farmers need a fair milk price

[cazboldy]

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/cuts-in-milk-prices-will-cause-rise-to-consumers-say-farming-leaders-7935411.htm

something really needs to be done about this - the government need to step in and sort out these supermarkets - not just for milk, but to ensure ALL producers get a fair price for the goods they produce!

whojamaflip Don't worry, I'm sure you are one of the good guys. Different people have different levels of what they will accept.

I am vegan, but have no problem with people who want to consume dairy. It is a personal choice for me, based on my weird moral code.

I just posted that up as you asked for an explanation - I have no problem with you :)

- no offense taken

We are a small dairy herd staffed completely by family so we can afford to keep going by the fact that I don't take a wage so personnell costs are kept down. Whether that be right or wrong, it would break my heart to see a dairy herd which has been over 90 years in the creation being sold and dispersed. so forgive me if I get a little defensive

whojamaflip - I wish I could buy my milk straight from your dairy!

I'm really annoyed with the co-op, who are now on my boycott list and I will be writing to tell them why. I really hoped they would be one of the good guys in all this.

I don't see why the dairy industry should be at the mercy of absolute free market capitalism.

Plenty of other things aren't, if, as a society, we decide we need them.

There's more to it than producing milk - there's the capacity to produce dairy products now and in the future, there's the shape of the rural economy and the 'look and feel' of the countryside.

I'm quite surprised how much of a 'suck it up' feeling there is on this thread, as I was quite disgusted when I heard what the supermarkets were doing.

NightLark

I don't see why the dairy industry should be at the mercy of absolute free market capitalism.

It isn't. It absolutely is NOT free market capitalism. It's corporatism, the stock-in-trade of the EU.

There is no free market here. Big business is colluding to push the price down.

Wjhojamaflip - as someone who has work with and on farms, I know how hard and expensive it is providing a high standard of welfare on your farm. YOurs sounds fab :)

The supermarkets are bastards when it comes to this. The general public needs to be aware of the pressure farmers are under and that standards will suffer unless our uk farming is supported. And that means paying a decent, fair price.

Far too many people shop in a 'corporate' way.. Looking for brands and not seeing anything else available and also within one giant label (like the coop, well marketed but absolute bastards to their uk supplier across all products)

Everyone on here has access to any number of alternative sources of dairy and all the rest of their food. Go look for box schemes, farmers markets, vital farm gate sites for meat, find a farmer who sells their produce direct, get your milk from a milk man. This is not part of the rural idyll, this kind of retailing is aimed at city dwellers, £ sense means that more customers clustered together means that a box scheme works.
There have been some great posts on here, we need use the knowledge to change how we shop so we get more money back to the food producers and so that less of the food gets wasted by the retailers ridiculous standards!

That's the thing though, the retailers standards are totally ridiculous and in more ways than one. We've started getting our red meat from a local farm shop. We're now spending £100 a month on pork, lamb and need, and we've never eaten so well ever. Supermarket meat turns my stomach now. It's underhung and overpriced.

We've been brainwashed into eating unnatural products at set prices. Watch the price of one of your favourite fresh products in a supermarket o er a year. Try and compare that to the nearest fruit stall to your work (you can probably pass one on the way to your sandwich shop) and you'll soon see how much you are getting ripped off by.

What I know about farming and economics you could write on the back of a stamp but it makes me very uneasy that potentially we are heading towards pushing local farmers out of business and becoming increasingly reliant on imported food goods.

I'm not saying we shouldnt import goods but when it comes to food we should maintain the skills and capacity to provide basic essentials for ourselves. I know we can't produce everything but why not keep those industries that we can do?

runnindownadream

What I know about farming and economics you could write on the back of a stamp but it makes me very uneasy that potentially we are heading towards pushing local farmers out of business and becoming increasingly reliant on imported food goods.

The UK was entirely self-sufficient in milk production until we joined the EEC and the CAP was foisted upon us. Now about 50% of the milk used in the UK comes from abroad, from countries with lower welfare standards or countries who only pay lip service to those standards.

I'm not saying we shouldnt import goods but when it comes to food we should maintain the skills and capacity to provide basic essentials for ourselves. I know we can't produce everything but why not keep those industries that we can do?

There has been a huge resurgence in 'local' farming in the last decade, along with brewing, cheesemaking and the like. But it's up to each person to make a difference by buying local and by telling their friends to do the same. Governments broke our farming industry, and it's up to us to fix it.

Is it that simple then? Just buy local and encourage everyone else to do the same?

I do use my local butcher who sources his meat and eggs from local farms but now I'm wondering where he gets his milk from! I've got a bit funny about where my meat and fish comes from over the years (i blame Hugh fearnely doodah and his tv campaigns)

Interestingly for a village butcher not everyone uses him I guess the supermarkets wins out on the convenience front but then apparently some villagers also refuse to use the florist as well

whojamaflip we used to have a dairy farm exactly like yours,the cows were known by name,mastitis and lameness were rare and male calves were not shot or sold for veal.Sadly we stopped milk production 10 years ago because it wasn't worth it anymore.My dad had to make my sister redundant.Once there were 3 dairy farms in the village-now there are none.

I'm not surprised at the CO OP screwing their suppliers-charity does definitely not begin at home as far as they are concerned.

runnindownadream

Is it that simple then? Just buy local and encourage everyone else to do the same?

No, there are other things which need to be done (such as getting us out of the EU so that we can run our farming and fishing industries free of idiotic CAP rules).

