Why are so many people on MN so anti benefit bashing?

[Bearbehind]

Genuine question- although I am well aware I will probably get flamed for this.

Osbourne's comments in the wake of the Philpotts's about benefits supporting lifestyles which are disagreeable to most tax payers today has touched a nerve with many for varying reasons.

I've always been of the opinion that benefits should be sufficient for the basic necessities but shouldn't cover luxuries like cigarettes, alcohol, Sky, mobile phones or holidays, as they shouldn't be an alternative to working (obviously only for those people capable of working) yet so many threads on here say its none of our business to question what benefits are spent on?

Why is it so many people are happy for their taxes to fund the luxuries listed above for others when they can't afford some of them for themselves after paying tax!? Am I missing something?

Shouldn't this have been moved to Shite Stuff?

Very hard, Stealth. They need not just a canteen but also a bar. A fucking bar. It's not enough for them to get £15/day for their subsidised food but also their BAR, after they wanted a min price for alcohol for everyone else. But they get a fucking state-subsidised bar.

£6m/annum.

And they're chosing this lifestyle! Scroungers!

I'm not bitter about people who have less than me, why the fuck would I be?

Living on benefits is not the life of fucking riley the DM would have you believe.

If you are eligible for benefits in our society then you should be able to claim those without reproach. If society deems the system to be too generous then vote for the people who would reduce them. what i object to is the demonisation of people who claim the benefits the law allows them.

Exactly expat, and the reason they have all these things (too much, waaay too much) was originally to make sure that MPs from other parts of the country weren't put off standing for Parliament because of the expense. So that ordinary people could become MPs and not just the independently wealthy. It wasn't meant to just be the preserve of the professional politician.

Again, an example of a fair enough concept that gets distorted and abused. But if we got rid of all the subsidies and expenses we'd be back to Lord Deep-Pockets and pals being the only people who became MPs - too risky for the ordinary to do something that involves packing in your job and your life to come back to potentially nothing in 4 years time.

Mind you, don't think I'm not saying that we could pare off a great big slice without too much hardship.

I admit I used to be as narrow minded as a some people on this thread. Moaned about single mums and scroungers living of tax payers money . Then I became a single mum. Twice. And ended up with a disabled child and on income support after having to give up my job.

Then I got it, and understood just how shitty life is on benefits.

Osbourne got it wrong.philpott is not representative of most people on benefits

I think it is possible to hold the view that our current welfare arrangements occasionally play a role in facilitating some unpleasant lifestyles whie also recognising that the Philpotts of this world are very far indeed from being representative of most benefit claimants.
I used to do criminal defence work, and came into daily contact with a group of people who hoover up a great deal of public resource, in terms of direct payments, health care, paid-for legal representation etc - but they are not the norm, thankfully. Something like 47% of the welfare budget goes on pensioners, most of the rest to people in work.

I'm on some benefits though work, have 3 children, eldest is working in a rural area where we live when work is hard to find, he is moving out to flat share with a workmate, DD is moving for UNi in September, youngest is doing GCSE and want to go to uni too. My point is when we see the feckless that do not give aspirations to their children, and lets face it they are hardly going to bother to go on MN, Mumnetters care about thier children's futures, whether they are on benefits or not.

DP went to his second interview since august (from hundreds of CVs and applications sent) to be talked down to. He had his CV picked apart, like something out of the apprentice, for a fucking min wage factory job.

Then she asked "And how have you been supporting yourself since August?"

Really? You have to ask? You have to make him say it? This man who has worked since he was still in school, who is on his knees because he is out of work, who is over qualified for your fucking job but he really really bloody wants it!! But yes, you have to make him say hes been signing on, out loud.

Then tell him you cannot proceed with his application because his references are over 6 months old.

The worst part? I have to lie beside him at night while he tosses and turns, losing sleep because he didnt get the job. Lucky fucking escape if you ask me.

That's the reality, wannabe.

I know it, you know it. Try convincing the moaning bitter twats though.

I feel for you both, all companies want are arse kissers, yes sir no sir, they are not interested in whether they will work hard. I went to an Asda interview a few years ago and we had to do bloody role play, for F sake. I was in the Navy years ago and I didn't have to role play for an interview then.

Yunno my sibling who tells me to get a job?

He's got a job. And claims JSA.

The only shame is I don't know for sure he's doing it right this minute so can't report it.

