so, we are all shafted then. public sector workers in poor areas to get pay freeze

[ThatVikRinA22]

here

this is a great idea. NOT.

as a fairly new police officer, i was horrified to read Windsors 2nd review, basically, as a 40 year old woman, i would not have got in to the police service under these new recommendations. The police will lose all their protected rights but still not have the legal right to strike.I am still wading through it - this job is far far tougher than i thought possible, and at the end of most shifts i look back and think "i was in real danger there...." Reading it, it looks like it is stacked against older officers and women, and if you are injured (even while on duty) and on 'light duties' for more than 12 months, they can get rid of you.
Thats before they make the fitness test harder for older officers and increase the retirement age/pensionable age to 60, (but i know i wont be rolling around on the floor with people at 60, or running a fitness test - they will have rid of me long before tha,t i suspect) as it is we have a 2 year pay freeze with then only a 1% increase for the following 2 years, and they want to reduce the starting wage by £4500 while asking that you have a degree to join....it is ludicrous.....this is all while numbers have dropped and police budgets lessoned by at least 20%, in reality i can see since i joined that our numbers are less and it makes the job dangerous - i have been in really precarious situations where i needed back up and there has been none (im thinking of one particular night shift where there was myself and my female colleague being the only available car left in our district when we got called to a burglary in progress in a remote scrap yard with no back up available)....anyway enough of me....

because now, our dear PM has decided that teachers and nurses in poorer areas should have a pay freeze because they live in a poor area and obviously dont need as much to live on for that reason, while teachers in more affluent areas should be on more money.

i wish i could say i was incredulous. sadly im not.

' i wonder quite how this government are getting away with all this?'

Let's see if New Labour oppose it. Are they "all in it together?"

I know that in my heart of hearts, Vicar, but police are effectively being made into employees instead of sworn officers and crown servants and, imo, that should afford them comparable rights.

There will be a big increase in private policing. Expect a related rise in corruption, bribery and ineptitude. Imagine your average security guard but suddenly given a whole load of extra power with no real responsibility
Scary

thank you mrsM. i agree entirely.

Where is the opposition in all of this? like claig says - where is New Labour? or anyone!

we are going to end up with no NHS, or a two tier NHS to start with before they do away with it altogether
Slum schools where no teacher wants to teach due to the poor wages and conditions
a privatised police service.

and some very rich politicians and wbankers.

none of this can be good for our country really can it?

Labour are totally for regional pay. That sad excuse for a politician Harriet Harperson was saying on Sky that they supported it.

I thought the Opposition were supposed to, well erm .... oppose?

Stitch up all round.

Well this hasn't surprised me at all, what with the Tory bastards having an absolute hatred of public sector workers and poor people. With this they get to shaft both, woo hoo!

So the private sector get paid less than the public sector do they? A nurse, doc or physio in private practice earns less? I don't think so! The NHS IT professionals, the accountants etc earn less? Really???

I work in the NHS and live in London where we have London weighting. I used to work in zone 2, so got "inner Lonon weighting" . I now work in zone 3, so get "outer London weighting". My commute to work costs the same, my living costs are the same, but I get paid 5% less because I work in the suburbs. So it already makes no sense! My trust recently changed it's alliance and now staff who rotate go to a large hospital closer to the centre rather than one further out. But because they were originally employed to work further out they will not get the higher wieghting so they will be working alongside other staff doing exactly the same job in exactly the same place but earning less. Surprise surprise people are resigning in their droves!

I cannot say this often or loud enough... I FUCKING HATE THE TORIES!!!!!!!!

We're now paying the price for the decline of Unions.

Perhaps they were too powerful in the 70's but the pendulum is swinging too far the other way now and with weak unions, we are being shafted.

"I thought the Opposition were supposed to, well erm .... oppose?"

As Ed Miliband was speaking in January about regional levels for benefits, and has had his support for regional variations to the Minimum Wage on his website for ages, then I think it's safe to say this is (yet another) policy that the coalition has nicked from Labour.

They really have it in for (state) teachers and nurses don't they. I don't understand the logic of the proposal. They are arguing that the private secotr cannot compete with the wages paid to public sector employees but how can this apply to teachers and nurses who could be paid more money in the private sector doing those jobs. I'd like to see a proper mapping of like for like jobs and see which jobs in the public sector really do pay more than jobs in the private sector.

You will have to bear with me here as I'm not politically savvy by any stretch

I work in the Armed Forces - pensions have just been cut dramatically and seems to have gone completely under the radar

My concern is that yes we are all basically screwed money/pay freeze wise here and now in 2012, but in the private sector when things change financially in the future as in when there is a boom, won't the private sector see this reflected in there wage? Whereas we will be left with the changes made now for ever more?

I do get slightly when people try and compare certain public/private sector jobs.
Especially for jobs such as police etc

I know several teachers who went abroad at the end of last year - I think that lots of talented people will be looking to work elsewhere if they can - doesn't make sense to stay in the UK if you don't have to at the moment. But its fine, because all schools are going to be academies and they don't have to have all there classes taught by qualified teachers.

They can set their own terms and conditions too - which actually might not be awful - we have got private health cover since becoming an academy. THough whether there will be as many teaching jobs in school in 5 years is anyones guess.

They are aware that graduates won't be able to afford to go into teaching - so we are going to get apprentice teachers - who needs to go to university full time??

