Is Jack Straw a racist for requesting that women remove their veils?

[magicfarawaytree]

just watching the news. didnt personally think he had done anything terrible in asking.

Caligula, wasn't there a fashion in the (80's??), when women used to wear those hats with small veils attached to them which partially covered their upper face, the 'veil' bit was usually kind of made of net...I'm sure I remeber seeing ermmm Joan Collins wear one in Dynasty lol.

Am being slightly flippant please don't take offence (every other thread appears to have gone tits up so figure I'd better attach a disclaimer).

LOL at the disclaimer!

What do you think to the woman in the TA controversy not wearing her veil at the interview (where there was a man teacher present on the interview panel) and then insisting on wearing it later? If this is true,natch?

If true (note the if ) it does seem like a bit of stirring going on don't you think?

The TA said she could not remove her veil in front of a man. How do veiled women cope with men at passport control? (Apols if this has been dealt with already)

You know Mb I was thinking about that actually. After initially saying the woman was stirring etc. It might actually be that she's 'found Islam'.
A close friend worked in telesales, she said there was a muslim girl who worked there, and was very popular, she was hard drinking and smoking kinda gal.... friend said, the girl suddenly walked in one day veiled form head to toe. Much to everyones initial amusment, and then everyone kind of left her to it,. as she was no longer such fun.
I asked my friend whether she'd laughed at ehr too, and how she'd have felt in the girls position, it does take a lot of courage to make a sudden complete turn.....

However I still do not understand why this TA woman is refusing to flip her veil up whilst teaching children ready to flip it down should any man walk into class....... She could sit with her back to the door, ask the kids to let her know if anyone walked in quietly, or merely request that anyone who walks into class please knock first only polite imo.

The story now seems to be that she didn't wear a veil at interview, which, if true, seems rather odd.

She might, fuzzy, but if she can't carry out her job....and tbh I think that teaching a language to children really does need the kids to be able to see her face....she can't do the job, can she?

rather like if I were a Food technology teacher who suddenly espoused veganism, I couldn't do the job .

Fuzzy,how ridiculous!
Requesting that a teacher knock before entering in order to accommodate her silliness!!
It's a slippery slope.

Wot next????

PF apparantly they remove their veils on request in front of a woman instead.....

Has anyone ever been scrutinised and compared to their passpost photo's though?? When we were going to Dubai a few years back I sat out of the way whilst dh checked in as the girls were trying to get behind the counter (actually I think dd1 wanted to ride on the luggage conveyor belt thing).
Aslo neither of my girls now look anytihng like thier passport photo's as the pics were taken when the girls were about 6weeks old, certainly dd1 now 3.6 looks nothing like her passport photo, but I guess that's another thread.

MD is it really silly?? When I was at school if anyone wanted to walk into class they always did knock, maybe things have changed but I figured the other teachers were only being polite, it wasn't a muslim school, and non of the teachers were muslim either.

It is interesting fuzzy that this is a C of E school that she is working in. How would it be, if someone went for interview at a muslim school demurely dressed, and when they got the job turned into 'wild child' personified? I dare say that persons job prospects would be reviewed

I don't knock when I go into my own classroom, though I do when I go into others.

No Mb don't get me wrong, I think this TA is behaving bizarrely to put it politely, and there seriously is no need for her to wear a veil in front of little children, I don't get it tbh.....

Would a 'wild child' be able to hold down a job in any school

MB that was what I meant about knocking, if another teacher wanted to interrupt class for whatever.

Knocking out of politeness is fine.
Knocking in case one catches a glimpse of a woman's face is ludicrous.

I have put up with all this crap in Saudi-remeber dreadful summer of swimming in uni pool surrounded by 20 foot high wall (in case anyone dared to try and look in) protected by two layers of guards (ditto).

Even in ther,a good proportion were swimming in their clothes.

It insults both sexes.

Men,for assuming they are sex mad and driven to evil deeds with so much as a glance of cheekbone.

Women in the obvious way but also annoying angle of self absorption.Who do they thikn they are,in assuming their feminine allure is such to derail the opposite sex.

A (Muslim)woman friend and I in Turkey have a lot of laughs as heavy haunched and bewhiskered toothless old women scuttle by,hiding under headscarves.

Don't you guys ever get tired of discussing this?
I find it drains me.

Fuzzy! Dangerous talk on MN to sugest that how you dress infers something about your personality!

What I mean is, If I went to a muslim school for a job, dressed in a style that would suit the school ethos and then started to wear a mini skirt (god forbid with me legs!) and a plunging neckline! I would imagine that I would be shown the door PDQ. And I would still be the same person, and the same quality of teacher. A case of misrepresentation to get a job, possibly?

She is refusing because as a TA she might be asked to work with a man as the teacher in the calssroom. And this would have been quite clear to her at the time of the interview.

God yes I know someone who is a deputy headmistress (well actually I know two deputy headmistresses, that must be a record for someone who's not a teacher) and one of them is a raging alcoholic who spends all her weekends comatose and shagging similarly drunk strangers. (She's DHM of a catholic school. )

Thinking about it, my Biology Teacher, who was totaly supurb, was a lush who had a fling with one of the boys from my year in school (after we left school iyswim)

god i love that she's a deputy headmistress.

can someone summarise this thread since i posted way down.

i'm too scared to read it in case bu's comment on another thread about shit that muslim mners are taking relates to this thread.

anyone?

Interesting you mention that MD. This friend I was chatting to today is doing an OU course and when he went on the residential thing, he said there was a veiled woman there and he did feel quite offended, as if he were being personally insulted by not being allowed to look at her, even though she could look at him. Even though he knows rationally that it's nothing personal, he couldn't help feeling resentful (and then guilty for feeling it!)

Britain pretty bloody tolerant in terms of staff dress codes in public sector.

When I worked in Russia,prof (woman) of English dept.where I was based,would regularly give public bollocking to respectable married women with regard to clothes she thought unsuitable.

My sister nad family live in the Caribbean (after being in France for years) and teachers have made it very clear to her teenaged daughteres that the sundress 'n sandals look is not on.

This woman has a lot of men behind her,urging her on,because they know that such is Britain's tolerance,that any criticism of her loony stance can be put down to that comfortable one-size-fits-all 'Islamaphobia.

She is arguably a victim of it,but one sacrificed by her own side.

LOL MB, the headmistress of my old school ran off with the biology teacher (who left her husband for her) and they set up a lurve-nest together, to the scandal of the governors and pupils.

They're still together after 20 years.

Yes Cal.
As a lot of expats feel also
'Oh it's fine for you to look at my wife,but I'm not allowed to see yours.'

My father has been very pissed off by muttawa (religious police) waving sticks at my mother and telling him to tell her to 'cover up'

Gosh yes,Britain is sooo repressve in comparison eh???b

sadly, not a happy ending for my old biology teacher. She is in a very bad way indeed because of her alcoholism. She was an astounding teacher and totaly changed my life, I ower her a very great deal

An interesting updaye

TA wearing veil