Mandela critically ill

[janey68]

Not unexpected but nevertheless sad.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-23024836

[Boomba]

I'm sure its different from a white and a black perspective too. And poor and rich

[Salbertina]

Cinnamom- as you've lived in SA since the 70s, you doubtless will have experienced huge change... Also in your personal standard living, I'm guessing, which for most white people has fallen dramatically in real terms since the end of apartheid. But this is democracy, yes, it's corrupt, muddled and inefficient but a damn sight better for the vast majority than under apartheid!

I hear often- always from white friends- how this country is "going to the dogs" and feel incensed! Of course their apartheid privileges have ceased, that is fair and proper. Their incredible advantages- education, access to the bank of mum and dad and inherited wealth - live on and enable them to secure that bond on a nice 5-bed, 3-bath in a naice area Many whites here still live an unbelievably privileged life, fair dues if this feels on borrowed time!

[Cinnamom]

Salbertina I cannot speak for white South Africans. Quite telling that you have assumed that I am white, which I am not. By you saying that we are not heading for Zim, I will assume you are white and live in the suburbs so dont see and feel what the majority do. Life in SA is heading the same way as Zim for the majority of people.

[Cinnamom]

Do you go to private hospitals or government hospitals? Private schools or rural government schools? If you have not sat at Joburg Gen on a friday night, you have no idea.

[Salbertina]

I have plenty of an idea, thank you, i live here!

Apologies for assuming you were white, had presumed so based on what you said, my mistake. Am truly sad that as a non-white person you're not more hopeful about the future, but fair enough.

[Boomba]

cinnamom are you a Black African?

[Cinnamom]

Yes Boomba I am a black South African.

It is quite insulting that you assume what us non-white people should or shouldnt be feeling. Why assume that because I am black that I should be hopeful? We have Zuma as a president at the moment and I can tell you, I am not happy about it either. The talk at the moment, especially by the younger generation is that Malema is the answer. Sadly, education is lacking and poverty is doing the thinking.

You should take a trip into Zanspruit or even Alex and see for yourself and feel the hopelessness.

[Cinnamom]

I do think this thread is for Madiba and it should go back to that.

[Salbertina]

My intention isn't to insult, Cinnamon- up to you how you take my opinion, for that is what it is. Just as you have yours. No need to attack me for mine. A good (black) friend of mine also hates Zuma (who doesn't?) but sees him as a lesser evil than former apartheid governments. Why exactly do you think SA is going the way of Zim?

I have been to Alex and to similar townships/informal settlements in PE and CT, i work in one also, i do know what you're talking about, it is shocking how very little the ANC has delivered on its promises esp in regard to housing.

Agree, back to Madiba is a good idea.

[Salbertina]

Interesting to wonder whether Mandela would himself join the ANC as it currently stands with a weak leader lacking the full support/respect of the electorate. The lack of a decent opposition to challenge and question the gov is a major problem and enables the ANC to be complacent. Here's hoping that Agang grows and gets some popular support.

[meditrina]

I've just seen on the news that there are huge crowds outside the hospital today, and they're singing the old protest songs in his honour. I wonder if he can hear them?

"And flights of angels sing thee to thy rest"

[Salbertina]

Ah, thats nice, be good if he can hear.
Zuma cancelled overseas trip and Obama on his way here tho not to visit Mandela

[OneStepCloser]

They do say that your hearing is the last sense to go so if hes on that side of the hospital then he might hear, which would be nice.

[ShamTech]

I've been in South Africa since 2000 and am just about to move back to UK. Was just saying to my girlfriend last night that there are not many heroes left in the world that I look up to. Mandela was definitely one of them. Would love to go to his funeral when it eventually happens, but sadly the thought of being outside in a crowd in a major city in SA is just too frightening, but who knows it may all happen without any incident - I sincerely hope so.

[EdithWeston]

Thought I'd bump this - Zuma "making an important announcement" prett much now.

[EdithWeston]

Zuma confirms death of Nelson Mandela