Pay freeze, increased pension contributions, lower pensions, higher retirement ages, easier to fire us, no notice inspections, removal of satisfactory grade, lots of teachers are leaving the profession, fewer are training. I worry about my kids education.

We are also losing police to Australia and abroad, i am seriously looking at Australian police before i get too old, after all, whats to stay here for? And who could blame a nurse or midwife now for going abroad where their skills are recognised and their excellent training rewarded? or blame a teacher for going into the private sector?

How is it these proposals are just popping up in the news over and over again unchallenged?

Why won't graduates "be able to afford to go into teaching"?

If you look at how many public sector workers there are, it simply wouldn't be feasible for them all to go into the private sector, there isn't enough jobs there.

Look at it this way grag

the private sector is going to be swamped with "new" recruits all of which (if this goes ahead) the company you work for can pay less than you.

who are they going to employ? in a capitalist market it really isn't that hard to figure out.

The Civil Service started moving jobs out of the SE back in 2006 - something that was not noticed by anyone else, by the comments on this thread. But the definition of the SE stretches as far west as Southampton and up as far as Oxford. Thousands of jobs have been moved to Wales, the North and the Midlands. Thousands more have been cut completely. It is a policy that is continuing. Having moved all these posts now they are going to cut their pay? Yet their justification for moving them was that these were areas with few alternatives.

We moved from SE to SW and I can't say I've noticed any drop in living costs. Electricity, petrol, council tax all pretty much the same. House and car insurance is far higher here. Got a much smaller house for the amount we sold our previous one. DH is in the private sector in a national organisation and the pay is the same wherever you work.

The SE is overcrowded. There isn't enough water and the roads are overcrowded. We really don't need a rush for everyone from the rest of the UK to be relocating to the SE.

The information we received on the pension reform said it wouldn't affect too many people as anyone earning under £21k wouldn't be affected. They quoted a figure of something like 70% of civil servants earned less than this figure. Yet believe the media and we are all overpaid.

Because a uni graduate with a decent degree from a redbrick uni with a sizeable amount of student debt is not going look at teaching, 21k -31k (rising to 38k, if they get through threshold) as an attractive post-uni option. When are they ever going to be able to afford to rent or own their own place, constantly servicing uni debt on that wage? Perhaps just before they retire at 68?

As the only one of my graduate friends who went into teaching I earn the least. In fact I am the lowest paid out of my extended family, none of whom went to uni! I also work very similar hours to my friend who earns megabucks.

I am quite sure teaching is not unique in this regard but it's the one I know most about. I saw a post by a nurse who said they thought nursing would go back to not requiring a degree.

That wa the reason fo London weighting. Should be extended to other areas, not used as another excuse to undermine public services

'I work in the Armed Forces - pensions have just been cut dramatically and seems to have gone completely under the radar' - Well the index has been altered from RPI to CPI, and there will be AFPS15, but all rights are supposed to be preserved on transfer, and the AFPRB are fighting HM Forces corner. If you are within a certain period of time before your termination date, then you will get your AFPS75 or 05 pension as agreed.

Vicar - at least you have the Fed, HM Forces have nothing.

Scary I do understand and it doesn't look bad written like that, but I lost tens of thousands overnight and I can't make up the 14 years lost expecting to get that pension. Many, many others in the same boat. I would have saved more/bought property, generally made different life choices, but the gratuity and pension was always my nest egg. I think many are shocked it can just be changed and taken away like that. Meh, I could always vote with my feet but I'm in it for the long haul now, as I chose to stay in when I had my DC .......for the pension too late to start again now at the bottom somewhere.

I do have a cunning plan to live until I'm 101 to get my revenge I gave up my social smoking and any form of stress in order to achieve this - so it's not all bad

My husband is in AFPS75, and 23 months from his retirement date at 53.

Having seen the DINs that have come out about the pension, I think your pension to date will be preserved and not lost. Yes the change to CPI is a bugger, but as dh keeps pointing out, the UK is broke. I had a scan through the AFPRB12 report that I found a link to on Arrse, and they seem determined to make sure that the Forces are not shafted pension wise.

I have to say I am glad that dh is retiring when he is. We were talking to a friend who is in MoD for his last year, and he says morale is lower than a snake's belly, and there is no money with which to do anything.

It's true but the pensions are only really good after the 22 year point where they sort of mature - I don't have 14/22 in the bank as it were, I think a lot of people don't realise that, and think they will be getting more than they will. I've definitely lost around £16,000 from my gratuity (and that's now only if I get to the next rank up) so it's a significant amount but hey ho it won't change it's done now. It shows the state of the country that this has gone unreported I think. It's a big deal from within I can say - lots I know are now planning to jump ship. Really feel for those on the front line

Yay! As of 1 Jan 13 I shall no longer be a public sector worker. I've managed to get out on early retirement with my pension intact.

Private sector - here I come!

"35
But niceguy the job is the same whether you live in London or Leicester"

most private companies have varying wages across the nation dependant on living costs in that area. the typical wage for the same job with the same company can vary quite a bit from region to region.

Well done Witty! Go you!

Cheers Vic! Still trying to get my head round it as only found out at 6pm today and got home to find offer on the doormat!.

Can't wait to tell the staff tomorrow!

Can't wait to tell the boss - even better!

Freedom after almost 4 decades!!!!!!