Hillsborough. Police did doctor evidence in a bid to avoid blame.

[Darkesteyeswithflecksofgold]

A report in the Independent about the cover up. RIP to the people who lost their lives on 15th April 1989.
And condolences to the families who are still suffering.

www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/news-and-comment/exclusive-hillsborough--police-did-doctor-evidence-in-bid-to-avoid-blame-8126233.html

I was 31. Watched it on the television. I have family in Liverpool. We didn't lose anyone, we were lucky. The police were bastards, the sun were bastards, the government were bastards.

The officials used the hooliganism excuse to cover up the tragedy to their cost 23 years too late. The sun should hang it's head in shame.

Just found this comment on the Guardian site and thought it was relevant as it shows why some members of society were so ready to believe the lies.

in the house?

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RuralRides
12 September 2012 9:09PM

How terrible it all is. But it's all of a part with a much bigger picture: the demonisation of working class people by the establishment, aided by the media.

Whether its riots, deaths in police custody, benefits claimants, strikes or the causes of the financial crisis, it's the working classes who are lazy, drunken, feckless, cheating and grasping. Or so we're told.

The report today confirms what any sensible person knows: that ordinary people are overwhelmingly decent and honest. Whenever there are extreme events, to blame them on 'the people' (usually the victims) is nothing more than an (oh so routine) attack by the powers that be. Yet listen to any news bulletin from the wonderfully impartial BBC, read any edition of any newspaper - yes even the 'facts are sacred' Guardian - and the same narrative is being pushed.

I'm not suggesting there's any kind of plot; everyone knows there's not.

Hope this doesn't sound ageist but what strikes me is how young most of the victims were younger than I am now. I keep thinking about Jon-Paul, the youngest at 10, he must've been so scared, my heart hurts just thinking about it.

I'm not sure if anyone has ever, or even can, quantify the entire devastating legacy. It's not, sadly, just the 96 and their loved ones.
What of the survivors lives blighted by injuries, depression, PTSD, marriage breakdowns, and the subsequent fallout as a result of these?

I'm haunted by reading that Trevor Hicks, for months afterwards, couldn't get the taste of his daughter's vomit out of his mouth.

Sorry if I'm rambling, I've been listening to 5Live and feel really upset and emotional.

may i just point out that the majority of the police on the ground on that day will have done their level best to help people.

i know that many of the officers involved were deeply affected by what they saw that day. There is no training on how to deal with disasters such as this on a personal level, those officers have been living with the after affects of this, and some have spoken out, and good for them that they have.

i feel so so deeply for the families concerned, but SYP is a different force altogether from that of 23 years ago. I hope very much that now the truth is out that the families can start to find some peace and justice for their losses.

i saw someone make a comment in the Guardian site that the Mail apparently ditched McKenzie as a columnist about a month ago.

and some have spoken out, and good for them that they have.
According to Newsnight - that's not the case. Apparently there haven't been any whistleblowers at all from SYP.
I know there was one SYAS employee who came forward.

some have.
i have to be very careful what i say, but some have. One retired officer gave evidence to the enquiry.

it is a very bleak day for SYP. It had to happen, its right that it has happened, but i fear that this tars the reputation of a force, my force, 23 years too late.

im disappearing back into obscurity now - i NC a while back and only reverted back so it didnt look sock puppety on these threads.....

im glad the families might now get their justice.

I once went to a first aid training course where Hillsborough was discussed. The trainer said that there were St. John Ambulance volunteers at the stadium, as there often are at these events. Some were cadets as young as 10 years old, fighting to save lives in a situation totally out of their control or experience.

I never believed the Sun even when the report first came out and would have boycotted them, had it not been for the fact my dad despised it and refused to have it in the house.

Something I remember, that seems to have been forgotten after the appalling lies printed in the Sun, is the fury towards all the papers, especially the tabloids, for taking and publishing photographs of the dead and dying. I wasn't very old at the time and I remember that as my first shocked realisation that the media didn't care so long as they got their story.

It's a shame that there's still a need for secrecy.
I suppose that's one of the reasons it has taken 23 years for the truth to come out.
I do think that for the majority of people the possibility that the reputation of SYP might be tarnished is not a prime concern - after what has been revealed today.
I do agree though, it must have been horrific for the officers working there that day. I don't see how anyone could get over it.

Dear Vicar. You really don't have to defend the current day SYP. If I remember correctly you have only been with them a couple of years or so. And I have no doubt that it is a very, very different force from 1989.

