Teachers to strike - 30 June

[meditrina]

breaking now on SKY

Overwhelming vote by 2 teachers' unions (92%)

No union reps - no one wants to do it. Didn't know that though. Thanks for the heads up. I'm NASUWT though - I did reply to the email, as it mentioned NUT, ATL and NASUWT. I pointed out in my reply that NASUWT haven't balloted members.

Batteryhuman, I know that many lawyers, especially in small, suburban practices earn modest salaries. Getting out of Practice and joining the banking sector was the best thing DH ever did both financially and in terms of his stress levels.

Just to clarify, I don't agree that the stike will do any good either though I think someone should wonder why a union such as the ATL are striking when they don't, as a rule.

Nor do I think teachers work harder than anyone/everyone else. I was responding to a post further up the thread that said that teachers are so poorly qualified that they really couldn't do anything else professional and therefore should be grateful to earn what they earn. I don't find inaccurate insults like that help at all. I think many non teachers on this thread would be surprised to discover that the majority of teachers, certainly at primary level, are really not very militant at all and just want to get on with doing the job they love.

Fair enough! Someone can be temporary rep in that situation, or there should be an area rep.

Yes support them every worker has right to strike
ballot was undertaken properly and votes cast
i also see why they are aggrieved

If headteachers aren't allowed to ask who is striking, then how do parents know whether their child's teacher will be there on the 30th June?

Not saying that teachers should have to reply to emails sent out by headteachers, but as a parent I would like to know whether we need to get up that day or not :)

Its ok to change conditions for new entrants but those who have been teaching for a while should have the conditions they expected when they signed up.
We are a family with several teachers and several schoolage children.

Just to say that I am now 67-I literally could not and should not be teaching now,as apparently many will have to.A class of 30+ 15 year olds is never easy and the older you are the harder it becomes.I loved my job until I turned 50 then gradually it became harder and harder.
I was lucky enough to have been able to take early retirement and a reasonable pension before the quality of my life and the quality of my work diminished.
How many of you want your dc taught by someone who is exhausted and unable to deliver the education they deserve?Think please-make teachers stay until they are too old to do the job-there will be fewer posts for young teachers,promotion prospects will be blocked and the curriculum will stagnate.Its not just money you know.

Teachers are on a low (if not the lowest) paid wage for post graduates entering work.

The holidays are evened out by the long hours worked on an average week.

The pensions teacher pay into are not public money and will not affect the deficit.

Teachers have as much right as any worker to fair pay and pensions.

I am not a teacher btw. My retirement age/ pension release age is atm 68 and I'm only 30. My union wants to ballot to strike.

Not until the Rt Hon MP's have their Pensions savaged and their employment terms and conditions re written will I condemn any public sector employees for taking strike action.

I think there is certainly an issue hear about 'the deal' that public sector teachers 'signed up for', the same as nurses etc signed up for....Lesser pay but job security and a decent pension.

I don't recall anyone complaining about how unfair my paltry NHS starting pay was when we were sharing 3 to a room in London! It was accepted that the pay was crap but the T&C were better. Now the perks have gone: free uniform, free laundering, subsidised meals and parking ie just like the private sector... but our pay didn't rise to meet the additional costs! But at least we still had our pensions.

But suddenly, we don't.

Is it any wonder the public services are aggrieved?

Not true youarekidding. Sscience reserachers requiring a PHD get pittance and it remains that way for years.
Oh, and no proper pension.
Its shit for lots of people. Lukcily teachers striking affects peolle quickly. Scientists striking doesnt show up for a few years!

I agree with the MP's pensions. Those should be stopped straight off. I do not agree with the strike as I do not think it will change anything but MPs should really have theirs restricted first to show that they mean what they are talking about. I think DC turned his down did he not? They should all do that. That would be the first thing I would do if I became PM.

Oh shock horror this resulted in several "teachers only work 6 hours a day" type comments.
If you don't know how a teacher's life works get off this thread.

