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Why you shouldn't support legislation blocking internet porn

899 replies

Andrewjh · 07/05/2012 00:21

Ed Vaizey and Claire Perry and a number of other politicians are trying to force ISPs to block adult content under the pretence of "think of the children", however this will have the opposite effect and could lead to children being exposed to far greater problems.

  • Children these days are very tech savvy, especially with regard to the internet. And they need to be - the UK is the largest internet economy in the world. To succeed in the UK in the future, you'll need to know your way around a computer and around the internet from an early age.

  • What happens when ISPs block sites is something called the Streisand Effect. Basically by banning it, they generate a huge amount of publicity and support for the sites. The Pirate Bay site last week got blocked in the UK, and it received traffic increases of 12 million users downloading millions of pounds worth of software, music, films and games. Blocking something increases its internet traffic, its exposure, and suddenly 30 times more people know about it than did before.

  • What also happens when you block these sites is a huge amount of internet users figure out free and easy ways around the blocks. ISP's don't have the resources to stop this, and in most cases, it is impossible for them to do so. anyway. The Pirate Bay blocks can be got around within 20 seconds, and that is just googling "how do I get around pirate bay blocks".

  • Many of the methods employed by users to get around the Pirate Bay blocks so they can illegally download files will also be posted as guides to get around porn blocks. These are accessible through any search engine (google, bing, yahoo).

  • The problem is that tech savvy children (it only takes one to find out how from the internet or an older brother, then tell his friends, who tell their friends etc) can easily find out how to get around it. I mean it is as easily as it is to look up something for their homework, if not easier.

  • The other more dangerous issue is that whilst once they've gone through those guides, they can easily find links to far darker sites which host horrific viruses, hackers, as well as references to drugs, drink and other adult content. They can also find links to anonymous chatrooms where they could meet anyone without you knowing.

  • This is the danger that opt in and blocking poses. They will give you a sense of security when there is none.

  • This is also based on the assumption that the block actually blocks all porn. They rarely ever do, and sites posing as sex education sites which don't get blocked get through with adult content. So you'll be under the illusion that the internet is safely blocked when it isn't.

Think of it like this. Imagine the internet is a cliff, and we are having a picnic at the top of the cliff. It's a mostly beautiful view, but if you let your guard down, you could fall off. You wouldn't let your child play near the edge. Installing the opt in system is like putting a strong looking but flimsy fence in place. You could be fooled in to thinking it was safe but left to their own devices your child, could easily fall through. We can't put a brick wall there otherwise it spoils the natural beauty of the view (the educational benefits of the internet).

So what to do? Firstly don't support legislation calling for blocks. It doesn't work, its been shown not to work in the past as well as more recently. Children can easily find a way around it, and in doing so find a far darker side of the internet.

Secondly: If you are concerned, use censoring software on your computer, but don't be content with just that. Use Browser tracking software like this - www.any-activity-monitor.com/free-browser-history-recorder.html so you can accurate tell what your child has been viewing, even if they delete it off the browser. There are also many simple, free and easy tutorials written online on how to better protect your computer and your child.

Thirdly: Take some time to talk to your child about internet use. It can be an amazing tool but it can be dangerous. They need to know that right and wrong, safe and risky, they all still apply online (something easy to forget I assure you). They'll avoid things if they know its wrong. They will be curious about things if its only blocked.

Lastly, don't be fooled by people using the "think of the children" line. It's an alarmist appeal to emotion. There is very little danger so long as you use your common sense and only allow a child a sensible amount of time on the internet. As a politics student, I have to question whether this has been saved up till now to gain support for the government after an miserable turn in recent polls.

Thanks very much for reading, I hope you'll consider your position.

OP posts:
DioneTheDiabolist · 13/05/2012 22:10

I would like an Opt In option for adults who wish to access porn. I get that this wouldn't be a perfect solution in preventing children from viewing porn, but nothing is perfect.

I don't really understand the argument that porn sites would find ways of circumnavigating this. Does this mean that porn sites are actively trying to attract child viewers?

chandellina · 13/05/2012 22:10

I contest this conclusion that the UK has no chance of enforcement powers beyond its borders. We have scores of agreements with other countries on tax evasion, money laundering, environmental regulation, financial regulation, the list goes on. Again, imperfect but still fairly effective.

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:11

Get a grip NOvack, Im not the one going on in circles about what WONT work. That has been done to death, its boting hearing about how it doesnt work..

We get it.

I am trying to move this forward onto what WILL

NovackNGood · 13/05/2012 22:11

You are educated to the dangers of the internet as you are about the dangers of exces salt, road traffic etc.

It is now up to you to decide how to make your home environment match the level of protection you desire and to educate your children of the boundaries you want them to respect outside your own home.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 13/05/2012 22:15

starwisher it has already been explained that you simply CANNOT make all the porn on the internet pay to view. Certainly not with legislation, and not with current or any predicted or likely future technology. So that argument is not worth banging on about.

