Term-time holidays to be banned, with fines.....

[LilyBolero]

Discuss

Pootles, they were talking about £100 PER DAY or £1000 PER OFFENCE....

How to criminalise parents....

Also, bear in mind, the parents who send their kids to private schools will still be able to access the cheaper holidays, because they have longer holidays.

I'm guilty of taking my kids on ski holidays this year and last for 1 week each. We saved £3000 compared to going over the half term. We couldn't afford to go then. My husband (the master of booking last minute holidays) is ski mad, and now the kids are (we did book with work/school much earlier). My daughter, last year, was top of her class with her SATS despite of our holiday. We read every night, I get my kids to do extra work (like learn their times table which they don't do at school). In previous years, I've taken my kids abroad to see their grandparents. The fact is, seeing the world, spending time with others, doing different activties is educational, influential, occasionally life changing. It's a privilege, and hopefully not just for rich people.

I care greatly about my kids education, their teachers, their school and have never felt guilty about taking my kids out of school for a holiday. I've never found their education to be suffereing from it, imposed on the teachers. I've always requested permission in advance, and have been granted it. My kids go to a nice state primary shool where there is an almost 0% truancy rate.

I suspect the problem is not people like me, but truancy. And if that is the case, they are doing nothing to solve that problem and just creating more problems like:

- pushing honest parents to lie about their time off intentions.

- reminding people that wealthy people can take any type of holiday they like, and the rest of us can lump it.
- parents should not be trusted to be responsible for their kids, the state needs to impose even more rules (instead of picking on problem parents/kids, impose a rule on everyone!)

MrsHeffley, I did read the thread.

I guess part of the problem is people being so psyched up about foreign travel,and thinking it is in any way essential.

If your kids have never been on a plane, big deal, so they will enjoy it when they are older (grown up) or maybe never feel the need for it.

We spend holidays often at friends or family, or they with us. Most fun my 2 have ever had was camping in their uncle's garden. And having a friend for a sleepover. Kids don't need more than that IMO.

I think the combination of the glamourised view of foreign travel with a contempt for what you get for free (education) leads to people thinking it is a "right" to take hols in term time...

To me education is just so much more important than travel. But I guess I am old fashioned.

Missing 5 days at the end of a term isn't missing out on an education.Kids will learn more in those 5 days out of school than in.It's very wrong to think kids only learn within the 4 walls of a school-they don't,they learn everywhere.

I agree they learn everywhere.

But why limit it to 5 days? Would you take them out 10 days? or 5 days every term?

Others might think nothing of taking them out more than 15 days? Half a term? where does it end????

Are you saying MrsH, that it is o.k. only for 5 days? in that case you almost agree with me.

and if you really think they learn as much outside school as inside school, why bother with school at all? is it just free childcare to you?

I agree with this completely.

There is nothing wrong with going on a cheaper holiday out of term time, and I think the excuse of not being able to afford it is bollocks. If you can't afford it you can't afford it, that's life. Children don't have to go on holidays abroad to learn stuff, and I don't believe that all parents who take their children out of school are going on especially educational holidays.

I feel for people who have family in other countries and who have real difficulty going on holiday in holiday time, but I think that if it were only the parents that had a genuine problem that ever did this, then school attendance wouldn't be so bad that this has to be implemented.

actually it is chandon. free childcare. Bloody love it

My kids go to a state primary, there are lots of authorised holiday absenses. There is a very low truancy rate. The school is usually on top of it's table.

I think the problem is cultural rather than procedural. Gove is solving a problem at my kids school that does NOT exist. The culture at my kids school is responsible parents/kids.

I can remember being taken out of school twice when I was little - once for a family holiday which was 'once in a lifetime' to a tropical location - we never went on a trip like that again until I was well into my teens, and I was made to keep a diary and do maths lessons while I was away so that the teachers could see I'd been keeping up with my work - and second time to go to a memorial service for my Grandad (I mainly remember the posh lunch we went to afterwards :) )

After that, nothing happened outside school holiday time because my mum was a teacher anyway, apart from lots of absence for prolonged orthodontist trips when I was in my teens. Even now I can remember feeling resentful at having to go back to school when I had had teeth wrenched out and had cotton wool wedged into my mouth to soak up blood...surely a bit harsh not to let me have the rest of the day off to recover from a pretty traumatic experience?

What surprises me now is that illness, from what I understand, seems to be treated as 'absence' - surely being ill is an acceptable reason and shouldn't affect a child's attendance record? What about doctor/dentist appointments, do those count against a child's record? I find it all terribly unfair tbh...

