Absent fathers to be made into scape goats

[ivykaty44]

absent fathers

as a single mother who has lived without maintenence for periods of time and at times struggled to make ends meet I still think it is awful to suggest making a group of people stigmatised.

there are good NoneResidentParents and there are useless NRP, it isn't just absent fathers but sometimes absent mothers. What sort of country do we live in thuogh where we would want to stigmatise a whole group of people.

Better to keep the CSA free and make it work rather than the clerical mess it is at the moment.

What? Someone you know had "late teen" kids (how late? Wouldn't they either be working, in training or at university so living off loan and grant anyway?) and then popped out 4 babies? What, quads? Or 1 a year or something? Do you really think that such an unusual case, is a good starting point for discussing the 60% of NRP's who don't pay maintenance?

What is your premise? That people should never have more babies with a new partner?

So a woman is not to have any more children after separation because it might be unfair on the NRP to continue to contribute financially while she doesn't (even though she is still caring for those children, providing a home, providing food on the table, helping with homework, ferrying them around, etc etc).

That's just bonkers.

Unless an NRP is earning mega-bucks, an NRP's financial contribution towards a child, especially if set at CSA rates, in no way reflects either the money spent or the time and effort spent by a resident parent.

Especially since if the PWC does work the NRP makes no contribution toward childcare even though they have the benefit of childcare provided free of charge by the PWC.

Hi HerBex BTW. Getting de ja vu yet?

I just knew I shouldn't have clicked on this thread. Was planning to have an early night and now I'm all ohFFS again.

LOL I know the feeling.

Some people are simply determined to pretend that mothering is a worthless skive aren't they?

Why, I wonder?

"What is your premise? That people should never have more babies with a new partner?"

No - if you look back at my post in response to xenia, I made the point that ANY parent who goes on to have subsequent children, by definition, spends less on the first. I did not any point assert that this was immoral or wrong, just a simple fact. But for some reason it's seen as acceptable for a PWC, but not an NRP. Odd.

"Some people are simply determined to pretend that mothering is a worthless skive aren't they?"

Would you like some vinegar with that chip? I am a mother

Have you actually read the thread?

I can't be bothered to discuss anything with someone who come on at this time of night talking about chips tbh, I think it's probably pointless.

And I think it's probably pointless for you to ignore the context of my post to try to make some meaningless point that is unrelated to my post. Anyway, as you were

This thread is ridiculous. It seems that some people consider money to be the king of all things, and that nothing can compare. Personally, I see nurturing of a child to be far superior. You wouldn't pretend that even the most expensive, fabulous highly qualified nanny could love your child the same way you do, would you.

And even if the resident parent has another child, there may be less money to go around per head, but the first child(ren) is still being fed, clothed and loved. You don't stop doing these things just because you've had another child.

I say again: Unless an NRP is earning mega-bucks, an NRP's financial contribution towards a child, especially if set at CSA rates, in no way reflects either the money spent or the time and effort spent by a resident parent.

Anyway, seeing as the argument is completely circular I am off to bed.

Night all!

Well thanks to all the cuts and the recession, ExH is about to become an absent father.

Until now he has been there for DS and provided financially when he could, however things have gotten so bad here that he is moving to London on Wednesday as it is the only place where he can get a steady paying job. DS will be lucky if he gets to see him five times a year.

So Mr Cameron, before you start stigmatising Absent fathers, maybe you want to ask yourself Why are they absent?

BTW, just so yis all know, I don't really like my Ex, but I could not fault him as a father and my DS adores him and will now grow up without him.

"It seems that some people consider money to be the king of all things, and that nothing can compare" - hahahaha. Talk about circular. The main jist of this whole thread is about NRPs and money, and now you don't understand why the discussion is centred on money?

Did you think I'd left? Just had a last check before retiring.

There is nothing contradictory in what I've said. I have said that maintenance cannot even compare to what the resident parent does day in day out. With that in mind, paying maintenance is the very least a non-resident parent can do.

Ah Dione, there's Skype and other webcam systems now, and 5 times a year isn't too bad if they speak regularly by webcam...twice or thrice a week, every day if that's what they want... don't be too down-hearted, I think with contact, it's quality not quantity that counts, and as long as it's consistent and regular, even if the actual physical contact is infrequent, your DS won't feel he's growing up "without" his dad. Don't forget that as he gets older, he can stay with him in school holidays for longer periods as well. It must seem very hard at present though, it's a big change for your DS

"Did you think I'd left? " why would I talk to someone if I though they'd left

Actually Dione I have quite a lot of sympathy with your situation. But then your XH is not really absent is he. He will still see your DS (albeit on a less regular basis) and presumably because he is moving to take a steady paid job he will continue to pay maintenance. That's not an absent father at all.

FWIW I am quite happy for maintenance to be off-set against time spent, which I see as far superior to money because, as I said earlier, nurturing is priceless. My DC's father is an abusive idiot, so he's not a good example, but my previous partner had a DS from a previous marriage and was so dedicated to his child that he spent a huge amount of time with him and paid no maintenance. That is perfectly acceptable in my book.

I keep reading the Gingerbread quote that 60% of NRP don't pay maintenance, and it doesn't really say that in the report.

I think the statistics are being used in a misleading way.
Probably accidentally though.

Like I said earlier Truck, Gingerbread and our own government have no problem accepting it, but I'm sure you know better. If you're that convinced they are all wrong, show them the evidence and get them to change it. You won't be the first.

"FWIW I am quite happy for maintenance to be off-set against time spent," - well done you sunshine. Unfortunatley DH's ex is of the "pay and don't be heard" variety. And there are a hell of a lot of this type for whom the more contact = less money for me thinking is used to deliberately withold children from their father.

The law actually encourages NRPs to be 'hands off'

HerBex it is going to be a massive change for him. Earlier this year his dad was working away for 4 weeks (they spoke on the phone). During the last week, we were talking about how he would see his dad that weekend and DS said "I don't remember what my daddy looks like" and went on playing. The worst thing was he said it in such a matter of fact, unemotional way. He's only four and will start primary school in September, so although we will be putting technology in place that will help communication, it's not the same. I worry that as time passes their relationship will be a fun, holiday one, rather than a proper parent child one.

Also, we live in Northern Ireland, so it's always going to be a flight away, I think I'd feel better about it if it were a car or train ride away.

Families need fathers is also government supported.

Should I trust that organisation?

Oh yes that is a bummer Dione. Plane journey is a different kettle of fish to car, train etc.

Can see why you're upset about it.

allnew I dispute that assertion. I won't deny that women like that exist but they are in the minority. Most women are desperate for their XP to be involved - to give them a break! Unless that XP is abusive of course...

On the other hand, some men do try to gain extra time with their DC deliberately to reduce the amount of maintenance being paid and also to 'punish' the resident parent. Quite often these men are abusive. Again, in the minority but maybe they cancel out the minority of women who are deliberately with-holding contact out of spite.

Which brings us back to a majority of NRPs contributing no money.

Doesn't take long to get off the subject of NRP's who don't pay, to evil bitch harridan exes does it?

It's would be funny if it weren't so depressing.

Anyway I'm off to bed.

G'night all.