Mother with 2 sons in prison for two separate murders

[Lurksome]

She also provided a false alibi for one of them and is now is jail What must she be thinking?

Murders were completely unprovoked.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-22155807

The poor man they killed. It's just awful.

Something clearly gone very very badly wrong within and for that family. It's utterly tragic. 17 and 14. 14. My eldest will be 14 next month. I can't imagine it.

Three sons. Her eldest is in prison for killing a stranger in a takeaway with a bottle. Now her younger two are also serving life for kicking a homeless man to death. Murder in all cases, not manslaughter, not accidental death, no hint of self-defence. This is not a PC thing to say but thank god they're out of the breeding pool while they're in prison. One can only speculate on what's gone wrong in that family but they are all clearly very dangerous.

Where is the father in all of this? I wonder what kind of role model / man he is to have such violent sons.

I`m a really liberal person but I actually agree with LondonMother. Three children turn out to be murders at such young ages, something very very wrong in the family there.

I agree that something went wrong in that family, but criminal behaviour is not genetic - there is nothing to say if those boys had children, that there would be a higher chance if those children being criminals too. That's nurture, not nature in my mind.

ADHD and psychopathy both have genetic factors and when combined with a duff upbringing make a person more likely to become violent. In any case, if a person has an appalling upbringing and turns out violent and utterly lacking in empathy, regardless of whether he is likely to pass on any genetic tendency, what kind of nurture is he likely to give his children?

Oh I agree its nuture rather than nature.

I bet she feels proud
thank god they are locked away.

there's a 4th son too, who was jailed for contempt of court for taknig pictures of the courtroom during the trial.

I wouldnt want these men to be able to have children. What a vile family..

Does anyone really think that these men should have those opportunties. They will make the most appalling fathers.

think your temperament is definitely nature but will agree that nurture plays a large part in determining if somebody will become a murderer.

Sunnywithshowers
"Where is the father in all of this? I wonder what kind of role model / man he is to have such violent sons."

Maybe he had a lucky escape from an abusive relationship.
Maybe we will never know.

I blame the father. A mother can only do so much with teenage sons. They need a male role model to guide them.

Just show how vile this family are. I wonder if the 4th son was trying to take photos of the jury???

They pleaded not guilty btw. That says a lot too.

Their father was on the local news tonight. He didn't appear to think it was anything to do with him

What I can't get over is their eyes no remorse or shame just cold and psychopathic. What they must have seen at a young age to be so hardened must be shocking

I'm utterly at this family, and also wondered about the father.

Yes while she's obviously wanting in th parenting department, she didn't manage to get pregnant and produce four sons alone.

And even let's suppose the father left an abusive relationship, he still left those four children behind.

So two lots of parenting failures there IMO.

Fargo68 - while you might be correct to say that teenage boys need a male role model nobody needs a male presence to be told that murder is wrong. I don't know anything about this family but I do think it's got to be a lot more complicated that the lack of a father figure(s).

:(

Let's hope the 4th son (and any other siblings) manages to make a better life for themselves.

is how this story made me feel. what sort of lives did those boys have that their mother dragged them up, there was a hint that the were pretty much left to their own devices.
terrible.
perhaps they were goading each other to attack the man because of the older brother already being in prison

As the parent of three adopted children I am afraid to say that it's nature over nurture for me. How history repeats itself in a different environment is frightening.

absolutely, its in the genes.
but surely parenting or lack of, must play a part

and your adopted children, were they adopted from birth,
it is the early formative years that make a difference.

welcome.

I totally agree. My upbringing couldn't have been any further away from my birth family, total opposite. There were no murders or criminals but some of the similarities in temperament, preferences, some mannerisms even, was uncanny.
My adoption was from birth.