I know illness is a separate issue from time off for holidays but as someone preparing for parenthood I find the whole prospect of schools now being so pushy and picky about these things rather off-putting.

If your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

Gove's tool = fines

So, if truancy is THE problem
(1) lets REdefine truancy = any absense (that is not illness) to include the middle classes
(2) fine everyone for absense

Applying the tool:
(1) Fine people
(2) they will be too broke, upset, humilated that they wont do that again
(3) Problem solved!

Somehow I'm guessing his truancy solution is not going to work. Though, he may raise revenues for schools. Clever git!

It's always the way that those with lots of money are the ones saying "If you can't afford a holiday don't go on one, that's life". I doubt they would be saying the same if they were working their arses off for not much money and needed a break.

We had the odd fortnight out of school when I was little. Didn't stop me getting 10 GCSEs, four A levels and a degree. I'm not saying that to boast - I imagine most posters here would be able to say the same. But Gove's looking at the wrong people.

No Chandon 5 or 10 days are fine.I am the first one to do the upmost re my kids education and would never harm it any way(like the maj of parents actually).Having been a teacher I know 5 or 10 days once a year could not harm a kids education only enhance it.

Don't get your logic,it's like saying either eat a little crap food or none. Actually a little choc or wine can be good for you but all the time obviously not.

5 or 10 days isn't going to have an adverse affect on any kids education only enhance it. Continual truanting week after week does. They are two entirely different things.

And yes the main objectors to this are those who can afford the full price and resent others paying less,them and those in the Tory party who are obsessed with truancy figures and are prepared to crack them regardless of what is good for all kids rather like healthy snacks and food in schools too.

Nanny state they proclaimed to be against when it suited.

Wonder what Gove will do if someone cant afford the £1000 fine. Prison? Children taken into care. Lose school place. No education.
He hasnt thought this through.

Ooops sorry didn't mean to highlight all that,didn't know you could do that.

Should we ever get the odd hundred quid for a holiday we'll have a family bout of d&v,would love to see school(who won't actually care) prove otherwise.

I'm hoping this is a 'leak' to test the water and not actual policy yet.I have taken my primary aged dc out of school once,for 1 week.They learnt no end,a new language ect,visits to monuments as well as having fun.The week they missed was the last week of term,and the 'work' they were missing was mostly playing games and watching films.I'd have more reservations about taking them out if they were missing actual school work-as it was they learnt more than they would if they'd stayed in school.

I resent being told that the government knows what is best for my children,as it is they spend a long day in school,they will have to stay until they are 18 and there is the threat of longer days.When do they actually get the chance to be children and have fun? I value education greatly,but education isn't exclusive to schools and sitting in a classroom.I've certainly learnt more out of school than I ever did in.

Our school is outstanding and doesn't have a truancy problem,but there are lots of families who work in agriculture or tourism,for low wages and can't take time off during the holidays as it is their busiest time-lets penalise them because someone somewhere can't be arsed to take their children to school.

Education is not free - it is paid for by our taxes.

I might not write out a cheque every term, but I definitely consider that I am paying towards the cost of my kids' education.
On that basis I am not going to lose any sleep over taking them out for a week or two per year. In primary school at least.

Hear bloody hear, mirage.

There are so many families down here for whom the six weeks of the school summer holidays are when they make a large portion of their living, me included

MrsHeffley, I suspect you are right. If this rule goes in and head masters aren't allowed to decide ... there will be a lot of cases of D&V in school kids.

Maybe Gove could also get the airport security/border guards to act as truant officers.

I think holiday companies will cotton on to private school term times and adjust prices accordingly

Also, last 6 weeks of summer term us actually the beginning of the school year here for us. No parent ever takes dc out in run up to summer break here. Maybe Gove will ask all schools to do this? It works well actually as timetables/classrooms etc are all sorted, so come sept it's straight back into work and all the newness was addressed back in the summer.

I also predict sick notes from gp's will be asked for!

God the timing on this. After seven years I have never taken mine out. But I need to take them out for one week next september to see family. Family who will be finally near enough to us that I have not seen in 3 years and miss desperately. Family my kids have seen a small handful of times. AM I going to be penalised for this.

If they do bring this in then they should think about staggering the school holidays across the country as they do in other countries so that not all the schools are off at the same time

So what happens then if you have two children at school in two different counties as you live near the boarder or want to holiday with family that live in another county - you will not be able to have a family holiday with staggered holidays it would be a nightmare - there is a whole thread on this for Nottingham where they have different holidays and it is causing widespread problems apparently

Lol I have 5 children in 5 different schools !! ( come summer 2 will have left tho)