Explicit Sex Ed material for 5 years olds!!!

[vintageteacups]

sex ed for 5 years olds

I think this is extremely wrong on so many levels. Would you seriously like your 5 yr olds to be told about sex like this???

So immediately people seem to be talking about the virtues (or not) of the DM rather than the issue concerned which is a huge issue in our country! You are avoiding the main topic. If you draw a graph showing the correlation between teenage pregnancy and sex ed, the lines go up together. The current method doesn't work, so why do we continue down this road?
My major concern is alcohol. When I used to teach there were generally only 2 reasons why young girls had sex; either they were drunk or they felt pressure to show a boy they loved him (or both). Very few had made a specific choice out of the pressure of a heated moment with the help of their parents and armed with contraception. I just know that if teenagers didn't have such easy access to large amounts of alcohol they wouldn't have sex as early and would be more likely to use condoms. The govt never tries to tackle that issue. They take the easy road of 'education' and make things worse. It's appalling.

dibsii - good points, well made.

I love Mummy Laid an Egg, and it was one of my sons, aged 3and a half and four's favorite books when I was pregnant with my last child.
What really made the penny drop for my sons though was watching a cockerel at work in our paddock a couple of years later. My son said "Um, Mum- Why is Henry standing on the hen?" So I answered "To put his seed into the hen to make a chicken". The answer was "Did Dad stand on you, and then you had us then?" I had to say yes.
There is all the difference though between telling your own children yourself in your own way, to getting it taught as a school subject.

I strongly feel that Mumsnet gives a distorted view of the world, most parents on here are obviously very involved/interested in their children's lives and seem to talk to them a lot.

I do volunteer work with teens and many of them have never discussed sex with their parents on a real level and would be too embarrassed to talk to their parents about their sexual activity.

Teaching about sex in loving relationships from an early age would relieve some of the pressure and also open the discussion about homosexuality. Making sex less of an issue means teens are more likely to be on contraception or be carrying it before they get into a sexual situation.

Yes, some teens do drink and have sex but they always have done as far as I can remember and its something lots of adults do as well just look at the relationship boards. Making sure our children are prepared from a young age should hopefully reduce STI's and pregnancy as well as the related emotional issues.

Also its only basic sex its not like giving gimp masks and vibrators to a reception class.

I childmind.
I worry what exactly is being taught in school, and what is being picked up by children from TV and the internet.
I have had to complain to parents about an 8 year old boy simulating sex with a stool, and putting action men into the missionary position, and simulating sex with them. This was when a three year old and a four year old were present.
Where did they get the idea that this was funny or acceptable?

In a 1940s childhood, my "natural inhibitions and sense of modesty" - never "broken down" by any sex education, failed to safeguard me from sexual abuse or later, a casual sex habit.
What's more, I have read of a study that found paedophiles tend to come from puritanical families rather than liberal ones.

"Very few had made a specific choice out of the pressure of a heated moment with the help of their parents."

Because we all want to involve our parents in our sex life???

"When I used to teach there were generally only 2 reasons why young girls had sex; either they were drunk or they felt pressure to show a boy they loved him (or both)."

May I suggest a reason you appear to unaware of. Because sex is enjoyable and girls have libidos too.

"armed with contraception"

Er, without sex ed, and obviously drunk or pressured by a boy, how are they supposed to find out about contraception or how to access it? Or make a decision about which contraceptives to use. Or learn about diseases like chlamydia that don't have obvious symptoms but can cause infertility?

Rubyfakenails - Playing devil's advocate here. Perhaps teenagers should be given vibrators, and told to use them as a contraceptive?

(That is instead of full sex)

For those of you wondering about the correlation of comprehensive sex ed and age of first intercourse - in the Netherlands the average age of first intercourse is among the highest in Europe.

Major, your point about teaching young people about the consequences of sex is very well taken and is also one of the focal points of sex education in the Netherlands - at an appropriate age, of course, not age 5.

I also agree with you as regards the role of parents - the Dutch model would not work nearly so well were it not for the culture of openness that allows most parents to discuss sex and relationships frankly and without embarrassment at home. I don't think we can bring about a cultural shift on that scale in the UK any time soon, I'm afraid.