Same as WYP. No one here blames the rank and file coppers for the idiotic decision to take the Geordie Ripper tape so seriously, the same as how the junior officers at Hillsborough cannot be blamed for the actions of their senior officers. My DM's friend's husband spent years on that investigation and saw things he still cannot forget and he's been retired for years. He was powerless to influence the direction of the investigation but he still feels guilty about it.

Vicar I hope that SYP is a different force than 1989.

I am finding it hard to buy the defence argued on here that junior officers with families would have wanted to keep their jobs, and were pressurised into accepting the alterations to their statements. If that is accepted as an excuse, then it is also acceptable to allow Random's FIL to keep pedalling the lies.

We are talking about the Police Force here. Surely someone who becomes a Police Officer should have certain personality traits which would give them to have a thirst for the truth and a strength in the pursuit of it. Surely a main drive for taking up a position would be empathy with and a desire to protect the innocent. I'd expect that from a Police Officer, even in 1989.

These Officers protected their own backs, from the Senior ones right down to those accepting the alterations to their statements. I'm disappointed with their lack of strength to do the right thing. Even if it was 1989. Shame on them.

I hope every Police Officer in the country studies that report as an example of how not to behave.

Great post Growlithe.

I agree with you, and I'm glad that I know Vicar a little bit, and that is exactly the kind of officer she is. Let's hope that there are many more of them today.

I thought the guy who runs SYP today is one of those named and shamed in the Hillsborough report as being instrumental to the coverup (in the role he had back then).

Sorry, just read he's now chief of WEST Yorkshire Police.

Still in charge of a police force and many more involved will still be there. Thank god for vicar and people like her.

I've read the whole thread and have looked at lots of news websites and am just horrified at the level of cover up and deceit, those poor, poor families :(

I remember watching the tv reports on the day, I was 11. I was cross initially that fans were destroying the advertising boards by tearing them down until my Dad explained why I am nowhere near Liverpool but this event has stayed with me since it happened.

JFT96 YNWA

I've heard reports from police officers on the ground that day. It sounded like they had very little instruction and were very confused as to what was going on.

However, you only have to watch the footage to see that they could have done more from the outset.

Fans desperately trying to climb over the barriers being pushed back in. They could see the people crushed against the barriers, they could see they were dying, they could see reporters taking photos of these poor people. They still pushed them back!

When the pitch began to fill, it was the fans who took control to try and help the dying. The police tried to stop them "causing damage" when they ripped off the boards to use as stretches. Many police seemed to be walking around aimlessly.

There were police who did there level best to help. They tried to resuscitate the dead, that sat with the dying. They did their best in a bad situation.

After the event, they were led to believe that they all did a good job and it wasn't the fault of the force they belonged to. They were even compensated and offered councilling. Something the fans were denied.

It's unfortunate that todays SYP will be tarred by the actions of those in charge 23 years ago. But things have to be put right and I hope and pray that they are charged and convicted with corparal manslaughter.

The force of the boycott of the Sun is powerful in Liverpool.
I won't touch it, I won't look at its headlines, I turn over when its advert comes on, I would never go on a Sun holiday or take up any of their other offers. Same goes for most people on Merseyside, certainly those who are old enough to remember Hillsborough or who were told about it by older relatives.
Kelvin MacKenzie acted with utter disrespect with his repugnant actions and I hope he rots.

Yesterday was an emotional day here. I watched Granada Reports at 6pm and at the end, they showed a black and white reel of photos of all the victims, with YNWA playing over it. DP and I were eating dinner, and we just stopped. So many. 96 people, young and old. I hope they can now truly rest in peace.