Nice, eh? And I'm the Scrounger.

ohhh do you want to? I would

Yep and if I was sure I'd do it. He's been vile to me.

if they get a tip off they don't watch just for a day, they will keep an eye on it for a while.

wannabe

My DH went to an interview recently where the bloke conducting it told him (after working out that DH was far more qualified than him for his job) than he was that it was "very nice to meet you but I didn't quite get the responses I wanted from the advert for the job, so I'm going to re-advertise and wait to hear from younger people".

Not that younger people shouldn't have jobs, but my DH is bloody terrified he may never work again.

Your OH has my utmost respect wannabe. As do you for sharing something that's so genuinely heartbreaking.

This, unfortunately, is indicative of how life is for far too many in the UK. It's only getting worse and those who moan about people claiming benefits need to be repeating there but for the grace, on a daily basis, because if this diabolical situation, that too many families in this country are finding themselves in, never has any kind of impact on you and yours, you will be lucky indeed.

Its a disgrace MrsVamos.

The young are discriminated against too. DP is only now able to get insurance for the job he is qualified to do, but employers want years of experience. Which he hasnt got due to the insurance.

Then you have my Dad who is keeping his job by the skin of his teeth with pay cuts and hours cuts and you wonder if he lost it would he get another due to his age.

Its scary and demoralising and horrible to live through. Thing is, its an employers market. They get to pick and choose. :(

The problem is Bear that the more you go on about those who 'choose a benefits lifestyle' the more those of us who haven't chosen it are affected. We are all tarred with the same brush, like it or not. I have stated on here more than once that we were hounded out of a village in which we used to live. At that point my dh could still walk, just, so apparently we were choosing to live on benefits and he was being a lazy arse. He was a lecturer, as was I. The notes posted through our door (at four and five in the morning) were horrific, along with bad spelling and grammar! Oh, and then along came the new government, took away my respite care and ensured that I could no longer work to support us. My dh needs dressing, turning at night, help to use the lavatory. He is 42. On top of this, I work an eighteen hour day looking after three children with disabilities. The government pays me £53 quid a week for that, and there are many on mumsnet as well as other places who call me scum for it. So please, everytime you say, 'Oh, I don't mean you', it's still me and others like me, that catch the flak. We don't look like we're doing enough because you're not awake at night watching us, or you see us wandering in the supermarket, or our children are having a good day. It's us that are tarred with that choosing a lifestyle brush too, not matter that you don't mean us.

It is, wanna. I feel for you and DH and family as I know exactly how shit it is. (((HUG)))

I feel sorry for the young. Can't get jobs, no jobs out there, no training, certainly not anything that would lead to a job. Almost all employers want experience, which no-one is prepared to give ! Crazy world we live in.

Totally agree about it being an employers market. And I hollow laugh every time I hear anyone talk about "making work pay"....where is this work, and where are the wages to enable work to pay ?

My DH is going for everything he is capable of doing. Yet for every let's say, 20 jobs he applies for, he might hear back from 2. Gets spoken to like crap, even though he worked for nearly 40 years before he had to claim. It was the last thing he ever wanted to do. Every day I see the light go out of his eyes a little bit more, and like you, every night I listen to him tossing and turning and sleeping a little bit less. My heart breaks.

MrsVamos That's really sad hope he keeps going

So just because there is 0.fuckall % of people who choose not to work you think it is ok to start a goady thread.

I work and claim jsa. How do you like that?
Does that mean that i am a scrounger, a benefit cheat?

It's sad, yes, Grow but it's nowhere near as bad as some people have it.

I thank my lucky stars every day we all have our health, it could be a damn sight worse.

I have always thought that you should always think of the saying "walk a mile in someone else's shoes" before you judge.

You never truly know people's personal situations, and frankly I don't care who is and isn't claiming whatever benefits, if they need to, and they have been assessed as being 'entitled to' (because that's what it says on the letters that you get) then fair enough.

I am not in a position to judge anyone, and I don't.

I would also love to know how people 'generally' milk the system, from my experience it is very hard to get certain benefits, and for the life of me have no idea how you can 'fiddle'.

I think the saddest thing really is that there are twats who are involved in certain 'programmes' who told my DH that in order to get back into employment, because we lost our car, we should go to the bank and get a loan for a vehicle, or that he should go self employed and do it via public transport. Which would be brilliant, except that we have no income other than certain benefits, which would rule out the loan, and as for the public transport idea ? Great. Now tell me how a plumber does that ?

BenjaminButton172 it depends how much you work. If you work full time then yes indeed, you are a benefit cheat.