Public Sector Cuts that will affect all

[Kirstie55]

I'm just wondering how many parents out there are aware of the cuts that Local Authorities are making to frontline Childrens Services and how these are going to affect our children? In Hull 1369 jobs are being cut 650+ of those are vital services in the CYPS- teen parents, connexions, surestart, day centres, youth work- the list goes on!

What are your thoughts?

Yes some children are not very bright and some are not very self starting. Believe it or not they are not all lovely clever bright clones who should be told they are wonderful all the time (we have seen some pretty average specimens on the Dream School programme).

There are a lot of things the state schools could do which would not cost a penny which the private schools do. Getting parents to give talks and even interview pupils (give mock interviews to A level students) as many of us ahve done is possible and I assume it may well be so that plenty of schools in the state sector already do that. If we have to cut back career services because the country has no money then that's just how it is. In fact plenty of mumsnetters are behind the cuts because we allmanage a family budget and know Labour lived ridiculously beyond its means and if we all did that at home we'd starve. Thankfully we have a better Government in charge now so we might start to get things back on track.

Back to my earlier point kirstie, those of us born in the 60s and 70s seem to have turned out OK despite not being spoon-fed career options and the like. Ideas for careers and futures come from external influences, not Mrs. Patterson at 3pm in the library on a Friday afternoon.

The government's pulling a dirty trick by making swingeing cuts to council budgets. It means councils will be blamed for cutting services, not central government. The government has also front-loaded the cuts, so councils have to make massive reductions this year, losing services which could have survived if the cuts had been spread over three or four years. So that by the time of the next election, ministers hope the worst cuts will be a distant memory, the economy will be recovering and we will all feel better.

"In fact plenty of mumsnetters are behind the cuts because we allmanage a family budget and know Labour lived ridiculously beyond its means and if we all did that at home we'd starve. Thankfully we have a better Government in charge now so we might start to get things back on track."

It's worth pointing out that the Tories were actually more inept when it came to living within their means than Labour were, and that takes some doing.

From 1997 to 2010 Labour managed to not hit the credit cards for three years. Which sounds awful.

But then consider that from 1979 to 1997 the Tories only managed to make the books balance twice.

There's been a continual acceptance by both parties that it's OK to run the country at a loss, to fund spending by maxing out the credit cards and to let someone else worry about the mounting debt later. That's why Labour want us to believe it's all the fault of the banks and the Tories want us to blame Labour. Neither want to admit that both were following a financial policy that lead to disaster.

We should be able to run at a surplus in the good years so that when the bad times come, and come they will, you can dip into your savings and continue to fund the same level of service provision.

Other European countries did this and lo and behold they've coped with this recession much better than we have.

Actually my mum worked as a career's advisor for a while in Woolwich. She didn't need to spend too much time directing those who wanted to, in the direction of the rows and rows of prospectus' or books about different careers. She did fill in quite a few applications for McDonalds though - explaining along the way what Sex:M/F meant.

If you're going to be a nuclea physicist, you probably already know it!

Alpine pony IQ is a bit of a red herring, intelligence isn't unitary anyway it's the sum of all the habits of the mind which are many and most can be cultivated. Being smart is as much a matter of determination and self discipline as it is of intellect. Of course not everyone is cut out to be a rocket scientist or for a pure academic pathway but children with average IQs are capable of high A'level grades and can do well at University. Its possible to get smarter with the right attitude and excellent teaching along the way. Just look at the leavers destinations of our local not selective prep school, and others like it, for details.

The value of many children's support services - including careers - is that they also help those who are not so able or who don't have support from their parents.

Xenia - the activities you describe do actually take place in state secondary schools - there are careers evenings and visits by local employers and professionals.

However, many young people still benefit from having an individual discussion with a professional like myself.

And P.S. to Xenia - I obviously don't know what your job is, but I am sure that if you offered your services to your local state schools they would be very grateful.

Cortina - there was no need for the lecture of intelligence vs. "sum of cultivated habits" because it's quite clear to me that you understand fully what my implication was - and yet you still can't quite bring yourself to use the word "thick".

OMG....i cannot believe what i am reading here...
very much a middle class 'i'm alright jack' attiutude!!!
i have two teenage daughters who both use and have used connexions and careers advice...they both attend a very good school but were glad of the independant unbias advice they couldn't get from teachers/colleges that these services provide!!!
nothing to do with bloody class!!!
i work for a living and do not receive benefits so not classed as deprived etc, but i found Surestart a very useful tool during my last pregnancy. support that i wish had been around when my other two were little. these services have been a godsend to many.
it is very ignorant to assume that only working class people need these services, and therefore they don't matter!!! what decade are we living in again???
all children/teenagers WILL be affected by these cuts....no matter how you try to dress it up, i for one dread the knock on effect this will have in 10years time when there will be even more unemployment and kids on the streets due to this lack of care, knowledge and understanding!!!

