Oscar Pistorius trial part 2

[JillJ72]

To continue from previous thread

aventurine that he "couldn't remember" who told him something that he just presented to the court; keeps saying he "can't remember" when asked questions

OneStepCloser If you have burglar bars you would open windows yes, why Oscar left his doors open is puzzling. You are not even safe In your own home. I think he became too dependant and obsessed with firearms.

Thanks

His father was there in court for all four days of his bail hearing.

That's what I find strange rad I don't understand if he was so worried he didn't have measures put in place, ie bars at windows etc... Even in London I had bars on my basement windows.

I think it was a mistake for the defence to put him on the stand. He has made so many admissions this morning, blaming his defence team etc

He simply will not accept responsibility for anything put to him

Well if I had a boyfriend who chewed gum in public I'd tell him not to. I certainly tell my girls off about it. It looks vile and if you are in the public eye it's worse. Remember how Carole Middleton was lambasted for it?

It wasn't "her" accent per se, her normal one, but an accent she was practising and he find it annoying that she kept doing it during a serious discussion. I thought at first it was because she sounded common or something.

To my mind all the nitpicking about stuff like that is just an attempt to get OP to lose his temper. People argue, they blame each other for stuff, then it's over (unless you are a grudge bearer of course.)

There is a lot of "don't remember" that could be a ploy (people giving depositions are told to do that). Equally if it didn't seem important ot him at the time then he might not remember the detail. Who knows?

I think if he is lying about Sam Taylor having lied then he's on dodgy ground, but of course that doesn't relate to the murder charge.

" I don't understand if he was so worried he didn't have measures put in place, ie bars at windows etc"

Didn't he say the bathroom window didn't have burglar bars, so the implication is at least some of the others did? However,
I too think he became reliant on having a gun to protect him.

As for him testifying, I think they have no choice. Most of us, including me, think only a guilty man refuses to testify in his own defence. I think he'll be found guilty of at least one of the other gun charges but still don't think they have enough (yet ?) to convict him of murder, especially premeditated.

It does seem odd that he will clearly state under oath that two other witnesses are lying about being in contact with each other

Asked why didn't Roux query this?

I was only told afterward says Pistorius

Who told you?

Can't remember.

These people are telling lies but I can't remember who told me?

It's been a terrible morning for OP. I bet it's interesting lunch for him and his defence team.

What is going on now? What is Nel's focus?

"Please go read up on the Farm Murders in SA ... if you can stomach it.."

*AfricanExport" - is that the family with the 12 year old son? That is one of the reasons I believe OP could be so panicked that he'd do this. It was horrific.

He has to testify, it would be very odd if he didn't.

See for me I think he did intend to at least harm whoever it was behind that door, but whether it was Reeva or intruders I can't tell.

I think the detail about his critiquing her behavior is very telling. I was on the fence about him being controlling or not - people can be jealous without being controlling, but this about the gum chewing is disturbing to me. Reminds me of an ex who shouted at me for talking loudly or making the slightest noise when eating actually. OP reminds me a lot of him for some reason and I can't put my finger on it. He disturbs me yet seems charming too.

Was Pistorius on a farm?
Isolated?
Miles from help, armed security guards, police, neighbours?

Er...no.

I read about terrible things ALL the time. Try not to conflate the actual fear felt by v isolated and beleaguered SA Farmers with the fear felt by a rich, armed man in a low crime, regularly patrolled, secured, housing estate.

I think joining the two that makes light of the problems suffered by those farmers and the no hope/choice situation they are often in.

Louise - your rationalisations - putting ALL his behaviours and incidents in a benign light are getting a bit much now!!

I'm starting to wonder if you're from MNHQ.

I agree colin. I had a bf once who picked me up on everything, my laugh, what I laughed at, who I spoke to and what I said. I'm a strong woman and I did stand up for myself but it's insiduous and creeping behaviour that puzzles anyone strong and I imagine Reeva was like that (hence her texts to him trying to say)

If you hear a noise or suspect a burglar, of course you notice if your partner is actually in bed with you.

"the gum chewing is disturbing to me. Reminds me of an ex who shouted at me for talking loudly or making the slightest noise when eating actually. OP reminds me a lot of him for some reason and I can't put my finger on it. He disturbs me yet seems charming too."

Yes - I see that as a red flag.

One thing does seem clear and is confusing, he seems to feel Roux has not advised him well??
On a number of occasions now he is stating or alluding to Roux doing a poor job or advising him poorly.
Perhaps this will be the basis of his Appeal...poor/incompetent or unclear legal counsel

I think he is the kind of man who blames everyone but himself. Doesn't surprise me he is blaimng his counsel.

I haven't followed today, will catch up with twitter later, so my comments based on your fast paced posts.

Any chance Roux will have advised and coached OP to respond this way?

Wouldn't make a lot of sense otherwise - he's paying a lot of money to Roux to represent him?

Two points from this morning.

I've been following the trial on twitter, when OP said he found the policeman aggressive, three other journalists, including one from the DT all chipped in to say they had been threatened by the police.

Apparently, if he had confessed to the gun charges, he would have only got a fine, so I do wonder why he contested them. It's a huge thing to say that someone has lied in their testimony and that's what he's done.

I'm noting that Nel is doing everything he can to get OP to criticise Roux, the two men must know each other, so I'm wondering if this is to get under Roux's skin in some way and sow enmity between OP and his defence team.

The general consensus is that he's saying too much and being too elaborate, but it would be very hard not to be.

It's making me ponder about an adversarial system, someone could be telling the truth and still fall apart under that sort of treatment, whereas someone extremely calm and well coached could stick to their version of events, however untrue.

I am still stunned by Nel's opening gambit with the watermelon. Stunned.

Yes rousette it's the insidious nature of it exactly. I think a lot of people wouldn't think the small things concerning - and in isolation might not be but added up and in consideration of the fact that he did kill her, they raise alarm bells.

Thinking about his 'fear' too, I don't doubt that. But it does seem handy that he tackled this with a gun (which he is clearly an enthusiast of). My BIL is fearful of intruders. I once saw a baseball bat by his bed and thought one of the kids had left it lying about and realized it was BIL's dense idea of security. But my BIL is a bit simple in that respect and doesn't have OPs considerable wealth. If he did, he would have state of the art security instead of his baseball bat.

I'm so thankful for the UKs gunlaws thinking about all of this.

When I say it was a mistake putting him on the stand - it was in terms of his defence and pleas because he has actually used the word "reckless" in relation to his behaviour at Tasha's - enough for commenting lawyers to say he will be found guilty of at least that offensive.

He is tying himself up in knots trying not to implicate himself, whereas the truth would be easier and less damaging iyswim? If he conceded on the gun charges (like he should, because the evidence is clear against him) instead of not taking responsibility for anything, perhaps it wouldn't make him look like he's just trying to cover his arse