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Is it wrong to wear fur?

274 replies

fortyplus · 12/12/2006 08:47

I have launched a fairly venomous attack on Xenia, glibly implying that 10,000 of you will agree with me. Here are some 'edited highlights' of what started it...

By Xenia on Sunday, 10 December, 2006 8:45:30 ...The girls have a huge range of interests (including intimate knowledge of London nightclubs.. I think one got into conversation with a famous chef at ChinaWhite one night when he ought to have been dealing with his children and being with his wife, rather than chatting up pretty blondes wearing fur?.)

By aliceband on Sunday, 10 December, 2006 8:55:19 PM
wearing fur?

By Xenia on Sunday, 10 December, 2006 9:00:13
Fur... of course. Surely from my posts you could tell my family would wear fur? 160,000 vicunas now roam Peru I think it is because they had been dying out but then were farmed for their fur. It saved the species and yet Blair bans fur farming. There is no hope but thankfully the planet is big and the world our oyster.
Did you mean I wasn't clear on fur ro you think we can wear leather shoes and murder plants but not something that looks sweet and fluffy (unless it's a calf in which case then it's okay to kill it but only if the skin is a by-product even though we no more need to eat meat than we need to wear skins)? Thankfully a week today I will be somewhere amongst many fur wearers and away from the warped collective British conscience.
By Queenmummy on Monday, 11 December, 2006 3:25:09 PMOne of these days Xenia will disappear up her own a**e and suffocate herself (hopefully before she bores us all to tears with the one track argument we are all fed up with listening to. Xenia - if you really are a well-rounded and interesting person, how about talking about something new besides than this dull and done to death SAHM/WOHM thing......

By fortyplus on Tuesday, 12 December, 2006 12:00:26 AM
I take back what I said about Xenia's views being to the left of Attila the Hun.

Abhorrence of the fur trade has nothing to do with whether animals look cute & fluffy, Xenia. It's all about the pain and suffering caused to the animals and stupid bitches wanting to look like prostitutes quite happy to wear the skin of a big cat that's been killed by having a red hot poker stuffed up its anus so as not to mark the skin.

You say that you've 'worked hard to fit in' with British society since coming to this country.

You haven't got a clue. Why do you think that out of 10,000 people on mumsnet the only one who consistently agrees with you is mohze?

Your smug, sanctimonious opinions are despised by every apparently decent person on this site.

OP posts:
gothicsanta · 12/12/2006 08:49

Not wishing to get involved in any attacks on other mumsnetter But wearing Fur is in my opinion wrong, and unnesscecary (sp?)

fortyplus · 12/12/2006 08:49

And just in case you missed it...
'you think we can wear leather shoes and murder plants but not something that looks sweet and fluffy '

So killing an animal for its fur is no different to 'murdering' a cabbage in Xenia's eyes.

What is that woman on?

OP posts:
edam · 12/12/2006 08:50


fortyplus · 12/12/2006 08:52

gothicsanta - I usually feel extremely uncomfortable about personal attacks. I often question others' beliefs without decrying them. But Xenia has posted so much vitriol on mn that I make an exception in her case!

OP posts:
ParanoidSurreyHousewife · 12/12/2006 08:52

If you want a debate, then have a debate. But I can't see what place "a vemonous attack" has on Mumsnet? Sorry, but this doesn't seem worthy of this site.

trying2bgood · 12/12/2006 08:52

I would never wear fur, or leather (i hate the smell of it).

GlennCloseAsCruellaDeVille · 12/12/2006 08:53

I saw the comment but assumed it was put there to add to the long list of don't we know rather too much about Xenia as she thinks we secretly admire her lifestyle

and to be provocative

so my first thought was mention it and my second was ignore it

Earthymama · 12/12/2006 08:53

Wearing fur is wrong and indefensible. We should all be campaigning actively against it.

PS Don't know much about SAHM/WOHM issues, but Xenia sounds as though she's living in the wrong place and isn't happy here?

GlennCloseAsCruellaDeVille · 12/12/2006 08:54

butby all means have a discussion without the xenia angle

ParanoidSurreyHousewife · 12/12/2006 08:55

Can we start this as a different thread then?

mateychops · 12/12/2006 08:58

Of course it's wrong to wear fur. That's a no-brainer. And I defend your right to say that to any individual on mn, or any other forum, real life, through the press, anywhere. I'd be second in line, backing you up on that.

But is it not a sweeping statement to say that Xenia has posted so much vitriol? I don't agree with her fur statement, and a lot of her postings are controversial, but I find her interesting.

