Troubled families have too many children ?

[BridgetJonesPants]

AIBU to agree with this article written by Louise Casey, the Prime Minister's troubled families tsar?

uk.news.yahoo.com/troubled-families-too-many-children-022219547.html

Although I have no idea how you can get 'these mothers' who have probably had a chaotic upbringing themselves to take responsibility for not having any more children.

I CAN help it. Which is why I have spent the last 10 years trying to get sterilised. I have had 3 pregnancies, two DC's (one was sb) since I first requested sterilisation, despite my best efforts. I am just thankful that I have finally got an appointment with the Gynae consultant to beg. But that is still no guarantee that he will put me on the list, despite a list of good reasons as long as your arm why I am requesting this.

If he refuses this time, I will be following it up with legal action to get the NHS to bloody sterilise me.

Why put arbitrary age limits on this, when a person who had their first DC at 16 may well have completed their family by 21.

As I personally would be unable to cope mentally with a termination, and I have tried EVERY contraception around and fallen pregnant on it (you can't take an injection wrongly, you can't forget to take a 5 year implant, and you can't take a coil wrongly, but I have still fallen pregnant using all 3 CORRECTLY.), I feel and have felt that sterilisation was the only option for me. And have felt this for a decade. But I was "too young" to know that. No. I had two DC's, a DD and a DS, and was happy there. Now I have an additional two DS's, who I live with all my heart, but have made my life so much more difficult.

I am unable to give any of them the attention they deserve, though I try my best. I am always split 4 ways, and sometimes it is heartbreaking, like yesterday when I needed to comfort my bereaved 14yo, but had a toddler that I couldn't take on the school site.

I would be in a very different situation had I only had two DC's. I wouldn't change my hectic madhouse for anything now, but I do often wonder how different my life would have been had I only had two DC's.

People talk about offering money for sterilisations whilst ignoring the very real fact that it is an expensive operation that is rationed by the NHS on the basis of age, and amount of living DC's. This will not be a 'workable' solution until sterilisations are open to all that WANT them.

The NHS isn't there for what people WANT. If you woudo be prepared to pay for legal action against the NHS, couldn't you just pay for the operation privately? Or not have sex? Or use a condom, diaphragm and spermicide?

Paternity testing. Right. Having personally BEEN through that with DD's father denying paternity, the solution is already in place. Those that genuinely have NO idea of paternity can't get maintenance.

Those that say XX is the father, but the father is on the birth certificate assume parentage even if they AREN'T the biological father ( that can and does happen, as long as the man goes with the mother, and registers the birth along with her, sometimes not realising that it WILL make them liable for maintenance for another Man's DC, in the event of a relationship breakdown. CSA assume parentage as the Birth Certificate is a legal document.)

Those that say XX is the father, XX denies parentage, and XX is NOT on the Birth Certificate, a DNA test is done. If the result shows that XX is the Father, then the cost of the DNA test is added to the amount he owes for maintenance, and is ultimately paid for by him (as happened in my case with DD).

The only thing that needs changing to the current system is in the cases where the Mother says XX is the Father, XX denies parentage, XX isn't on the Birth Certificate, and the DNA test shows that XX is NOT the father. Right now, the State pucks up the cost of the DNA test. IMO, the Mother that falsely accused XX of being the Father should pay.

That's the only tweak needed in the current system for denials of parentage...

I wouldn't pay, I have a friend who is willing to do the legal work pro bono if they refuse this time, after she looked over my medical records...

I can't AFFORD to pay privately, I can't AFFORD any more DC's, I have tried condoms, but have issues with them - I am SEVERELY allergic to spermicide, and I have yet to find an AFFORDABLE brand of spermicide free condoms. I cannot use a diaphragm due to the shape of my cervix. I had to have reconstructive surgery on it when I was 4yo not a story for this thread.

I have honestly tried EVERYTHING, even my GP agrees...

Carer, I cannot claim credit for the phrase "cunt-hatred". It was coined many years ago by Germaine Greer in, IIRC, "The Female Eunuch".

that the phrase still has so much resonance and (relevance) more than 40 years later.....

And right now, my only option IS the no-sex one. Barring twice in the time since my 17mo was born. And both times, that man paid out for spermicide free condoms. I am no longer with him as he refused to do so any more, saying he didn't like sex with condoms, and he had had a sexual health check when we first got together...

