Time magazine image of breastfeeding

[banana87]

Apparently this image is kicking up a hot debate in the US.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/time-magazine-cover-showing-mother-828267

I really wish people would educate themselves about the benefits of extended breastfeeding before proclaiming its child molestation. Utterly crap.

But it is different. It isn't just cuddling-it's way more intimate than that.
A child might not feel weird about the memory at 10, but he may well at 13.

The only reason you might remember being bf and think gross is because society tells you so. Why on earth would you think feeding our most natural food source as unsavoury is beyond me. How very sad.

No, it isn't society at all. It is just that I wouldn't want to remember being that intimate with my mum!

yes its intimate but fundamentally its a cuddle with your mean and a feed, for food/comfort and there is nothing wrong with that. you are making it sounds sexually intimate when its not.

my children have/are being brought up to see bfeeding as normal, a nd body as something that is normal, so we are relaxed about nudity etc, i would imagine a child brought up to see it as normal wouldnt have an issue with it, infact on the link i put there were a few comments by older mothers who bfed their children till 3-4yrs and they have grown up just fine ,nor freaked out or traumatised by it. it is societal pressures and conditioning that makes people squeamish about this, in cultures where ist normal its just a non issue, there would be no need to have a times article about it as its just what they do and it wouldnt raise the debate and discussion that we have.

Yeah, like I said, I bf'd for a year, so obviously I think it's natural. I just think that stopping before a child will remember it is better.
And as for nudity, I saw my parents naked far more than I would have liked! That enduring image of my mum putting a tampon in whilst naked is one I wish I could erase from my mind!

I am fine with this picture. What bugs me is that the image of a mother breastfeeding a toddler creates so much "noise" when things that ought to matter more to us, eg kids having access to online porn (what was the stat this week? 84% of 10-11 yrs old regularly view online porn?)....

Well, that goes almost unnoticed.

Too much money being made by ISPs charging online porn sites, which apparently amounts to 2/3rd of all online traffic, at one end, and charging parents for anti-porn software at the other end.

Meanwhile, MN argues about breastfeeding or not, etc.

Actually, after checks, lots of MN discussions on online porn, so I am wrong. We also care about that.

2shoes - you asked why mothers continue to breastfeed their children when they don't "need" it. I could answer with a rhetorical question - why do mothers feed their children milk from cows when they don't need it? or orange juice when they don't need it? etc - but I won't.

The answer is three-fold, really: one is that breastmilk continues to have nutritional value, so there's no reason not to feed a child with breastmilk; the second is that it's a fantastic way of comforting a distressed child (in fact I sometimes used to wonder how non-bfing mothers used to manage); the third, and most important for me, was that some children still want it and just don't want to give up. I'd have given up long before DD was two if she hadn't continued to ask for it. But she wanted it, I didn't mind giving it to her (it was certainly a lot less faff than getting a drink from the fridge or finding a clean dummy), so it was win-win.

Comforting a distressed child errr you cuddle them.

Re nudity.We're comfortable re nudity but our eldest boys are 8 and I'm beginning to see that they're already getting slightly uncomfortable.As it is all about them and not about us I will respect that and make sure they can wash in private and not flash too much flesh.I don't think parents should foist nudity on kids if they don't want it to be frank.

i dont foist nudity upon my children but they do still see me naked, if i am in the shower for example my 12yrold will sometimes still come into the bathroom and chat to me, we dont have a lock on the bathroom door, if you want privacy you shut the door and then others will knock, well the little ones are so good at remembering this! and if i am naked or changing a tampon i may say i am busy can you wait, the little ones will want in the older ones will respect that and wait a few mins, but they have barged in from time to time and they either stay and chat if thats what they want or they go and wait for me to be finished.

equally they know if they want privacy they can shut the doora nd ds1 now 12 sometimes does, othertimes if he is showering he just pulls the curtain right across, or wraps a towel round himself once he is out. its def a gradual process and we go along with what they are comfortable with.

and yes you can cuddle a child to comfort them which i do but at times a bfeed was needed to comfort them even at almost 4, its just another parenting tool not always needed but at times was of great use. one is not better than the other, they are just different and some children need one more than another, they all generally grow out of it, bfeeding at least, hopefully they never grow out of cuddles, tho they may not like cuddling in public at times!

"Comforting a distressed child errr you cuddle them"

Or cuddle AND breastfeed them if that's what they and you prefer.

"I just think that stopping before a child will remember it is better."

Why? Because you think breastfeeding is actually a bit 'ick'? Do you not see that this response is socially conditioned and a reflection of our contemporary unease about and unfamiliarity with breastfeeding?

A number of artists portrayed the Roman myth of the daughter who breastfeeds her elderly dying father here. I'm assuming people didn't stand in front of the paintings (and there are a few by different artists) going 'oh yuck, how icky and revolting'. They stood in front of the paintings and were perhaps moved by the act of love and generosity that it portrays. Tells you everything about current attitudes to breastfeeding if you imagine the modern response to a story of a daughter breastfeeding an elderly parent - one of horrified disgust and sniggering.