GlennCloseAsCruellaDeVille · 12/12/2006 09:06

the fashion industry is notoriously fickle all the high end models who signed up to the anti fur campaign are now wearing fur except one I think

it is not the same as a humanely raised animal by product.

Fur farms are terrible places and the practices involved are extremely nasty.

Fur is big business and sales in the last few years have rocketed

Hopefully seal skins will soon be a banned import here

I wish they all were

mateychops · 12/12/2006 09:08

Right, so we're all agreed - let's have a sensible debate about fur, and take out the 'X'-factor? (I'm in a happy mood today, and want to stay all Christmassy)

fortyplus · 12/12/2006 09:11

I suppose if I'm honest I launched into Xenia because she doesn't hold back with her own opinions (state schools are crap/sahm are wasting their lives etc) and I wouldn't imagine for one moment that she will be hurt by what I've said.
I find her interesting, too, mainly because she had stated that she is a 'tolerant' person, holds herself up as some kind of role model, yet she spends many hours on mn and has recently admitted that her own 19 year marriage was very unhappy and that her ex has no contact with the family.
I don't think an 'Is it wrong to wear fur' thread has much relevance if it doesn't start with strongly opposing views. I'm sure Xenia can cope!

OP posts:
GlennCloseAsCruellaDeVille · 12/12/2006 09:14

she will be drawn to it anyway..excvept i think she has gone on her hols for Xmas

to Russia, Italy, new York?? Japan?

ParanoidSurreyHousewife · 12/12/2006 09:17

"Your smug, sanctimonious opinions are despised by every apparently decent person on this site."

But that isn't really an invite for a debate is it? That is an unpleasant attack on one poster. Has she made an equivalent attack on you? She may have views that you disagree with, but I've missed any specific attacks that she has made on individual MNers.

I'm sure that I don't agree with Xenia, or Cod or Soapy or Oliveoil say on every matter, but please don't imply that you've got my support in attacking any individual (esp if the said individual happens to be a lawyer).

If you want to debate the point, please start a different thread. Most people will read the OP.

mateychops · 12/12/2006 09:20

Fortyplus, fair enough. I've been on some threads with you, and you've got a sensible head on you. I always just recoil when I see a thread that can turn into a mud-slinging match by others.

Don't think there is much of a debate about fur to be had; it's wrong, full stop.

fortyplus · 12/12/2006 09:23

No - she certainly hasn't attacked me personally. Her comments re: fluffy animals & murdering plants made my blood boil, which was why I posted what I did.
Then this morning the more reasonable side of my nature (which is 99.9% of me, I promise) questioned the fact that I had made the assumption that everyone else on mn would agree with me about her attitude - not that they would necessarily think that I was right to make the personal comments about her.
In fact - despite her controversial views - she is usually extremely dignified.

OP posts:
fortyplus · 12/12/2006 09:24

mateychops - you're right, of course!

OP posts:
GlennCloseAsCruellaDeVille · 12/12/2006 09:25

I imagine that there are fur wearers on mn

DominiConnor · 12/12/2006 09:26

I don't see any real diference between wearing fur and eating meat. You can of course take the position that both are wrong, or both are right, but I don't see how you can pick and mix.
One needs a variety of nutrients that can only sensibly be acquired from animlals but eggs and milk will do fine. We really don't need to eat beef steaks, and we aren't even well evolved to do so without risking our health.

So although I don't have a problem with those who are vegetarian in both food and clothes, I do find the attitude of anti-fur campaigners are essentially snide posturing.
They are quite happy to attack women who wear fur, but I don't see them giving grief to bikers in leather jackets which are of course essentially the same thing.

mateychops · 12/12/2006 09:26

Cruella, are you still after the dalmations?


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expatinscotland · 12/12/2006 09:26

Wear fur or buy fur?

My mother has some antique fur pieces handed down to her from her mother.

Would I buy it new if I had all the money of Bill Gates?

Not a chance.

Judy1234 · 12/12/2006 09:27

Of course it's right to wear fur. It's a no brainer. MN is a very limited group of people. Obviously fur wearers don't want animals to suffer and try to ensure it is bought from a source where there is no suffering just like when you lot buy your eggs if you can afford it you may go for free range.

So what other arguments do you have against fur apart from suffering? We can easily remove suffering from it.

mateychops · 12/12/2006 09:28

Domini, I would beg to differ. I'm a meat eater, pro-testing on medical grounds, but the only animal that looks dumb wearing fur is the daft tart under it. There's a reason to eat meat, there's a reason for medical testing, but there's nothing but vanity makes a woman wear fur.

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