What we need to do is come up with constructive, workable ways of addressing the issue. Ways that will not involve somehow controlling the internet as that is a non starter.

Heres a suggestion :

Could the government legislate that all computers sold must be sold with filtering software that is pre-activated to the highest possible settings.

That way non-interest savvy people would have by default a computer that is unlikely to access porn. The more IT literate could customise the filter to better fit their needs.

What do you think?

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:15

Itsall

That is so very naive. Sex education will not stop people looking for porn. I imagine most porn users have had a formal sex education.

Edith maybe someone might have children who cannot be trusted- do you not think your own dc might occasionally veer off or are they perfect?

How about other children, do you not care what they are exposed to?

NovackNGood · 13/05/2012 22:16

Yo have been given countless solutions. Sing up to Talk Talk, install your own filter, avoid giving a child a smart phone unless you make it clear that the contract is for and under 18 year old.

And as Edith put so well:

And if you have DCs who you cannot trust to follow house rules if you are briefly absent when they are on a device with appropriate software and in a communal area, then you probably have wider behavioural issues to tackle as well as their online conduct, all of which fall under the recommendation for education and parenting.

ravenAK · 13/05/2012 22:16

Porn sites wouldn't circumvent it Dione - the porn site just sits there, it doesn't reach down your broadband cable & reel you in.

Teenagers would circumvent the (useless) ISP filter in order to access blocked sites.

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:20

Itsall

But your still risking children being able to alter the setting themselves

How about people with older computers? Not everyone can buy brand new

Would this be compulsory on tablets and phones too? Again, your relying on everbody being able to afford new phones and tablets

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:21

Novack, quoting edith on that when you said yourself how you went behind your parents backs is a tad ironic.

Empusa · 13/05/2012 22:22

Technology isn't the solution for that. How do you think that would work?

The only way you could get all porn sites to require a credit card is if you could get the site owners to agree.

Also, would you want user content led sites to require a credit card, just in case someone uploaded porn to them?

ItsAllGoingToBeFine · 13/05/2012 22:24

starwisher

Home filtering software is no less secure than ISP.

Over time everyone would come to have it. Yes it might take a couple of years, but would get there.

AFAIK porn circulated on phones (don't know about tablets) is via bluetooth so no form of internet filtering would have any impact.

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:24

Add message | Report | Message poster chandellina Sun 13-May-12 22:10:43
I contest this conclusion that the UK has no chance of enforcement powers beyond its borders. We have scores of agreements with other countries on tax evasion, money laundering, environmental regulation, financial regulation, the list goes on. Again, imperfect but still fairly effective.

The problem on here is people seem to think as things stand they can never be changed. They look at what is current and not what is possible ;things can and will be moved on. Like life really.

DioneTheDiabolist · 13/05/2012 22:24

I get that teenagers will do all in their power to circumnavigate the controls. And at that age, it is about education about what porn entails and it's possible impact on burgeoning sexuality. Just as it would be if the Internet didn't exist.

However, I my support for an Opt In is more about the 8-14 age group, who are more likely to google porn out of curiosity and boredom. I would like them not to find any.

Empusa · 13/05/2012 22:25

"We have scores of agreements with other countries on [snip]"

But not all. And it is simple to set up a website that is hosted in a different country to where you are based.

ravenAK · 13/05/2012 22:26

You set access to adjusting the settings to be password enabled. I can't change the settings on my PC at work - I have to email a techy if I want to change so much as the time limit before my whiteboard screensavers!

You buy a second hand computer or whatever, obviously you sweep it (it'll be full of viruses in all likelihood) & install one of the readily available free filters.

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:26

Itsallgoing

You can also download porn Apps.

chandellina · 13/05/2012 22:32

Empusa, lots of things have been made harder to do though. File sharing sites regularly get shut down and users are fined.

Empusa · 13/05/2012 22:33

"Empusa, lots of things have been made harder to do though. File sharing sites regularly get shut down and users are fined."

Oh you mean like the piratebay?

EdithWeston · 13/05/2012 22:33

"do you not think your own dc might occasionally veer off or are they perfect?"

They may well veer, and it's silly to suggest any child is perfect. I am doing everything I can to educate them, whilst they are still under my sphere of influence, about both porn (that is, as part of the wider task involving relationships, sex, respect, morals and ethics) and about online security. And there is no evidence to suggest that the house rules have ever been broken.

I cannot know for certain what they do when not at home. But that would also be true in terms of alcohol, drugs, horror films etc. The best defence I can give them is imposed standards (with explanation) when young in the hope these form the basis of their self-discipline as young adults.

ravenAK · 13/05/2012 22:39
Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:44

Napster was shut down

Empusa · 13/05/2012 22:47

Napster shut itself down.

Starwisher · 13/05/2012 22:47

Because it forced to

Empusa · 13/05/2012 22:50

Sort of. They didn't want the legal battle, they decided it was easier to shut down. I think there was also the added reason that they saw they could reopen as a pay site and make more profits than they would as an illegal download site. (Hence why they reopened as a pay site)