JFT96
John Alfred Anderson (62)
Colin Mark Ashcroft (19)
James Gary Aspinall (18)
Kester Roger Marcus Ball (16)
Gerard Bernard Patrick Baron (67)
Simon Bell (17)
Barry Sidney Bennett (26)
David John Benson (22)
David William Birtle (22)
Paul David Brady (21)
Andrew Mark Brookes (26)
Carl Brown (18)
David Steven Brown (25)
Henry Thomas Burke (47)
Peter Andrew Burkett (24)
Paul William Carlile (19)
Raymond Thomas Chapman (50)
Gary Christopher Church (19)
Joseph Clark (29)
Paul Clark (18)
Gary Collins (22)
Stephen Paul Copoc (20)
Tracey Elizabeth Cox (23)
James Philip Delaney (19)
Christopher Barry Devonside (18)
Christopher Edwards (29)
Vincent Michael Fitzsimmons (34)
Thomas Steven Fox (21)
Jon-Paul Gilhooley (10)
Barry Glover (27)
Ian Thomas Glover (20)
Derrick George Godwin (24)
Roy Harry Hamilton (34)
Philip Hammond (14)
Eric Hankin (33)
Gary Harrison (27)
Stephen Francis Harrison (31)
Peter Andrew Harrison (15)
David Hawley (39)
James Robert Hennessy (29)
Paul Anthony Hewitson (26)
Carl Darren Hewitt (17)
Nicholas Michael Hewitt (16)
Sarah Louise Hicks (19)
Victoria Jane Hicks (15)
Gordon Rodney Horn (20)
Arthur Horrocks (41)
Thomas Howard (39)
Thomas Anthony Howard (14)
Eric George Hughes (42)
Alan Johnston (29)
Christine Anne Jones (27)
Gary Philip Jones (18)
Richard Jones (25)
Nicholas Peter Joynes (27)
Anthony Peter Kelly (29)
Michael David Kelly (38)
Carl David Lewis (18)
David William Mather (19)
Brian Christopher Mathews (38)
Francis Joseph McAllister (27)
John McBrien (18)
Marion Hazel McCabe (21)
Joseph Daniel McCarthy (21)
Peter McDonnell (21)
Alan McGlone (28)
Keith McGrath (17)
Paul Brian Murray (14)
Lee Nicol (14)
Stephen Francis O'Neill (17)
Jonathon Owens (18)
William Roy Pemberton (23)
Carl William Rimmer (21)
David George Rimmer (38)
Graham John Roberts (24)
Steven Joseph Robinson (17)
Henry Charles Rogers (17)
Colin Andrew Hugh William Sefton (23)
Inger Shah (38)
Paula Ann Smith (26)
Adam Edward Spearritt (14)
Philip John Steele (15)
David Leonard Thomas (23)
Patrik John Thompson (35)
Peter Reuben Thompson (30)
Stuart Paul William Thompson (17)
Peter Francis Tootle (21)
Christopher James Traynor (26)
Martin Kevin Traynor (16)
Kevin Tyrrell (15)
Colin Wafer (19)
Ian David Whelan (19)
Martin Kenneth Wild (29)
Kevin Daniel Williams (15)
Graham John Wright (17)
Tony Bland (22) - died in 1993

Liverpudlians and supporters have proudly fought a long battle to uncover despicable untruths. Reading news reports is shocking and heartbreaking. Amends must be made.

There will always be ignorant people that will refuse to be believe what the country now knows to be the truth. They will always believe Liverpudlians are "wallowing" in their "victim status" with a side of stealing. .

Reading through the report now. Shocked to find that the "pens" were added after the near disaster a few years earlier!!

Oh and I saw KMs statement. Seems he thinks hes as much of a victim in this as the fans...

My matchgoing experiences from 82-86 (before I moved to London) were much the same as FranticBanana's - there just wasn't that sort of atmosphere inside the ground. I'm not denying that there was violence of any kind, but we never saw it inside or felt in danger walking back from Anfield to the Pier Head to get the ferry home.

Never bought the Sun since (we were a Mirror family anyway, but before that sometimes it would sneak its way in if the shop was sold out) and never will agan - Kelvin MacKenzie can take his 'apology' and stick it somewhere painful.

My brother put this on Facebook last night:

I've just got home from St George's Plateau. I was there with my brother, who was at Hillsborough on that day. He survived, but you can tell there are wounds he keeps to himself. He now is finding it difficult to take in what came out today. People he never thought would do such a thing, contributed to what he saw that day. He, they, went to watch a football match. 96 never made it home because people got it wrong. But those people never admitted to getting it wrong. They blamed people like my brother for the death and injury on that day. And they've continued to blame them for 23 years, with the collusion of government and media. 23 years of people blaming you for the death of a 10 year old, a 21 year old, all ages up to 67. Then you find out you weren't to blame, this time decent, honest people tell you. It was your accusers who were to blame. It's hard to take in. I hugged him

I wonder if your experiences are based around specific clubs. The many places I experienced trouble were not often at the bigger clubs which, by the 80s, were heavily policed.
The day I had to hide fans in my home I was living in Leyton.
The boys I knew who went to prison were part of the 'Oxford aggro'