Mass shooting in my state

[Terramirabilis]

Another mass shooting in the US and this one is close to home. Local media are saying 13 students dead and 20+ injured. When are people going to see sense on gun control. I just don't understand this.

twitter.com/hashtag/UCCShooting?src=hash

"if the will is there it CAN be done."

So as it hasn't been changed that would suggest the will isn't there to do it. The constitution was deliberately designed to be able to change, but not easily. That's to prevent any government easily altering it to suit them, but leaving the door open for it to be changed if there is huge overwhelming desire to change it. And currently I don't think the desire is there to do so.

I'm not convinced the desire isn't there in the people. But sadly it's the govt that lacks the desire to lose the financial support of gun manufacturers.

There is plenty grassroots support for the 2nd amendment and many are pro gun, but you're right undoubtedly money plays a part in this as it always has.

Proof that capitalism only works for the wealthy.

So what are you saying, we should abolish capitalism?

Personally I would. It doesn't work, several economists and financial people I know think so too.

Not sure how great a factor money plays in this though. It's definitely involved on both sides, but there is also genuine support for both sides of the argument among Americans, and the constitution was designed so that it could only really be changed if there was massive overwhelming support for change, not a country divided on an issue.

Obama can't pass gun control laws because he doesn't have control of Congress. Simple as. In fact, he has difficulty passing any laws because he doesn't have control of Congress.

The Gun Lobby/NRA is a powerful force in the US.

Yep, they are quite popular and have been fighting their corner for a while.

And that's exactly why America are tolerating school shootings.

So - do you advocate having loaded guns in your bedside table - where your kids can easily pick it up and shoot someone. Or do you have them locked away "safely" where you're unlikely to be get at them in the event of of an armed robbery in the middle of the night? It's a conundrum to be sure. A conundrum that only exists with a proliferation of gun ownership.

Which is why it's great to be in the UK.

No one is "tolerating" school shootings, no one wants them to happen. Both sides of the gun debate agree on the fact that they don't want people to be murdered, they just have different opinions on how to try keeping people safe.

I absolutely advocate having a gun by your bedside table, but I also advocate that you should be responsible with it, make it so your kids can't easily get at them. Maybe for you that means having a lock on your bedroom door, or maybe it means doing something else. Whatever it is you do have to have responsibility in making sure that kids who shouldn't handle a gun don't get to.

America is tolerating school shootings - because they won't give up their right to gun ownership, despite the mass shootings, including children as young as five, that just happen to be attending school that day, that devastate their communities.

If you look at it like that then giving up their right to gun ownership would mean they were "tolerating" all the resulting deaths happening because people didn't have a weapon to protect themselves. So from that point of view no matter what happens they will always be tolerating murders.

I absolutely advocate having a gun by your bedside table

OK. There's a Darwin award to the man who also had a loaded gun on his bedside table. The phone rang in the middle of the night. He picked up the gun, instead of the phone, and blew his brains out.. Such is the trigger-happy nature of people who keep guns by their bedside.

I didn't see the news report about that man, so can't comment on his circumstances or his storage setup.

How many American citizens have been killed by the lack of loaded guns on their bedside table? How many have been killed - by accident/misadventure/suicide from the ready availability of a loaded gun on a bedside table.

I'm pretty sure most US parents don't have a lock on the outside of their bedroom door, to lock their children away from a loaded gun in there.

On the other side of the coin, how many American citizens have been killed because they lacked the ability to protect themselves? I'm pretty sure that most responsible parents who have guns in the house will have considered how best to keep it away from any children who are not yet responsible enough to handle them. I can ask my mate next time I'm talking to him to try and get a few actual examples if you'd like.

And even if they did have a lock on the outside of their bedroom door to prevent loaded-gun-on-bedside-table mishaps - what if they're in the kitchen when they're house is invaded by murderous marauders?

Unless you're prepared to have a holstered, loaded gun on your person the whole time - even in the shower - you're never going to be safe from the statistically rare risk you are fearing.

Darwin Award Nominees

NOMINEE No. 3: [Hickory Daily Record] Ken Charles Barger, 47, accidentally shot himself to death in December in Newton, N.C. Awakening to the sound of a ringing telephone beside his bed, he reached for the phone but grabbed instead a Smith & Wesson .38 Special, which discharged when he drew it to his ear.

As you're talking about complete safety you're right you can't ever be completely safe, not even if you take your gun into the shower. It comes down to getting a balance right. You are right they might not get to their gun if the house was invaded, but at least they have a chance. At least with a gun somewhere in the house they are only possibly going to end up unarmed in an invasion, whereas if they have no gun they will definitely be unarmed. Having a gun can give you a fighting chance not complete safety.

"Ken Charles Barger, 47, accidentally shot himself to death in December in Newton, N.C. Awakening to the sound of a ringing telephone beside his bed, he reached for the phone but grabbed instead a Smith & Wesson .38 Special, which discharged when he drew it to his ear."

Oh dear not good at all. Must be quite rare though, I'd like to know that out of millions of gun owners how many have shot themselves like this.

"I'm pretty sure that most responsible parents who have guns in the house will have considered how best to keep it away from any children who are not yet responsible enough to handle them"

Do you imagine then, there are not many children wilfully or accidentally shooting people?

I don't know, I don't have any sources for the question you're asking.