Russia has invaded Ukraine

[ohmymimi]

Not a shot fired. Putin outwits the West and who/what will stop him getting his way?

you think that no Russian ministries are controlled by any neo-Nazis, anti-semites, far-right extremists, armed gangs, nationalists, powerful gangsters or corrupt politicans?

I don't think there are any neo-Nazis or anti-semites controlling Russian ministries. There are corrupt politicians and gangsters, but that is like in any country.

There was a Ukrainian Fatherland Party politician on the Daily politics just now saying that he wants sanctions against Russia so that there will be street demonstrations against Putin in Russia. That is what the outside hawks want to happen. This Ukrainian puppet politician then said that Putin wants a third world war. Of course he doesn't, but I am not sure about some of these hawks.

The hawks are trying to push Europe to side with them against Russia. They think they will scare Germany to go along with them and take sides.

The result of all of this will be to weaken the EU, even though the Germans are not going along.

The Euro elections in May will show what the European people think.

Russia is especially corrupt and has a powerful set of gangsters.

Eastern Europe never confronted its fascist and anti-semitic leanings, they blamed it on the (West) Germans, who have made the greatest strides in admitting, facing up to, and addressing the past. It was very noticeable that even East Germany never did.

'Russia is especially corrupt and has a powerful set of gangsters.'

Of course it is. But so are lots of other countries.

'Eastern Europe never confronted its fascist and anti-semitic leanings, they blamed it on the (West) Germans'

Yes, but Russia fought the fascists. Russia contains people of many ethnicities, it is not a racist country.

Have I just herd a Ukrainian politician arguing on Daily Politics for "nuclear powers" to sort out Russia?! They want EU to engage in nuclear war with Russia ?

you are very generous and forgiving of Russian anti-Semitism and racism.

As you know, the Soviet Union was allied to Nazi Germany, and only fought them after the German invasion started.

"Eastern Europe never confronted its fascist and anti-semitic leanings".

Yes, but it seems Eastern Europe also has part of equally fascist anti Russian leanings, and it can't be right that Europe could be dragged into conflict by fringe groups like this.

How can we allow swivel eyed Ukrainian loons to advocate for nuclear war on the BBC?

I think the loons are puppets, just as the neo-nazis are puppets and the jihadists are Saudi puppets. They don't pull the strings.

'the Soviet Union was allied to Nazi Germany'
Yes, but it did not persecute Jewish people.

I don't think the hawks will get their way, but no one knows what will happen. It is still a very dangerous situation.

"A Kremlin aide was quoted on Tuesday as saying that if the United States were to impose sanctions on Russia over Ukraine, Moscow might be forced to drop the dollar as a reserve currency and refuse to pay off any loans to U.S. banks."

in.reuters.com/article/2014/03/04/ukraine-crisis-russia-us-idINDEEA2305J20140304

"'the Soviet Union was allied to Nazi Germany'
Yes, but it did not persecute Jewish people. "

Rubbish.

Ukraine is especially suspicious of Russia, due to the Soviet Union's genocide through man-made famine in the 1930's

I don't doubt that they are fearful of another invasion as happened, post-war, in Hungary, Czechoslovakia, Georgia and now the Ukraine when Russia's disobedient neighbours made attempts towards self-determination

'Ukraine is especially suspicious of Russia, due to the Soviet Union's genocide through man-made famine in the 1930's'

Yes, that was the communists who did that. It was not a persecution of Jewish people.

Of course, Ukrainians are fearful about Russian intentions, and Russians are fearful of Western intentions and any moves that may lead to them being deprived of a port in the Crimea. This is about power politics and spheres of interest. I think Crimea is probably a red line for Russia.

The Russian-dominated Soviet Union caused genocide by famine in the Ukraine; and also continued the long and shameful history of anti-semitism.

I am amazed that you seek to deny it.

Ukrainian politicians should be talking to their own people, building national unity and consensus. They need to reconcile the interest of diverse groups in their country and earn their trust. They should be building responsible relationships with their neighbors.

Instead they are posturing in Western media advocating for the "nuclear powers", mummy Europe and daddy US to fight with Russia for them.

The name of Europe should not be associated with Nazzi apologists advocating anti Russian ethnic cleansing.

Veteran US conservative former Presidential candidate, Pat Buchanan, says

"With Vladimir Putin’s dispatch of Russian troops into Crimea, our war hawks are breathing fire. Russophobia is rampant and the op-ed pages are ablaze here. Barack Obama should tune them out, and reflect on how Cold War presidents dealt with far graver clashes with Moscow.

When Red Army tank divisions crushed the Hungarian freedom fighters in 1956, killing 50,000, Eisenhower did not lift a finger. When Khrushchev built the Berlin Wall, JFK went to Berlin and gave a speech. When Warsaw Pact troops crushed the Prague Spring in 1968, LBJ did nothing. When, Moscow ordered Gen. Wojciech Jaruzelski to smash Solidarity, Ronald Reagan refused to put Warsaw in default. These presidents saw no vital U.S. interest imperiled in these Soviet actions, however brutal."

www.theamericanconservative.com/resist-the-war-party-on-crimea/

Of course, he is just a former politician. He is not a banker, billionaire, hedge fund manager or arms dealer, so he probably has little influence.

