Why are so many people on MN so anti benefit bashing?

[Bearbehind]

Genuine question- although I am well aware I will probably get flamed for this.

Osbourne's comments in the wake of the Philpotts's about benefits supporting lifestyles which are disagreeable to most tax payers today has touched a nerve with many for varying reasons.

I've always been of the opinion that benefits should be sufficient for the basic necessities but shouldn't cover luxuries like cigarettes, alcohol, Sky, mobile phones or holidays, as they shouldn't be an alternative to working (obviously only for those people capable of working) yet so many threads on here say its none of our business to question what benefits are spent on?

Why is it so many people are happy for their taxes to fund the luxuries listed above for others when they can't afford some of them for themselves after paying tax!? Am I missing something?

[poppypebble]

Here the government's own figure for fraud is 0.7 per cent.

[Bearbehind]

Yay bibs you have put it far better than I have! Thank you- my sentiments exactly

[Sunnywithshowers]

Because I have seen what life on benefits is like, and it sucks rotting balls.

Because we shouldn't punish the majority of honest strivers for the actions of a few.

Because for every dingbat sitting on their arse living in 'luxury' on benefits, there are many thousands who are afraid of the next bill or selling their possessions to get by.

Because my DB lost 2 stone in 2 months because he had only £10 a week to feed and clothe himself after his bills were paid. [He is now working on a zero hours contract and doesn't know from week to week how much income he will have coming in.]

Because there are hardly any decent fucking jobs, and the price of everything is going up.

Because carers are paid piss all to save this government millions of pounds every year, but are still shit on by people who think that benefits claimants are all scroungers.

Because illness, disability and joblessness can happen to anyone.

[expatinscotland]

''sirboobalot' I have clarified that I'm not talking about people who are medically unable to work, I am referring to people who manipulate the system in order to avoid working in favour of a life on benefits which fund a lifestyle more extravagant than most of us who work for a living can comfortably afford.'

Of course. 'I didn't mean you! I meant them!' Naturally.

[williaminajetfighter]

Moomins. Examples like that are few and far between. What's sadder and much more prevalent are the households in places like Easterhouse with 4 generations of unemployment. That's just rotten.

JSA is not exactly easy to come by though. When my DH was made redundant a few years ago he was told he wasn't entitled to anything because we had capital - were half way through paying a mortgage on our flat. Was told we should sell flat and live on proceeds. Person at job centre even said 'you live on a nice street...' Nice. So JSA is not universally available.

[poppypebble]

Who is joining me as we pour over lists of the deserving and undeserving poor to decide who we should bash and who we shouldn't?

[FarBetterNow]

Pamelat: You are correct - NO ONE should be abusing the system.
Phillip Green, Jimmy Carr and the many other thousands of tax avoiders shouldn't be either.

[PeachActiviaMinge]

'sirboobalot' I have clarified that I'm not talking about people who are medically unable to work, I am referring to people who manipulate the system in order to avoid working in favour of a life on benefits which fund a lifestyle more extravagant than most of us who work for a living can comfortably afford.

So the 0.7% of claimants? I am so so sick of being classed as scum because of a tiny tiny handful of people. The only reason this makes the news is because so few people are doing it. I wish you could live a day in my shoes or PPP's and understand how hard it is to know so many people are looking down their nose at you when all you're doing is trying to survive, how it feels to have your childs teacher hand you a bag of school uniform because she's noticed your child's clothing is full of holes, how grateful and ashamed you feel, how much it hurts to not be better.

There is no safe place for people like us anymore, nowhere we can be and just forget all the crap in our lives for a little while, Somewhere to get some support and just feel human for a few minutes. We have basically nothing anyway now you're taking away the one place we could turn for a little support without being judged.

[poppypebble]

Some Tudor poor laws here, select which ones you think we should have put back on the statute books:

1531: If any man or woman are vagrants, they shall be tied to the end of a cart, naked, and be beaten with whips until their body be bloody.
1547: Anyone unemployed for three days is a vagrant and could be branded with a ?V? and given as a slave to the person who reported them as a vagrant. If a slave ran away twice he could be executed.
1572: Vagrants should be whipped and bored through the ear for a first offence; executed for a third offence.
Everyone in a parish shall make compulsory weekly payments to help the poor and sick.
1576: Parishes should provide raw materials for the unemployed to work with.
1598: Vagrants should be whipped until they were bloody, and then sent to the Parish where they were born. There they should be given work if able bodied, or put in almshouses if not. Persistent vagrants should be put in a house of correction.
Each parish should appoint people to look after the deserving poor, and collect tax from people in the parish to look after the poor.

[morethanpotatoprints]

OP, having come back to this thread and having read the post by Peachactivia I have reported your thread for its goadiness and the fact your wording is so offensive.

I'm not sure if you set out to do this but this thread is not good. I didn't want to leave without stating the bleeding obvious.

So sorry Peach

[Bearbehind]

freddie Have I once said that is what I aspire to do- strange assumption to make? I don't need to live on benefits, for which I'm grateful, but I can't imagine choosing to do so if there was an alternative, which is my point. If there is absolutely no other option then that is what welfare is for, but not instead of working for a fucking living when you are perfectly able to and there are jobs in your area.

[SirBoobAlot]

Less than one percent, you mean, then?

Go away and educate yourself with something other than a BNP leaflet.

[SirBoobAlot]

Peach completely understand how you feel.

Un-MN hugs to you.x

[Freddiemisagreatshag]

Oh. Right. All these fucking jobs. Where? Or didn't you notice the economic climate out there?

[FreyaSnow]

'What's sadder and much more prevalent are the households in places like Easterhouse with 4 generations of unemployment. That's just rotten.'

4 generations of unemployment (presumably not including school children). So that's families where nobody has worked since when? The twenties? The second world war?

Does such a family actually exist?

[Bearbehind]

morethan this thread isn't goady, report away if you feel the need, I have yet to hear a justification to change my views that the benefit system allows the minority to chose to live off it rather than even attempting to work because they can fund a lifestyle in excess of that which they could fund by working.

Those who need benefits because they medically or geographically can't work are not who I was referring to and you haven't grasped that.

[FarBetterNow]

Peach:
Please do NOT feel ashamed because of your situation.

I hope life gets better for you.

Ignore the ignorant people on here.
There are many good, kind people here wishing you well.
Best wishes to you and your family.

[Freddiemisagreatshag]

Do you mean that to sound so patronising and rude?

[FarBetterNow]

My ex MIL always whinged about people claiming benefits, but she also always paid tradesmen cash to avoid the VAT.

Double standards but she never, ever thought it was immoral.

[Bearbehind]

Not at all freddie I actually really don't think what I said was patronising or rude. Maybe that's my problem and maybe I will never understand this but how can you justify some people choosing to live off benefits for an infinite period when there are alternatives

[GrowSomeCress]

expatinscotland Of course. 'I didn't mean you! I meant them!' Naturally.


Do you not understand that it is possible for someone to criticise one sub-group of people within one group?

[pamelat]

Peach

I'm sorry

I'm sorry that things are hard for you

Maybe it is too easy to be cushioned from it when it's not you, if that makes sense.

No one means to hurt, people, including me on here, just feel misplaced resentment.

On an individual level most people do still care about others

[Freddiemisagreatshag]

Go live off the benefits for a year.

Then you might get it.

Good luck all, I'm out before I burst a blood vessel banging my head off the wall.

[usualsuspect]

Blah blah blah blah blah blah.

[hugoagogo]

they can fund a lifestyle in excess of that which they could fund by working.

The problem here is that work does not pay enough, not that benefits pay too much.

step up for a living wage