Private schools have lost their moral purpose - says head of Wellington

[RelaxedAndCalm]

here

"Leadership from the independent sector has been sadly lacking and it has failed to provide an inspiring moral vision for us in the 21st century."

I wonder if this will lead the Charities Commission to rethink their stance re charitable status.

France has private schools doesn't it?

LittenTree I didn't want to say the Brits were less evolved than other Europeans ...

Why is it just Britain that is afflicted with this mentality? It isn't of course, but as far as schools are concerned, it's a vicious circle. Inequalities in educational opportunities lead to a less equal society who live in ghettos of rich and poor. This leads to 'sink' schools in deprived areas which scare the living daylights out of the rest of us, and panic those who can afford it into trying to insure their children against the future by putting them in private schools.

I think I read that by most measurements British society is one of the most unequal in the world, although it is hard to believe.

Litten - don't be so sure of the French system. My French friend tells me that state school teachers in many schools have a nice little private tutoring business after school and any parent who does not pay for private tutoring finds their child left at the back of the class during 'state school hours'.

The hierachy of French university eductioon is vicious and class ridden.

The 'ENArque' class of French civil servants and politicians is well known as flatpackhamster rightly points out.

In France, private schools is where you send DCs who are failing in the state system. I lived in Germany. I knew not one, single DC at a private school. I cannot speak for the French Civil service, nor can I speak for, say, Sandhurst. But I can speak about what advantage your parent purchasing power can buy for you in the English educational system. And two wrongs, don't make a right. We have a banking crisis based on 'But everyone else was doing it so it must've been OK'...

So, I've cited reasons why I have good reason to believe that this mad private school scramble is an Anglo Saxon phenomenon, flatpack, you have said 'it isn't'. Cite your sources, pls. Show how it 'reveals' me.

Similarly, please show me where the idea that 60% of our society are 'a drain'.

Litten

It's true lowest 6/7 income deciles take out more in benefits on average than they pay in taxes. The BBC have a good graphic here

In 2010, the French lycée league table published by the Figaro newspaper had only 6 state lycées in the top twenty, while that published by the magazine l'Etudiant had only five state lycées among the top twenty, and the league table published by L'Internaute had eight public lycées as against 12 private schools in the top twenty. At secondary school (high school) level, about 20% of pupils are in private schools, against slightly less than 80% in public state school.

It's ridiculous to suggest that private schools are the problem. They aren't. State schools are the ones that are struggling. So improve them. Tell teachers and parents to get their act together or face the consequences. Hopefully Gove will do just that, no matter how much it upsets some people.

Josephine Some state schools are struggling. Some do better than some independents. People have been trying to improve the failing ones for decades and they're still failing. They're failing for a number of reasons, most of which are down to poverty.

Down to poverty in what way?

Don't think independent schools are alone if they have failed to provide an inspiring moral vision.Striking doctors, fraudulent bankers,expense-fiddling politicians, adulterous footballers anyone?
We send our two children to fee paying schools out of a pragmatic assessment of reality. I was a grammar school girl from the grim North who qualified as a solicitor and competed with kids from fee paying schools, but sadly that choice is not open to us where we live.The playing field is so uneven, and I respect teachers in state schools with a mixed ability intake, some of whom doubtless perform miracles everyday.I just don't see how they can be expected to compete with the highly academically selective fee paying school. I think the answer must start in primary schools, we should throw everything we've got at phonics and arithmetic, parenting classes and keeping libraries open!Maybe libraries sponsored by fee paying schools, or opening up their libraries to local schools.A library tax on bankers....

the doctors didn't strike...

And down to what poverty?

In countries with real poverty where people really starve, freeze or die from totally preventable deseases due to lack of sanitation or basic medicine children are known to walk for miles to school with very little food inside them because they appreciate the importance of education.

Low aspirations - what's the point in working at school when there are no jobs? Which leads to poor behaviour or truancy. A lack of resources at home, families not being able to afford school shoes and/or uniform so not sending their children to school, children not having breakfast because their parents can't afford food so the children are unable to concentrate in lessons.

Then you have the welfare issues that tend to go hand in hand with child poverty like parental mental health issues/ drug and alcohol misuse/ neglect/ criminality.

Say what you like about the parents but it's the children that are being failed.

When you say 'real poverty' I assume you mean absolute poverty?

I'm referring to people living in relative poverty in the UK Pianomama.

I didnt know there are different types of poverty.

Looks like there is a special type of hardship for "relatively poor UK people" which explains the failing education system ..

Yes, there's a type of poverty called relative poverty which explains some of the failings in some parts of the UK education system.

The people that are failing their children are their parents. There is NO excuse for children not having school uniform/shoes or not having breakfast, other than utter fecklessness on the part of their parents.

Yep..

Poor parenting and fecklessness is a reality in every socio-economic group.

Thinking about the children I've taught who have suffered in this way (and thankfully there haven't been many of them) the main cause has been MH issues in the parents. This made them unable to hold down and job and manage their income. I wouldn't call them feckless (unthinking, irresponsible, a bit of a waste of space) but mentally ill. Is that an excuse or a reason?

"Poor parenting and fecklessness is a reality in every socio-economic group."

Too true. Among the upper classes, feckless parents have the luxury of being able to afford to send their children away to board.

It is not about poverty and I think that's quite insulting to poor people who get involved with their child's schooling, take their children to libraries, hear their young children read etc.

You can be poor and value education, you can be poor and make sure your child does their homework and gets to school on time every day.

Children get free school meals, they will not be excluded from trips because their parents can't afford to pay.

The problem is not about poverty, it's about parents who are too lazy to ensure their children learn manners and respect for teachers, too lazy to pay attention to their learning and go to parents evenings and make sure homework gets done. Parents who can't be botherd to get their children out of bed and into school every day, and if they do they see it as free childcare, not education. It's about people not realising that education can improve opportunities because they don't want better for their children than they have for themselves.

"It's about people not realising that education can improve opportunities because they don't want better for their children than they have for themselves."

What if these people have, in successive generations, got from labourers to professionals through education? And now have the chance and money, through sheer hard work, to send their child(ren) private?

Why is it seen to be so wrong to claw your way up from virtual illiteracy only to stop short of that last step? Only so far but no further?

Because the jump from illiteracy to literacy is manifestly not the same as the jump from going to a normal school where you will be educated alongside children who live near you and will all learn to read and write together, and going to a school full of rich children who don't live near you and you can all learn to read and write together.

Private school isn't the last link in a continuum of improvement.

TheOriginalSteamingNit

Because the jump from illiteracy to literacy is manifestly not the same as the jump from going to a normal school where you will be educated alongside children who live near you and will all learn to read and write together, and going to a school full of rich children who don't live near you and you can all learn to read and write together.

Private school isn't the last link in a continuum of improvement.

So what is? Being rich and sending your kids to Stab Comprehensive because you want to use them to demonstrate your right-on credentials to the other Tuscan-holidaying Guardianista Islingtonites?