I do not think that sex education in the mid-teens 'in case they haven't got it at home' is in any way adequate though - far too little, and far too late.

"You are avoiding the main topic. If you draw a graph showing the correlation between teenage pregnancy and sex ed, the lines go up together. The current method doesn't work, so why do we continue down this road?"

I'd like to see that graph please. Where is the evidence for that assertion?

Bear in mind that they are very religious in the Netherlands compared to here, and I'm sure that has some bearing on the matter.

well there was a 12yr old girl at my school who certainly wasn't pressured by any of the 3 boys she slept with (I know as I shared a room with her and she shagged one of them in the room n the dark with me and 2 other girls in the room s well )

I thought the Netherlands was now one of the most secular in West Europe and traditionally speaking very religious families have always tended to be less open about discussion of sex than secular ones........

And to the Netherlands, let's add Sweden, which is certainly one of the most secular countries in the world (far more so than e.g. Norway). And which has had sex education in schools since the 60s at least. But which has had extremely low rates of teen pregancies since sex education started.

I think a previous poster hit the nail on the head: it's not because teens in these countries think sex is evil or wrong, but because they don't want to ruin their chances in life by an early pregnancy. Because they believe they have got chances! . If we could inculcate the same positive attitude towards the future in all our teens that would be half the battle won.

I have met many Swedish teens but never one who didn't think she had better things to do with her life than to be stuck with a baby in a council flat on benefits.

Thanks, Baroque.

And Liz, the Dutch, very religious? Don't make me laugh! There is a small minority of very fundamentalist Protestants who are indeed extremely religious - oddly enough it is among them that you find high rates of teenage pregnancies, abandoned babies etc. They also oppose vaccination.

They are very much a small minority, the Netherlands are extremely secular - early implementers of full gay marriage, have legislated for euthanasia...

The Dutch are all about pragmatism - do what is effective (and to hell with people's feelings, but then we are known to be blunt direct).

"(and to hell with people's feelings, but then we are known to be blunt direct)."

my parents had some long time family friends that I kept in contact with as well (due to having gone to school with their children). The wife was Dutch - and yes that's just how I'd describe her

And again TEENAGE PREGNANCY RATES ARE FALLING

Now, where's that graph, dibsii?

Baroque - yup, that's us. Until I came to live in the UK I though that waffling meant eating waffles and flannel was something you washed your face with. Little did I know these were essential tools for maintaining social equilibrium. These days I can waffle and flannel with the best of them, but inwardly am thinking 'oh FFS cut to the chase' and craving strong black filter coffee.

I won't be trusting my DDs with the UK system for sex education, by the way - with the DM (curses be upon it) and its pernicious influence, I don't think we're going to get it right here until my DDs have their own DCs, if then.

I am a teacher and have had taught PSHE in secondary schools. Some of the children are far too young at the age of 11 never mind at the age of 5! The sad thing is that this should realy be a job of a parent to talk to their own child not a job of a school and PSHE lessons. It was perfectly fine to have Biology lessonas about reproduction but when you start talking to 5 year olds about sex in schools or anywhere to that extent something is very wrong. And here I am not talking just about DM article, I am talking about PSHE and sex education. Every parent should inform themselves about what it contains at which level and in particular school. I ceirtainly will!

BillieK - thanks for making that point. I agree it should really be the parents that impart this sort or intimate and personal knowledge to their children.

I would indeed be curious to see the relationship between sex education and teenage pregnancies.

However, I think there are many factors involved here, the effects of which are difficult to measure - religion, welfare support to mothers, prevalent attitudes towards sex, emotional intelligence etc.

thing is - you mentione welfare support to mothers.........yet we're talking about underage sex aren't we??

There is no free flat and masses of benefits for mothers aged under 16.

I'm happy with this. My DS is 4yo and this isn't a million miles away from what I am telling him (in response to the questions he has asked).

I would indeed be curious to see the relationship between sex education and teenage pregnancies.

My guess is, it'd be similar to the relationship between road safety education and RTAs