(There were other reasons too, general selfishness, and I have had too many abusive relationships to get into another.)

I AM breaking the cycle. I WON'T have any more DC's. But until the NHS agree to sterilise me, it's a fucking miserable, lonely life where I daren't get into a new relationship for fear that sex and possible pregnancy will arise.

Why should I spend the whole if my childhood being abused by adults, the whole of my twenties being abused by men that professed to love me, and my 30's as a lonely lonely person who daren't get into any relationship. What a lovely life.

Surely NHS sterilisation is cheaper than 3 pregnancies and ongoing care of the children?
Repeat this by the number of chaotic familiesout there add to the extremely fertile who contraception doesn't work for. Plus the extra benefits /CS involvement/school costs/environmental costs (delete as applicable).

BTW

Has anyone pointed out that this silly cow is blaming women alone? I'm sure someone has....but the stupid bitch is placing the blame squarely on the shoulders ofWOMEN! As though men are now part of gtting pregnant!

I agree that there is a mess...a mess of generational disfuncionaity...but this tory twat needs to come on here and DARE placce the blame only on women.

it certainly does take two to fall pregnant, but it only takes one to take the right precautions to not fall pregnant (bar the few where contraception fails). And since pregnancy occurs within a woman's body is it really that far out there to suggest that (some) women need to take responsibility for this?

Equally is it really that far out to suggest that BOTH take responsibilty?

Let's not forget the last government adviser who was taking public money for slagging poor families off was exposed as a very dodgy woman indeed... I'm sure Louise Casey is a fine upstanding citizen but it is not unknown for government advisers to be what you could politely describe as 'flawed'.

no, I think if men don't want to run the risk of impregnating someone the least they can do is wear a condom. That said, the bottom line is that is woman who fall pregnant, not men, so imo the majority of the responsibility for a woman not to become pregnant is down to her.

It's been said before...

But I think sterilisation should be freely available to anyone who wants it.

No titty...that is NOT the bottom line. Women CAN'T fall pregnant wihout a man to join in.

So it is equal.

Surely she is talking about family support workers - theta who goes in the make sure they kids get to school. Emporers new clothes again. Call me dave will reinvent sure start eventually

Kiss - you're damn right. It's an extremely sexist article/approach

pregnancy is not equal, it happens to a woman. technically men have a very small, albeit crucially important and essential, contribution towards that act of impregnantion, but ultimately pregnancy is pretty much dominated by the female. So imo it falls to the female to have ultimate responsibility for what happens to her body.

It is not solely her responsibility though how the child is raised and supported.

yes i would agree with that scarred, once a child is born (i.e. can no longer be classed as a pregnancy) then the responsibility should fall equally to both parents.

Is it because none of you have an answer either, preferring instead to rail at the entirety of social injustice instead?

The thing is penis none of us is paid to come up with an answer. Louise Casey is, and very well too, just as she has been paid since 1997 to come up with a solution for the homeless, and the anti-social and those lacking ?respect?, whatever that means. I think we should ask for our money back because she?s not delivering.

makes mandatory contraception seem like a justified option

Great idea, Tittytittyhanghang. What?s your plan to get medical professionals to open themselves to an assault charge and professional disciplinary proceedings?

It not about saving money really is it - its about punishing.

Xayide Agree, it?s also about diverting our attention from ministers who don?t have a clue how to run the country but want to get us fighting amongst ourselves instead of holding them to account.

Titty you said pregnancy is not equal, it happens to a woman

ONLY WITH A MAN'S HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!

kiss, i am assuming you didn't read the following words after that then. If pregnancy were equal, men would have have 'equal' say when it comes to ending it.

makes mandatory contraception seem like a justified option

Great idea, Tittytittyhanghang. What?s your plan to get medical professionals to open themselves to an assault charge and professional disciplinary proceedings?

Well, not that mandatory contraception is ever going to happen, but if it did, then im sure the powers that be could make it legal for medical professionals to administer contraception, forceably if needs be, legal. If you an't provide for any more children/are struggling with the children you do have then I can't quite understand why you would need to be forcibly given some sort of contraception, surely you would want it to prevent further pregnancies.

You mean eugenics, titty? Would you base it on mental or physical "defectiveness" or social class?

nope, everyone can have kids, they can even have two if they so wish. But anymore than that then then they better be prepared to, financially at least, take care of them.