'I am amazed that you seek to deny it.'

I don't deny that the Russian communist Soviet Union caused a famine.

'the Soviet Union was allied to Nazi Germany'
Yes, but it did not persecute Jewish people. *

Stalin was paranoid about Jews and murdered lots of them. Especially Jewish doctors. Later on, in the seventies. lots of Soviet Jews were desperate to escape to Israel.

Yes, that is true.

and between 1990 and 2006, more than a million and a half people of Jewish origins were permitted to leave.

Looking further back, I am sure claig is familiar with the word "pogrom"

'the Soviet Union was allied to Nazi Germany'
Yes, but it did not persecute Jewish people. *

Yes have you not heard of the doctor's plot ? Although in the early days of Stalin's reign he was not considered to be particularly anti semitic (and a lot of his inner circle was Jewish, including for e.g. Polina Zhemchizhina, and someone his daughter went out with), once he aligned with Nazi Germany he shifted position to be more in line with Germany's anti-semitic policies. And, after the war once the state of Israel was established - although initially the USSR was supportive, once Russian Jews (or USSR Jews) started to show allegiance to Israel rather than the USSR, he started clamping down. For e.g., Golda Meyer (who was born in the Ukraine) was Israel's first ambassador to the USSR. While there, she met with Polina Zhemchuzhina who spoke to her in Yiddish. When Golda asked her how she knew Yiddisih, Polina responded that she was Jewish. She was also involved in anti-fascist activites, and was whisked away to a labour camp for 5 years and forced to divorce her husband.

Yes, there were pogroms before the Russian Revolution. But at the time of the Nazi-Soviet pact, I am not aware of the Russian communist leadership being anti-semitic, but I may be wrong.

And I know PLENTY of people who are Russian Jewish origin, who have tons of stories about family members disappearing, being persecuted for their beliefs, having to get married in basements with lookouts for police, carrying out brit mila in secret and so on.

I love the irony of what John Kerry came out with: "You just don’t invade another country on phony pretext in order to assert your interests,” Kerry said during an interview with NBC’s Meet the Press. “This is an act of aggression that is completely trumped up in terms of its pretext. It’s really 19th century behaviour in the 21st century.”

Of course, his country hasn't invaded anywhere for ages. :o

Yes, Stalin was anti-semitic later on. I don't know if he was at the time of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact. As far as I understand it, the Pact enabled the Nazis and Soviets to carve up Poland between themselves.

And, there are indications that the KGB disseminated the protocols of the Elders of Zion in the middle east in order to stir up hatred for Jews and for Israel.

I was wrong about Stalin, he was anti-semitic even at the time of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact. I have just looked it up.

'During his meeting with Ribbentrop, Stalin promised him to get rid of the "Jewish domination", especially among intellectuals.[18] After dismissing Maxim Litvinov as Foreign Minister in 1939,[19] Stalin immediately directed incoming Foreign Minister Vyacheslav Molotov to "purge the ministry of Jews", to appease Hitler and to signal Nazi Germany that the USSR was ready for non-aggression talks.'

In 1931, Stalin had said,

Stalin's 1931 condemnation of antisemitism[edit]

"On January 12, 1931, Stalin gave the following answer to an inquiry on the subject of the Soviet attitude toward antisemitism from the Jewish News Agency in the United States:

“

National and racial chauvinism is a vestige of the misanthropic customs characteristic of the period of cannibalism. Anti-semitism, as an extreme form of racial chauvinism, is the most dangerous vestige of cannibalism.

Anti-semitism is of advantage to the exploiters as a lightning conductor that deflects the blows aimed by the working people at capitalism. Anti-semitism is dangerous for the working people as being a false path that leads them off the right road and lands them in the jungle. Hence Communists, as consistent internationalists, cannot but be irreconcilable, sworn enemies of anti-semitism.

In the U.S.S.R. anti-semitism is punishable with the utmost severity of the law as a phenomenon deeply hostile to the Soviet system. Under U.S.S.R. law active anti-semites are liable to the death penalty.[10]"

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stalin_and_antisemitism

So, Stalin was anti-semitic and other Russian communists were too

Simon Sebag-Montefiore's biography of Stalin (In the Court of the Red tsar - excellent book!) goes into it a bit, and I don't think he could determine whether or not Stalin was properly truly anti-semitic, or it was a just good political tool (he used the Doctor's plot as an excuse to get rid of a lot of rivals). But the Soviet state clearly had an anti-Jewish bent.

One of the reasons why a lot of the Oligarchs are of Jewish origin (e.g. Abramovich, Berezovsky, Khodorkovsky) is that until the fall of Communism, there was a "glass ceiling" if you were Jewish - you were barred from the top universities, jobs within the parties, influential roles etc., so for people who were intelligent and talented, as soon as that barrier was smashed, they went a bit nuts.