We can't change the EU but we can change our shopping habits.

I do use my local butcher who sources his meat and eggs from local farms but now I'm wondering where he gets his milk from! I've got a bit funny about where my meat and fish comes from over the years (i blame Hugh fearnely doodah and his tv campaigns)

Ask him then. If you don't like the answer, ask him whether or not he's considered buying direct from a local farmer.

Interestingly for a village butcher not everyone uses him I guess the supermarkets wins out on the convenience front but then apparently some villagers also refuse to use the florist as well confused

My mum is the same. She and my dad just got back from a (very wet) holiday in Ireland where she raved about the quality of the local produce. But, sure as battery eggs is eggs, she'll be in Sainsbury's at 9:30 on Friday morning.

whojamaflip - i like the sound of your farm very similar to our own ideas.... we only have 17 cows of our own though (all jerseys and ayrshires) which my dh's boss lets us keep alongside his larger commercial herd........

luckily my dh lives and breathes for his girls and he would never leave a sick/lame cow to suffer and does his very best to make sure that they are happy.

I do think that the holstein cow as a breed has been completely ruined by greedy people, and yes their longevity is not great, and they do suffer from more lameness and infertility - mainly due to the vast quantities of milk that they have been bred to produce.

I cannot see the point in having 10 000 litres for 3 lactations when you can have 6-8 000 for maybe 8 or 10 lactations, therefore needing less replacements also which are expensive to rear.

I completely agree with you that what Itsallgoingtobefine describes is not commonplace in the UK

the sad thing is that larger farms and perhaps more of these practices may increase with this slump in the milk price

The biggest truth about dairying is that if your cows aren't happy they just won't produce the milk - our girls have now chosen to come in at night cos its just sooo wet and they are miserable and we've seen a large drop in the milk they are producing. So the barn is now accessible for them and when I checked about half hour ago they were all tucked up in the straw, happily chewing away.

We currently milk around 70 cows and dh knows each one individually (I'm still learning but getting there ). He knows how each one acts and where they prefer to come in line for milking and if one acts out of character then he investigates further - I really don't think you can do that with larger computer controlled herds.

The sad fact is that its the smaller dairy herds which are going to suffer as they aren't able to weather price cuts as well as some of the bigger businesses and unfortunately I know of at least 2 herds near us which are going to be selling up in the near future

Bump with link to epetition.
Would like to support the farmers, and I think this is one way to demonstrate support

epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/6424

I'm finding this whole thing incredibly depressing from a consumer's point of view. Our local supermarket is Morrisons, we do have a Milk & More milk round from Dairy Crest which I gather is just as bad (in fact when I wrote to Morrisons about this issue they said that they get their milk from Dairy Crest). And I don't drive!

Yes, I suppose I could start getting internet deliveries from Waitrose if they're better, but I couldn't realistically do this for all of our milk as we get through a ridiculous amount (and the freezer's not big enough just to buy loads & store it in there). Or I could traipse into town every week to get milk from M&S, but this is a 25 minute walk each way & I don't usually tend to go in very often.

I'd absolutely love to do something to help, but other than writing to Dairy Crest and Morrisons to complain and request that they start stocking Fair Trade milk for people like me who would like to pay more, I'm honestly not sure what I can do. Although I guess maybe I've just answered my question in that second paragraph and need to do a combination of both of those things....

Anyway, feeling rather frustrated! Can anyone offer any suggestions which don't involve lots of driving???

I think that wanting to do something about it is a good starting point! and if enough people like you write to morrisons etc, and do their own little bit, then it will hopefully have a cumulative effect.

Just letting people know about it, educating the general public about dairy farming, and making people want to care is all a step in the right direction

I very much support the cause, however am a little "confused" as to how European farmers house their animals in worse conditions than UK farmers - yet are governed by the same rules.

they are not....

perhaps basic welfare rules, but our standards in this country are (rightly) much tighter.

not just welfare, but hygeine too

trouble is, as is the case with pork, and some countries still using crates, and eggs from battery hens, we cannot compete on price, but our quality is so much better, and also, importantly our welfare!

Is it only the farmers who provide supermarket own-brand milk who are getting screwed? If you switched to a branded milk like Yeo Valley would it be ok to buy it in Asda?

I think Yeo Valley buys from an organic farm co-operative, so is probably a good option

Supermarkets like Tescos et al DO pay a reasonable amount to the dairy farmers which are directly contracted to them and it is above the cost of production. Sounds great BUT the 300 or so which are on these contracts CANNOT produce all the milk that Tescos sell. To make up the short fall Tescos etc buy their milk from the common milk pool and so are paying a lot less. Still from a PR point of view it sounds good.

imo the companies that need lobbying are the main milk collection ones like Dairy Crest, First Milk, Arla and Robert Wiseman among others. They are the ones who offer the milk to the common pool and pass the pittance paid onto the farmers who are contracted to them. But you can rest assured that they will make sure they take their cut to cover their own costs (and profit!) which is why there is so little going back to the farmer.

I do think the only way forward is to give Fair Trade status to milk in this country like they have done for coffee and banana producers abroad.

Caz, I'm afraid you can't tar all of Europe with one brush. I for example, live in a country which treats its pigs horrendously, however we have the clearest and most hygienic slaughter houses in the world.

I've tasted milk all over the world from organic unpasteurised still warm in Wales though to uht in the far east. It's "different", but it's not fair to say it's all of lower quality.

Your cause is great, but it does sound a "touch" militant to make such generalizations - the word zealot springs to mind.