppose it is the fact that it has been parachuted in as part of the religion, whereas it was really a thing in existence among certain tribes before the religion was created. So it is simply a tribal practice rather than a religious necessity.

Don't explain that so well. All rough paraphrasing.

For most people, serious swimming or practice is carried out at a pool anyway. Even triathlon training is carried out in pools, away from leptospirosis.

They could do burkinis out like national flags. Like Scary Spice and her union flag dress.

You could have a tricolore burkini to make it look more friendly. Stars and stripes?

Four interestingly your politics are more in line with extremist Islamic ideas, after all ISIS want unity not diversity.

Well, I'm not entirely sure how I can live alongside someone who routinely practices something that I completely and utterly disagree with. That seems to be the case for everybody though, doesn't it? After all, even liberalism doesn't actually mean 'Do what you like', as seems to have been misinterpreted by many. Liberalism does expect people to toe the line along certain aspects of belief and action - equality, STEM, secularism, human rights, as well as many other things. Religion is frowned upon by Liberal societies because it's based on lies and is not debatable with as every other idea might be. As long as we are all on the same page with respect to these things, then that's brilliant. You don't seriously believe that 'diversity' actually means 'anything goes', do you?

Liberalism, tolerance and pluralism are incredibly important concepts. They don't actually mean 'do what you like'. We are bound by the rule of law and a social contract. Individual beliefs are respected and tolerated - as long as they don't encroach on public life and are within the rule of law. I'm not sure where the confusion, that anyone can do what they fancy wherever and whenever they want comes from.

Religion is frowned upon by Liberal societies because it's based on lies and is not debatable with as every other idea might be.

Not true in the UK. I'd say we are a pretty liberal society, but few people are vehemently anti-religion. Speaking as an atheist, I don't think I'm at all unusual to feel pretty indifferent to other people's religious beliefs - as long as religion doesn't infringe my liberty, different strokes for different folks. I can certainly see that religion has many, many positives.

I would not want to live in a country where religion infringed on my liberties like Dubai or Saudi Arabia, but I wouldn't be happier in a secular state that sought to suppress religion.

I think diversity is unavoidable because people are different. I also probably have more in common with people who share my background (people who lived on the street where I grew up, people I went to school with, people I work with) and happen to be Muslim/Hindu/Christian than people living a completely different lifestyle in a completely different part of the UK.

I certainly have a lot in common with anybody who counts the days till they can feel the sand between their toes and run into the sea, whatever they are wearing.

I was only saying this morning "Vive la difference" and then realised that the French of course gave us that phrase. So they haven't always been so into uniformity.

I love diversity, but surely we are all different? I haven't yet found a country, religion or group of people all like me, not even in my family.

"Individual beliefs are respected and tolerated - as long as they don't encroach on public life and are within the rule of law." Which is why the burkini is absolutely fine to wear.

I don't support any ban on clothing, or on ideas. I firmly believe that education is the only way to improve societies. Banning things never seems to work.

I love diversity too, or rather the idea of it, but we need uniformity more for social cohesion. Otherwise, diversity asks people to ignore some things that they can never reconcile, which clearly leads to many problems. That is why we need an overarching umbrella such as conformity to the rule of law, conformity to similar education systems, health beliefs, etc.. Society can't work otherwise. If everyone does what they want, it's anarchy. It shouldn't really be a problem anyway. Liberalism asks people to comply with secularism (bring your kids up with religion at home but not outside of home), scientific and technological ideals, an overarching legal system, a certain education system, certain dress, appearance and behaviour codes and in return they receive individual respect, equality in their humanity before the law, little or no State intervention in their lives, the possibility of family progression (your kids are not perpetually stuck at a certain level as in, for example, the caste system), and other goodies. I can't really see why we should be having the difficulties that we are - what's not to like and comply with?

I'd say we are a pretty liberal society, but few people are vehemently anti-religion. - I'd say we are only a few mass murders away , as are many countries. Patience for accepting violent religions is wafer thin.