Teachers to strike - 30 June

[meditrina]

breaking now on SKY

Overwhelming vote by 2 teachers' unions (92%)

Nope I don't dispute that at all Spotty. And you are right. The worse the package looks, the less it will attract the best & brightest. That said, I doubt any teacher goes into the job with pay in mind.

But like I said, we cannot afford to continue with the current levels of expenditure, pensions being one of the biggest outgoings. They are simply unsustainable.

The private sector has already made their adjustments, it's time for the public sector to taste the bitter medicine too. After all, the private sector supports the public sector. It only stands to reason that if the private sector isn't doing well, that the public sector will also suffer.

Absolutely muminlondon, I said exactly the same thing myself today. francis maude was on bbc this morning saying how the strikes will affect a single mum who has to find childcare etc on that day and how sorry he felt for them. Meanwhile all his tory pals are making life even harder for single parents as each day goes by while they are in government.

Funny, how he never thought of single mums being hard up when he claimed £35,000 in two years on a london flat when he owned a house only a hundreds away. makes you sick.

Except that in the case of teachers it's also the state providing pensions to private sector workers so the public sector backs up the private sector.

only a hundred yards away that is!

That's sickening Lego, so Francis Maude is a benefits (expenses) cheat?

you got it in one. and his pension is due to be...how much?

am i right in saying that MP's pension is half their salary? anyone know?

I wonder how much of their pensions the good old hard working 'tax payer' is funding?

baconWed 15-Jun-11 12:04:52

"If they want to stike then do it in the summer holidays out of their own time as enough time taken out now by training days, election days already!!!"

you know I have answered comments like these for many years and I have come to the following conclusion

Never argue with an idiot
they bring you down to their level
and beat you with experience.

If teachers were striking over working conditions, govts continually messing around with teaching or even straightforward pay, I would have some sympathy. However on the issue of pensions the math just can't be denied by anybody whatever their profession.

When they introduced the Retirement Pension in 1946 (National Insurance Act), the expected life expectancy was around 60 for men (women didn't get a pension). Basically the pension system was setup with the expectation that most men dropped dead before they got anything! That's how it was affordable.

So with life expectancy at 80, people just need to accept that either pension payouts fall, they contribute more or they get the pension later (or some combination). Realistically anyone in Gen X or Y has to expect to work to say 75. The fact that your parent's retired at 55 was just their good fortune (plus massive house price rises). You're the mug who now has to pay for it!

government minister ignored her and just kept asking what a single parent is meant to do on strike days

What about single parent teachers, whose pension contributions are due to go up by nearly £100?

This is just a note to those who seem to despise teachers.

Your children are our product. Their success is our success. Our whole sense of self-worth is inextricably bound up in the success of your kids! If they do well, we feel as proud as you do. Every time an essay gets an A a teacher feels a stab of joy, and evey time we give someone an E, we want to bang our head against the kitchen wall. We really care about your kids!

If we are happy, feel valued and appreciated, your kids will feel the same. If we feel constantly under attack, we get demoralised and won't do our job so well. Your kids will suffer. (That sounds like a threat - it's not, just an observation!)

So why do you resent us so much? And if you do despise us, why do you send your children to us to be educated?

Rant over.

I've read several pages of this thread and about the strikes (teachers and civil servants), I think that we do have to protest at this government's attacks on education. Education is not somewhere that savings can be made. Nor is health. End of.

However, of all the aspects of education that are coming under attack - access to uni, EMA, special needs, teacher training, etc - teachers' pensions are something I don't feel strongly about, personally. Imo one of the causes of the financial situation - and a result of our fantastic health service - is that people are living longer. If we want to live longer, then I think we just have to accept a lower standard of living in our old age, because if we don't, it's the young people who will suffer. And as for working until we're 68, I don't know what to think. Yes, we should support ourselves and contribute to the economy for as long as possible, but young people need jobs too!

Absolutely Feenie. That's me.

Seriously, you're talking about forcing 68-year-olds to keep working with children. I'm knackered already and have more than 20 years of work to go. But we office workers can drool into our keyboards and save our legs. It's best if teachers stay on their feet. I want bright and energetic teachers, not burnt out ones.

I am one of those single parent teachers who cant afford the additional payments. What do I do?

I'm sure it will be fine muminlondon. I can just imagine taking a class of 30 six year olds on public transport to the National Portrait gallery when I'm 68. Just as I can see how demonstrating forward rolls during a Gym lesson to be a doddle at 67.

Seriously I am always just amazedly people simply not grasping the mess we are in with this. What brown did in 1997 has had a lasting impact on retirement provision in this country and we are all suffering. This debate is not about whether teachers deserve their pensions or not. It is about whether we want our children to be spending enormous amounts of tax supporting public sector workers in old age. This recession will look like the good old days to them.

It would be significantly cheaper to take away the pensions all together and give everyone in the public sector a payrise. DAfter all, that is pretty much what happened in the private sector in the 90s.......

Agree, Muminlondon. A good teacher needs good health and masses of energy and enthusiasm - I wouldn't want to be teaching kids when I'm in my 60s - not when there are so many talented young people who would be better at it.

grockle, I think we just face the fact that the longer we teach, the worse off financially we become-or so it would seem/feel/is.

Seems that way, Lego.

I have little energy left and am cutting my hours next year. I am seriously considering becoming a TA again. I love my job - I want to do it well. But after a really bad day and reading all of this I am wondering what is the point.

Sorry, haven't had time to read all posts, so could be repeating others. I joined ATL as it's a non-striking union. However it has balloted members & chosen to strike. I feel obliged to strike to support my union, who would support me if needed. Sorry.

I agree with siasl. I don't have any dislike for teachers but increasing the pensionable age and asking them to increase contributions is just the inevitable reality of increased life expectancy. It's notihng to do with teachers per se ... everybody will have to accept working longer and contributing more.

The problem is that many of us in say our 20s or 30s will look at those now retiring (baby boomers) and wonder why we seem to have to work longer for less. The reality is that state and public sector defined benefit (final salary) pensions haven't been affordable for 30 years but no government wanted to anger these voters for fear of losing office. Result is a £4 trillion pension deficit. Please also remember than Gordon Brown raided private pensions in 1997 and 2008, the current cost of which is close to £200bn cut in private schemes!

It's really does leave a pretty bitter aftertaste but it does seem as though we're simply going to have a lower standard of living than the baby boomers.

I support all workers right to strike, if it didn't impact on people, what would be the point?

I am one of those single parent teachers who cant afford the additional payments. What do I do?

You do what I and millions of others in the private sector have to do Grockle. Ie. Either cut back somewhere else or go without the payment and slowly trot towards your retirement knowing you will have a shitty crappy salary.

BTW, in case you are wondering, I've opted for the latter.

I dont despise you, I don't detest you, I think you are doing a fantastic job, me on the other hand I am worrying how I am going to feed my children next winter, so please don't get at me when I think you have not a lot to worry about. My disclaimer is we run our own business, prices are hiking up but people not prepared to pay more to compensate for it, I now work 3 jobs and looking for full time work and going to evening classes to improve chances.