Alpine - your reference to Mrs Patterson in the library at 3pm on a Friday afternoon is a lazy stereotype. Careers guidance has moved on and I think it would be useful if you educated yourself about what actually happens in schools before making sweeping judgements.

I believe that intelligence is learnable and everyone can do more than they know. :) As some know here :) When people say 'thick' they usually mean someone who seems ignorant I've found rather than inherently stupid. In 'To Miss With Love' Birblasingh (may not have spelt that correctly, apologies) explains that there were children in her inner city state school who were super smart and capable of Oxbridge but they'd had their intellectual capacity stunted by poor teaching and a poor environment so these destinations were no longer a possibility.

This stands to reason: The poorest ten per cent will suffer 15 times more than the richest with the cuts. Now I see why you dont seem to mind

I just hope that some people advocating more cuts and people being more self reliant never find themselves falling on hard times, and it can and does happen.
How self reliant can the frail and elderly be?
How self reliant can the severely disabled be?
How self reliant can the 1 in 5 families living in poverty in our authority be?
I'm sure you also include the long term sick and unemployed in this need for "self reliance", but that is precisely what some of these services help them strive towards.
I'm self reliant, I am a recent single parent who works to put a roof over my kids's heads and food in their bellies, but what happens to them when my income stops in 6 months thanks to these slash and burn, UNNECESSARY cuts!
Can we please have some compassion for the vulnerable in our society?

It is most compassionate to enable people to develop the tools to help themselves. Plenty of us on here have had b ad times and worked very very hard. Lots of us have had to move for work and leave our families behind.

You can feel individually sorry for people whilst also knowing there isn't money int he kitty to pay for what we have paid for. It's the same in a family. You don't buy the new TV you want because the children instead need to be fed. You don't get into debt because long term it isn't good for you. That's all this nation is doing and it needs to go much further. I don't regard these cuts as up to much at all.

Local council - just appointed interim finance chief on £16,300 a month. I just don't believe there are no others out there who can do that role at £50k a year.

And my dh earns over 200k doing a less responsible role for a private company plus car, shares, bonuses

50k gets you a newly qualified accountant with little experience.

You need to get real.

"Can we please have some compassion for the vulnerable in our society?"

There's plenty of compassion for the vulnerable but public services cover a huge remit these days, way in excess of helping purely the vulnerable. When the money supply goes short due to a unprecedented economic crisis choices have to be made. The status quo is not an option.

I wouldn't like to be in a council spending committee at the moment trying to judge on the basis of compassion... helping the frail and elderly or keeping a library open?.... keeping the streets clean or support for the disabled? Compassion to one group means another group suffers.

"Compassion to one group means another group suffers."

Yeah, like higher rate taxpayers.

Oh sorry, weren't they on your list?

Sorry, not a go at higher rate taxpayers, but I see a certain... pattern in who is supposed to suffer in these cuts. And who isn't.

My local county council finance director left the money in Icelandic banks despite being warned they were about to go tits-up. Don't think he's worth £50k, tbh, let alone four times that.

' Even if you are lucky enough to be able to afford to send your children to University, in Hull, the entire Connexions Service has been obliterated, without any transition plan, so they will receive no impartial careers guidance to make those choices'

What so you claim that without the state 'guuiding' you through a few prospectuses, you will be suffering?

Unbelievable the level of reliance this country has developed.

And as for this

'ALL of C&YP services are being cut, if not axed completely; including Social Care and other Safeguarding agencies. These cuts are going to result in another Baby P and Victoria Climbie.'

No. Public services don't prevent such things happening, rather feckless individuals cause them to happen.

Big difference.

There have been changes that affect higher rate taxpayers negatively. Child benefit being withdrawn in the future, tax credits no longer available, a lower threshold at which the 40% tax applies, National Insurance contribution increases. They may not use front-line public services quite the same as those on lower incomes ... but they are not getting off scott-free when it comes to extra financial contributions either.

Some of us have felt a huge impact.
DH and I are both now paying 50% on our salary over the threshold. We have no personal allowances between us.

Our tax bill has risen by thousands and thousands of pounds (our income has not).

Now we accept that this is necessary.

But it's still not remotely enough to balance the books, so cuts have to be made. Hard choices that none of us will be happy with.

No we/they are not getting off scott free. But we were talking about suffering. You know fine well that a cut to disposable income is a very different kettle of fish from a cut to non-disposable income.

moondog - there is far more to careers work than "guiding you through a few prospectuses".

The point of the careers and connexions services is that they help give a leg up to young people who are disadvantaged - one example is those who don't see university or a good job as an option because it's never been part of their world.

It's about addressing social inequalities. Not all kids have articulate and/or well-connected middle class parents.