do you htink its a BAD thing that fathers 4 Justice has been disbanded or not

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they havent managed to achieve anything so it doesnt matter anyway

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I think if it is run in the right way, there is a need for such an organisation. I've witnessed the damage mothers can do to their children who have perfectly adequate fathers that are denied access.

it is a bit of shame about the 'splinter' groups

they just were/are bullies

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i think they have done the right thing tho

cant have fathers for justice fighting for the right to see their own child when involved in kidnap (even if it was the Real Fathers for Justice)

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I got the feeling that there were good reasons why some of the fathers didn't have access to their children (violence etc). They didn't give a good impression of their group generally imo.

does it remind anyone of life of brian? ' judean peoples front? f-off, we're the peoples front of judea!'

Woah, what's happened? F4J has called it a day?

My dh's brother is going through similar. He didn't have his kids for Christmas either. He loves them to bits, but their mum says things like "Your dad's stupid" and "he's a shit father" to them. She told them that they couldn't have a Christmas tree or many presents as he hadn't given them enough money, then she jets off on holiday for 8 days on Boxing Day! She's also told him that once she sells the house she's going to move away with them.

IMO he is the better parent, but you try telling any court that!

did you see jeremy kyle yesterday

a 21 year old dad raising 2 kids on his own cos the mother had been in prison for 2 years, then when she came out she told him they werent even his (kyle did dna and they are his after all)

it was so sad

he seemed a great dad

he was desperate for them to be his

was so happy when kyle said yes they are yours

or at least i think that was the story, couldnt hear it properly over noisy toys

No- think it's great that these fools have disbanded. The issue is real but they were/are divwitted eejits who gave non-custodial fathers a bad name. There are pleanty of reputable fathers groups out there to carry the torch for father's rights. Fathers Direct seem good,

There will always be examples of spiteful mothers and father but overall I think F4J was an appaling organisation which went about everything in entirely the wrong way, they did decent fathers no justice at all. Glad they're gone - one less thing on the TV that makes me feel like throwing something heavy at it!

Posts crossed SM - agree!

Have they been?

In a way, no. The reason they would have been disbanded, is because they attracted such loonies that they couldn't control them, hence the need for expulsions and splinter groups.

As they had been so successful in their publicity campaign, they were attracting more attention from the press and were being asked to me more accountable. This they couldn't handle, because inevitably any close look at them would reveal the holes in their thinking and attitudes to family functioning after break up, and in the personal histories of the men involved. A man like Eddie Gorecki for example, who is or was (I can't remember whether he was chucked out) a lynchpin of the organisation, is so unsavoury, that he simply isn't presentable because his behaviour and attitudes don't stand up to scrutiny.

And in a way, I think the fact that F4J were an umbrella organisation for so many nutters and they were desperately trying to keep them on a leash, means that now there's nowhere for these nutters to go, which may mean more dangerous or lunatic stunts from independent madmen. Batman may have been a twat, but at least he wasn't kidnapping children or putting anyone else's safety at risk.

I disagree that they haven't acheived anything btw. They've managed to make the public believe that the primary contact problem after relationship breakdown, is that of bitch harpy women denying contact to loving fathers just out of spite. When in fact, as most people who know lone parents or are one, know, the major problem is trying to get fathers to honour their contact commitments and maintenance payments. Most people aren't talking about how disgraceful it is that men can't be arsed to turn up for contact visits or mess about with times in order to exert control over their exes; they're talking about how awful it is that mothers deny fathers access. And that's largely down to F4J. They've been very successful imo.

if F4J had had a woman in charge it wouldnt have been in the mess it got to

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I think there is a definate need for an organisation like this, you see so many men who would be, if they were given the chance, fantastic fathers, and they want to be fathers to their children, yet sadly due to a breakdown in the relationship with their partner they are not allowed. Imagine how that must feel?

The most important thing (IMO) that F4J did was to bring the matter to public attention. It's sad that recent events have caused the group to disband, even if they did have a generally unusual way of getting their point over.

i meant they havent achieved any changes in the law, which i suppose was their ultimate goal. but i agree they have made the public very aware

Individually, they didn't have an unusual way of getting their point over. They generally hit their wives to get their point over. That's not unusual at all.

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They may not have acheived changes in the law, Nailpolish, but they have achieved changes in practice.

The number of men with a history of domestic violence ,who have been granted sole contact with their children, has risen enormously in the last few years. And the presumption of contact at all costs, irrespective of the behaviour of the father, is the norm rather than the exception. I believe that must be because of pressure from F4J.

is it not just political correctness

bend over backwards to help the criminal (sweeping statement)