Longer school day and shorter holidays, proposes Gove

[Morebiscuitsplease]

I cannot understand this man. Children need time out, teachers also need time to prepare and mark work, when do either get this with such proposals? We complain our children are obese yet suggest more time in school. I do not want any child of mine going to school for 7.30 and finishing at 5. They need time to play, pursue other activities and do homework. Your thoughts please!

well they can do that by providing cheap/free wrap around care for those that NEED/WANT it rather than implementing a one size fits all for schooling.

even if i wanted to work it wouldnt be possible with the shifts my partner works anyway, i dont see why parents like myself should have to send their children to school for such long hours when it is of no benefit to me or them. and i support my dp to be economically active if i was out at work there is no way he could do his job, which is one that is emotionally and physically draining and in high need (working with children in a home for SS)

Not sure longer day benefits children, it may help working parents but is it really in the children's interest. Tired, overkworked children will not thrive or do well educationally. It's about balance, time for creativity and enjoyable activities which may help them. Reading, sport or dance/drama classes, brownies guides, whatever they may be into. Teachers work hard enough and adding more to their workload will not benefit children.

In France, where the school day is very long, there are lots of suggestions that it needs to be shortened - French school is not very productive and the children get very tired.

This is not about trying to improve education, he is trying to peddle the myth that we work between 8:30 and 3:30 so he can continue to cut our pension , start on our pay and turn public and private sector against each other .

As others have said independent schools have higher staff ratios, Smaller classes and more access to specialist staff. It is also not true that there are no extra curricular opportunities for state school children, including after school.

I run three extra curricular clubs which run at lunch time and after school. As well as constantly running short term clubs . Many of our students are doing something after school. It is exhausting though, I provide something every lunchtime and two or three nights after school. My daughter is at a small and rather average primary school, she is in school until 5pm three nights next week. Ironically the other 2 weeknights she is watching or taking part in things at my school until 8pm. She cannot do anymore than that, especially as she has homework and extra curricular activities on top of that.

I cannot and will not do anymore and resent the idea that because of that I do not care. I am in school every day from 7:15am until 6pm and take a few hours of work home every night. I will not do anymore.

Part of me thinks this is all hot air because we cannot afford to pay for the changes for this to happen . However because Gove seems determined to drive teachers into the ground it would not surprise me if he tried to make us work running all these extra clubs without paying us more or reducing other commitments.

I am not a mug and therefore I will not do this. I also do not want mugs teaching my children, so I hope no one else does either .

Don't they have Wednesdays off though?

And longer holidays?

The idea that it's good for working parents is OK until you realise women's unemployment is highest for 23 years, youth unemployment is huge, private sector isn't replacing public sector cuts. So it's not for that reason.

Feenie - there is no school on Wednesday, but it isn't exactly "off". It's when children do all the activities that are not included in the school curriculum (religion, sport, art, music).

I see, ineteresting. Thanks for explaining that, Bonsoir.

interesting

Hmm, well dd's Belgian school is open 7.30 til 6pm. School hours are 8.25 - 3.30 Mon, Tue, Thurs, 8.25 - 12.15 Wed and 8,25 - 2.30 Friday. The out of school hours are covered by "educatrices" not teachers. So people trained to work with children but not teachers. They also cover gym/swimming lessons, weekly workshops where they do crafts, IT, cooking etc, homework and lunchtimes - there are various clubs. The teachers do the teaching, the educatrices do the the non-academic stuff.

In my opinion it works well. You have the option to leave children to do homework at school if you want/need to, but it's not compulsory. In fact SAHPs mainly take their dcs home for lunchtime. The place is not full of crochety, exhausted children at all. But I think it makes the world of difference that Primary starts at 6 plus rather than 4. And the maternelle classes between 2.5 and 6 are learning through play.

Is this all academic anyway? When we all become academies HTs will be able to decide on the schools' working hours.
I just read on another site that one teacher's new-formed academy has already cut his holiday entitlement to 35 days.

I have no issue with the school being open until 6pm, to be honest I don't have an issue with doing something with the students once a week until 6pm. I do have an issue with being expected to do it. I have an issue with the implication that I am living the life of Riley and it is the least I could do or that if I don't want to work anymore hours on top of the long hours I already do I am lazy.

I also think something has gone very wrong if we need to ship out young children from 8am unit 6:30 pm every day.

Though of course this involves employing extra staff! I think dd's school which is 2 classes per year group has about 8 educatrices. I pay about 35 euros per month to cover lunchtime, Wed pm and afterschool.

Or 7:30 until 6:30 even.

I used to need childcare from 7:15am until 6:15pm every weekday when my dd was about 5 and this lasted three years. Our family was very unhappy, my dd was a nightmare and dp and I were close to breaking up .

Bonsoir- but lots of children don't have a good environment at home to do homework- overcrowded housing, damp and too cold to sit at a desk, noisy neighbours, illiterate parents who don't know how to do any of the work, homes with no books/Internet, etc. All children should have a right to an environment suitable for learning. Providing homework clubs is decidedly cheaper than rehousing and adult-educating a few million people.

Cailin- when new schools are being built they should have this in mind and from what I know of new schools is that they have plenty of room for extra clubs.

The small cost of cleaning and insurance is tiny compared to what is saved by preventing tomorrows educational failures and social problems.

well then provide out of school clubs on a free basis for children from poor families or those shown to be at need. but plenty fo children have nice homes and supportive parents and dont need to be at school for those extra hours.

I don't want longer school days and shorter holidays. My children do before and after school clubs but the latest they finish is 4.15. This means they have time to play out, lounge in front of the tv and go to clubs outside of school where they make other friends.

I went to school in Holland and I really loved my Wednesday afternoons off :)

School is important but is shouldn't take over home life.

Extended schools (similar to the Belgian model which Portofino talks of) were mooted by the previous government and they didn't cough up the money to fund it. Gove wants to do it for free by making teachers do it.

I agree 4madboys. I have run homework clubs for children from homes that could not provide a safe or quiet environment to work. We also fed them, sometimes did their laundry, de nitted them and even allowed them to have a shower. Surely the country is not in that much of a mess that most parents need this kind of service.

kellog i hope not! and i dont think it is and live on a council estate, our house is privately owned, many are not but most of the children here have nice home lives. my dp works in SS so he sees the worst cases, yes there are some neglected children out there, but thankfully they are the minority. we need to target the education system to help these children, bfast clubs so they can start the day having eaten well and after school support so they can study, maybe have dinner etc but not everyone needs it or wants it!

schools arent there to provide free childcare, however much many parents would like it to be, if you work then campaign for good quality low cost childcare, but i see no reason why long hours at school should be forced on all families, we dont all need it.

Cailin- when new schools are being built they should have this in mind and from what I know of new schools is that they have plenty of room for extra clubs.

Not necessarily so, VictoriaLucas - our PFI school was built to the smallest square footage per child that was legally allowed at the time (it has since changed). There is no room for anything. 60 children have to use a cloakroom that is smaller than my bathroom at home.

We used to have lots of classes in the evening (Brownies, judo, etc) but the PFI company charge so much to use the school that now absolutely noone does. The school is shut from 6pm onwards, and there is nothing the school can do about it. They open very begrudgingly for parents evenings/governors' meetings but that's it. No community use whatsoever.

Portofino - that Belgian model sounds good. I also want emphasise that even in my DSs school there is no compulsion to stay after 3.30.