I do sympathise with nurses too, they do seem to get a worse deal than us teachers.

i do hate the ' who works the longest and is most qualified arguments. They just seem to get nowhere. It is like when me and DH compare who is the tiredest.

Anyone criticising teachers here should be ashamed of themselves - go and shadow in a school for a few days and have your eyes opened!! It's a BLOODY tough job for mediocre pay - the pension is one perk that we deserve. Anyone who thinks teachers are not trying their best has no real understanding of the conditions - try working in a job where the goal posts, targets, curriculum, practice ect ect are changed on almost a yearly basis, where behaviour of pupils and parents is outrageous, workload increasing.. I could go on at length. I love my job but it is so demoralising when we get it in the neck unfairly.

I don't think it's a competition about who works the longest/hardest - it's just some people seem to think teachers don't work hard or long hours at all!

Thanks riveninside I knew teachers were one group but not if there were or who the others were.

To me this is not an issue of do we give teachers enough credit. The answer to that question is probably not. Do teachers work harder than most of us think....probably.

The issue is basic mathematics. As a nation with an aging population and an economy which is uncompetitive in comparison to our peers, we simply cannot afford our current levels of expenditure. Put simply we simply are not earning enough to pay our bills. There's no major party which is proposing a "tax the rich" policy and all are pretty much saying the same thing. The cuts are necessary. So the cuts must come from somewhere.

So the question becomes if we don't cut teachers salaries, who do we cut? The nurses? Police? How about the humble council admin worker? Who should be spared when others must suffer?

I don't want to see a teacher's pension cut anymore than I wanted to tell my stepson I didn't have the money to buy him a bag of chips. Unfortunately when you don't have the cash, you don't have the cash.

I've not seen a payrise for over three years and bills are going up & up. In addition we're being asked for more tax as well. All this and we still are not even close to balancing the books on the budget deficit. So in that context, we simply must make cuts and I'm sorry. To me it looks like teacher's pension is going to be a necessary evil.

I sympathise with the teachers - I know many who work 12 hour days. Prospective young teachers will be put off by the burden of a massive student debt and reduced benefits, and older, burnt out ones will be compelled to stay in the classroom. So either way, government policy is not going to improve standards. And we can't expect the private sector to fill the gap because they don't spend money on training. Judging by the vote, it looks like many teachers in private schools pay into the state pension too. They just don't dare strike because their employment conditions are less secure.

They do pay into the Teachers Pension and some have voted to strike.

You're right of course, Niceguy2. The problem is, that if you take away all the 'perks' of teaching then young, well qualified graduates are not even going to consider it as an option. I have 3 young children myself. I certainly don't want to go back to the bad old days where a couple of Es at Alevel and a relatively easy diploma was enough to let you loose in school.

The less attractive you make the job, the less well educated people will want to do it and that cannot be a good thing.

So it's dishonest of the government to lump teachers in with all the other public sector workers, because they include private sector workers too.

There was an impressive woman from the ATL union on Newsnight yesterday who pointed out that the pension terms & conditions had already been changed in 2007, and the scheme was not in deficit at that time. A new valuation of the scheme has been overdue by a year but the government had not communicated with the unions. The government minister ignored her and just kept asking what a single parent is meant to do on strike days, which was obviously a populist appeal to the public but showed lack of engagement with the arguments. (It's funny how they haven't had much sympathy for single parents before - like in benefit changes including child benefit).

Just because pensions are crap in the private sector now doesn't mean that comparatively low-waged professionals in the public sector should get an equally crap deal. Race to the bottom and all that. Of course, if you are a lawyer or accountant rather than working with children your pension will probably still be better than most, so comparisons are often too simplistic.

I'm just worried about how this will affect motivation and standards in education generally. I don't particularly want to see many strike days because it will inconvenience me personally but I do look long term.

Right on! Stick it to the man! Fight the power!

Seriously though, this government is totally wrong on how they are managing the deficit and even more wrong on how they are treating public sector workers. I hope everyone keeps striking, the Lib Dems break the coalition and there's a snap election. Cameron and Osborne need a good kicking!