Another young black person dies in police custody in the US

[Floundering]

Sandra Bland, a university graduate who had just moved back to South Carolina to work in her old University.

She forgot to signal when changing lanes whilst driving her car & was pulled over. The police officer went OTT and pulled her out of the car & (it seems from heavily edited footage from the police dashcam) had to restrain her.

She was then arrested and kept in jail for a minor traffic violation, and found dead in her cell allegedly having hanged herself.

This picture is her mugshot but may have been doctored after her death

She only pulled over quickly because the Officer tailgated her & she thought she should get out the way, & neglected to indicate.

That is SUCH a non issue that she should not even have been stopped. But having done so there were many points in the initial discussion at which the Officer could have terminated the conversation but no he escalated it leading to her death.

We may never know exactly how she met her untimely end but the whole sorry story started with this complete over reaction by someone who is supposed to be a professional.

mrsdevere I only say it is because well, I read quite a bit on it when there was a debate on reddit. I can't remember the exact places where it's the norm to say it but it was agreed upon. I don't think we as Brits should be so arrogant to assume the rest of the world follows our way of saying things really. I'm not saying I agree with the term btw, I'm just saying lets not all jump on that person when we don't know where they're from. In fact the Black Youth Project use the term too.

*She only pulled over quickly because the Officer tailgated her & she thought she should get out the way, & neglected to indicate.

That is SUCH a non issue that she should not even have been stopped*

She turned into the road (without indicating) the policeman turned and followed her, she moved over (without indicating) he stopped her. He was directly behind her for a matter of seconds tailgaiting?? he was about two car lengths away when she changed lanes! I worked with a child who has a steel plate in her head, her mothers car was ploughed into by someone who just changed lanes (no indicator, nothing). It is NOT a non-issue. She would regularly try to bang her head against the classroom floor to kill herself, she was 13. She had lifelong brain damage. I think her mother and the officers who had to deal with the scene and all the people who have ever worked with her would not share your view that not using an indicator is a non issue.

Back to the topic, I would be incredibly fearful if I were a black person in the US.

And this isn't even a recent thing is it. It's just us people who have the privilege of not having to experience it are now having our eyes opened more thanks to social media, more advanced video devices etc.

And how anyone can say there's no institutional racism, well...

What's your point exactly, grays? You don't know where puzzled is from so why not let her explain her own use of language?

I think my point is quite clear I was just saying that before we all have a go it's something to consider! Forgive me if this is unacceptable to you

"before we all have a go"

No one was "having a go".

What is your problem? I said before we all have a go. You were evidently unhappy with what they said so I just mentioned it was an accepted term in some parts. Can you lay off me now

In fact many US reputable sources use the term. Including the CDC. I'm sorry if you're so annoyed with me mentioning it.

Can I lay off you?

Not really, since I haven't been 'on' you

I'll reword that shall I, leave me alone and stop trying to create an argument from a innocent comment.

Given the track record it's not surprising that this death is attracting a lot of negative attention for the police and suspicion.

I always find it incredible when there is an insistence from some quarters that each case must be looked at by everyone in isolation, and any patterns ignored. This is very handy for people who want to perpetrate or brush aside crimes against certain groups.

The idea that the US police force (huge as it is) isn't institutionally racist is laughable. Maybe there are some branches, some areas even where they aren't, but across the board, it's recognised isn't it. And the stats around who is incarcerated, when, what happens to different sorts of people who commit the same crimes, it's all very stark.

I hope that the family and public get the truth around this but I don't hold out much hope.

Also, let's not forget that the UK police are unusually adept at killing black men. Thinking about the met here. Also found to be institutionally racist, officially, some years ago, and little evidence to show that anything has changed. Oh and they're corrupt & etc. The only good thing about our lot is they aren't armed and our society doesn't have such a high murder rate generally so these things are less frequent. They still happen though and no-one is ever held to account.

Armed with guns obviously, I mean.

Wasnt a different black American woman found hanged in her cell just a few days before sandra? poor woman had only be arrested for nicking a phone I think

tomato I only have the words I have read in the reports so far, so yes tailgating was the term used, and the fact that a police car was right behind her so she moved over, if he was 2 car lengths away it would not have been an issue, he could have clearly seen her movements. I'm sorry your pupil was injured in an accident but hardly the same scenario, if her mother was "ploughed into" by a dangerous driver I don't suppose him indicating or not actually made a lot of difference,sad as it was.

But this is not the issue being discussed, I don't care if the officer saw her run a red light or cut someone up, whatever the reason for stopping this woman his actions (valid or not) from the moment he stopped her his attitude and violent response were horrific, and in no way shape or form can it be excused by her reaction.

Her autopsy report shows severe bruising to her right shoulder & cuts to her shoulder and elbow, also fresh marks on her wrists possibly from the handcuffs, hardly the signs of a gentle apprehension.

I just keep going to her hanging herself. Why would she? She was in jail for 3 days and hung herself. She just got a new job, her family say she was happy (but if they didn't visit her I guess they aren't that close?)

Has her family said if she contacted them at all during her stay there? Or anyone for that matter?

I would be incredibly fearful if I were a black person in the US. but you're not, I know plenty that aren't, this man in particular isn't
This video was posted to facebook by my former collegue, an African American, who clearly agrees with this man.

I absolutely agree there is institutional racism. I worked in the US, I witnessed it, it exists, anyone who denied it would be a fool. I'm not denying it and I know for a fact that ALL the african americans I know and worked with would never deny it either. BUT here's the thing, they also wouldn't shout immediate police racism for every case or assume that everytime there is a suspicious death of a black person in custody that it is automatically the result of institutionalised racism or a racist police officer.

Floundering you clearly haven't watched the video of her traffic stop. He was at least a car length away and when he first stopped her he started out polite and professional. I suggest you watch it.

Marchlikeanant I think you'll find it was this one ...

www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/police-say-teen-kindra-chapman-hanged-herself-in-jail-cell-after-cellphone-theft-arrest-10411073.html

God only 18.

So sad.

I absolutely agree there is institutional racism. I worked in the US, I witnessed it, it exists, anyone who denied it would be a fool. I'm not denying it and I know for a fact that ALL the african americans I know and worked with would never deny it either. BUT here's the thing, they also wouldn't shout immediate police racism for every case or assume that everytime there is a suspicious death of a black person in custody that it is automatically the result of institutionalised racism or a racist police officer

Absolutely beautifully put, Tomato

Mind-boggling that people are trying to justify her arrest and incarceration for 3 days and interesting the people doing it have little to say about her death.

Just looking around the web.

Like the comments on the story above, one is quite typical "if you're the sort of person who steals then you deserve what you get" stuff as if death at 18 is a perfectly reasonable payment for stealing a phone.

I suppose there is an element that if you aren't the sort of person that certain types of law enforcement like to pick on then you assume they have their reasons. I imagine they would change their tune pretty quickly if it was a member of their family incarcerated for days for a minor traffic violation and then winding up dead.

If the police don't want people to assume that every death of a black person while in their "care" is suspicious, they need to stop being institutionally racist.

Not the other way around.

This applies in the UK also.