Really, what's behind the outrage and hysteria over this magazine cover is the simple truth that we are so distanced from normal physiological mothering that these days, deep down, many people find breastfeeding intrinsically disgusting and/or see it as primarily something to do with sex.

Honestly don't get what all the fuss is about.

BF a 3 year old is fine, and normal in most parts of the world. So there's a photo of it on a magazine. So what?

"But it is different. It isn't just cuddling-it's way more intimate than that.
A child might not feel weird about the memory at 10, but he may well at 13"

Are you seriously saying that it does some sort of emotional or psychological harm to a child to remember being breastfed?

I mean - really.

zoob - but it migh traumatise a teenager if they remember being breastfed!

And it's not necessary. The mum can just squeeze the milk out and give it in a cup. Or just give cows' breast milk instead!

and double

[biscuits] all round.

I despair of Western culture. Sometimes the fuck-wittedness of it all just takes your breath away.

well i tell you what i shall come back in 3 yrs and ask my now almost ten yr old, who DOES remember bfeeding and isnt bothered by it, if he is bothered when he is 13?!!

anyway i showed the times picture to ds1 who is coming up to 13 and he said, "well you generally bfed sitting down or laying down so its a bit unusual but from an 'art' pov its a good picture" (he is quite into photography)

so i then said do you find it odd that the boy is still bfeeding, ds1 said "well he looks quite big but the article says he is only 3 yrs old" and then shrugged.
but i guess ds1 is unsual in that he has seen his younger brothers bfeed at 3yrs of age and he has seen me giving birth and he just sees it as a normal part of life, not freaky or wierd or sexual, just another natural function of a womans body. :)

5madthings - your son sounds great!

thanks shagmund i think he is too, but i would quite like him to get his hair cut its currently down his back past his shoulder blades, but the rule is if he washes it and brushes it he can do what he likes with it, if not we will get it cut, so far he is holding up his side of the bargain :)

oh and i agree with your posts btw, the problem is society and way it veiw bfeeding, not bfeeding itself, as i said in a society where bfeeding an older toddler is the norm, there would be no need for the times article, it just would never be an issue, its only an issue here becauseas you say "Really, what's behind the outrage and hysteria over this magazine cover is the simple truth that we are so distanced from normal physiological mothering that these days, deep down, many people find breastfeeding intrinsically disgusting and/or see it as primarily something to do with sex. :( "

"I despair of Western culture. Sometimes the fuck-wittedness of it all just takes your breath away."

indeed

I don't think your average teenager is remotely interested in how they were fed or for how long, they will just look at you as if you are loopy for mentioning it- unless their image is still on the Internet for anyone to find and then they may be annoyed.

It is different in the big wide world than it is on here, and I know it. I was BF, I do BF, yet I know that I wouldn't think twice at a child having a bottle in their buggy on the way home from nursery, but I, despite totally supporting it, and doing it myself, would still have the instant reaction of it being a bit weird if a child was breast-fed instead.

I shouldn't have those instant feelings, but I do, and I still feel nervous if on a very rare occasion my not even 2 year old wants a feed when out of the house in a way that I didn't when he was a baby.

I don't think this picture or article necessarily helps, but it does spark debate and discussion and that is the only way to promote widespread change.

Have asked the DCs (now 10, 14, 17) who were old enough to remember being bfed if they remembered it, and all said they did, none said 'ewwwww'. I know that DD2 used to reminisce with her little friend when they were 5 year olds about breastfeeding - the friend was also able to remember it clearly. They used to use the barbie dolls in their kindergarten classroom to breastfeed other dolls..

Oh, isn't it lovely when they pretend to bf their teddies, etc?

Professional hippy, Shazzie's daughter remembers BM as tasting of 'avocadoes and September' - also lovely.

None of us would think this was remotely ick if our culture hadn't appropriated female bodies in general and boobs in particular as objects for sexual activity. Also, the horror that - !women might enjoy the sensation! - !they might take pleasure in intimacy! - is only a problem if you view (female) physical pleasure as necessarily sexual and necessarily corrupting. Such dullness of thought it's hardly worth engaging with, except of course that it continues to oppress me personally and women in general (even those firmly opposed!) on a day to day business. Seriously people - if you have the 'choice' to read the Sun in public, next to me and my child, I have the right to whip the boobs out to feed my son. I find it hard to comprehend why it is that I'm viewed as the corrupting influence, I'm viewed as the deviant in that picture. As a lecturer in critical theory, I'm going to have to fail of you that think this is so.

Nice post Sparklyboots, especially "such dullness of thought it's hardly worth engaging with" I liked that bit !

The fuss people make about bf, really. It's bizarre. I am sure it's got more to do with the general being-critical-of-women-to-make-them-nervous-and-keep-them-under-the-thumb than anything else. Like making a big fuss if a perfectly normal, healthy pregnant woman wears skimpy clothes or eats brie. Have they nothing better to fuss about? If they want to vent their feelings, moan about the way some women in the US don't get pre-natal care due to lack of health insurance. Oh yes, the plummeting infant mortality rate is not provocative enough, is it?