Bus companies are not required by law to force parents with buggies to make way for wheelchair users

[DuelingFanjo]

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First Bus wins wheelchair court judgement - Bus companies are not required by law to force parents with buggies to make way for wheelchair users in designated bays on vehicles, senior judges ruled.

Might be a controversial opinion but I am glad.

No, but it's just ludicrous. You would have to buy a specific buggy to take the bus even once? It wouldn't work. They would lose too much custom.

fanjo was that aimed at me?

Seems like buggies are more important to society than people who use wheelchairs, that's for sure .

If the ruling had gone the other way (or if the law is now changed so that bus companies are required to make people move), then that's exactly what would have happened curious. And it still might as I don't believe disabled lobby groups are going to take this ruling lying down (haha)

No, georgie what is ludicrous is people refusing to fold their buggies so that a wheelchair user can get on the bus. In fact it is shambolic!

There's already a petition Oddfodd and Mr Paulley has vowed to take it to the Supreme Court. I hope it goes all the way to the European Courts if necessary.

There's total pram choice yes (and really you shouldn't be going on a bus if you've not got an easily collapsible buggy) BUT there will be occasions when it's just not possible for parents to fold up buggies. What about when they're laden down with shopping and the bus is so busy that there's no room to safely hold a baby etc....

Perhaps the problem is not to do with 'selfish, entitled parents with buggies' (and I'm pretty sure that most wouldn't be on a bus with a buggy in the first place unless it was necessary) but to do with limitations in the bus/public transport system.

Until a couple of years ago my local buses had no wheelchair or buggy spaces so when my son was a baby (he's 8) you had to fold or not use the bus. If you had a big pram you walked (nearest village with sizeable shops is 3 miles away) got a lift or got a taxi.

If the ruling had gone the other way, or the law ever does change, the bus companies will need to hire an extra member of staff for each bus to enforce the law, just as in nightclubs there are teams of bouncers (never just one). With the passion with which some people have spoken on here on both sides, I've no doubt that it would need to be enforced properly by someone other than the driver.

But nobody who could fold their buggy would refuse... If would be people who physically can't, are struggling with their children, have twins, have a buggy that doesn't fold and are unexpectedly on the bus...

Things aren't always so black and white. If I had been asked to fold my pram when I took the bus, I simply couldn't have. I had two children, a two piece pram, loads of bags (as I had car trouble) and it would have been impossible. So you would have made me get off of the bus.

So then what do I have to do... Buy another ticket? What if it happens at every stop. How many times do I have to buy another ticket and get off the bus??

Where is the ptition, please fairy ? I can't articulate politely how angry this ruling has made me.

My SIL's sister had an unruly toddler she couldn't take him out of his buggy as his behaviour was too unpredicatable. So she would been made to get off the bus or be labelled selfish and entitled. How many of you would have judged her at this point? Can't control her child? Thinks her toddler is special etc.?

Roll on a couple of years and she still has her DS in a buggy but now its a Maclaran Major because he has just been diagnosed with ASD and will still react unpredictably in certain situations. No longer selfish and entitled.

The only change - her DS now has a diagnosis.

Don't label everyone who doesn't take their child out a buggy as selfish or entitled unless you know their full story.

curiousgeorgie if you take you head out from where its lodged for even a moment you will notice that there are very few wheelchair users around compared to the number of buggies. So the chances of you being forced off a bus at all let alone repeatedly are very, very small. Conversely, you could wait hours for a buggy free bus to come along in the city where I live.

Maybe stop trying to defend the indefensible and just admit you think your comfort comes first, regardless of the impact on others. You had car trouble - boo hoo. For some people their is their life.

...this is their life.

AuntieMaggie, well , yes.

since you were saying you couldn't fold. I assume if you are happy to make way for a wheelchair user you will get off then? Or buy new buggy?

Here Barbarian.

Georgie people do refuse to fold their buggies, how do you think this case came about in the first place? As for the 'I have two kids, yadda yadda, yadda....." It's excuses, that's all. If you can't fold your buggy with that on the bus, then don't get on!

Re asking someone else to hold your baby - I am immensely uptight about a lot of things, but I have done this several times, and I have held other people's babies when needed. It isn't as if you are giving your baby to a stranger for several hours, you are asking someone to hold them for a minute whilst you are right next to them folding up a pram. I ended up with a pram which did not fold with one hand so on a very very few occasions I had to ask for help - either with the baby or with the pram. I walked more than I got buses, so I had a pram that suited that and I lived with the inconvenience of folding or getting off the bus on the rare occasion that I had to make space for a wheelchair user.

BarbarianMum - I think your point was somewhat lost with the childish insult?

From past experience there is no point trying to change georgies mind on this so unless you want to spend a day arguing and getting nowhere I would give up

Chaz I have a severely autistic child. Pre sn buggy he wore reins inside a one handed fold buggy. At the bus stop he would be taken out of his buggy and I would hold his reins with one hand and fold buggy with other. As buses were not accessible I had no choice. He would try to lie on the floor etc but he would be safe.

I know Fanjo, bit like disabled toilets. Maybe they should be renamed "Spaces for the selfish and entitled!"

Babiecakes
She would get off where she could but if she was going to miss his hospital appointment if she did what was she to do. Her problem was that she couldn't take him out of the buggy because he would try to bolt or if the situation was too stressful he would just lie on the floor and refuse to move in the middle of the bus, the street etc.

I do believe that anyone who can make way for a wheelchair user should but I also recognise there maybe some genuine cases where people can't. The blanket name calling and labelling that some posters have engaged in is not fair.

If people really, desperately, need to use a wheelchair space for their buggy, can I suggest that they write tot heir MP and their local bus companies. Start a campaign to get buses made more accessible for people with hidden disabilities, and for parents with small children.

It worked quite well for wheelchair users.