Voluntary work or lose benefits

[Marjoriew]

Government intend to cut benefits of claimants on JSA who refuse to do voluntary work of 30 hours a week over a 4-week period.
Benefits could be stopped for up to 3 months if claimants refuse to comply.

Excellent points from granted. I currently have two jobs and still volunteer as I see the real bemefits of helping others. Not just for the people I work with but it has also helped me move forward in so many areas of my life. I still have a crap wage but at least I have my pride, this is far more important to me and should be more important to those who abuse the system and cause the government outcomes we see today.

ll, I don't feel like that. Lots of people work two jobs leaving at 5am on buses to get to work for 7am for jobs in the City. They take the bus because the tubes are too expensive. I have always tried to remember what it's like not to have much money. I only drink tap water. I dont' watch TV. I'm not particularly extravagant. I don't drink or smoke. I think I could live reasonably happily in reduced circumstances.

I do work hard but so do plenty of people who don't earn much. I've never suggested otherwise.

I suspect for the scheme the plan is that these people will do voluntary sector jobs and I doubt mothers with children under 5 will be the first to be called on to do the workfare.

And yes it's not demeaning to do just about anything. Jesus washed the feet of lepers and I hope most of us whatever our circumstances try to ensure we keen doing dross jobs (anyone with a family will be used to being up to their elbows in vomit and excrement whatever their job).
I do think it does people a lot of good to have to get up get dressed and turn up on time for things - quite a skill if you're not used to it. I know someone who deliberately employs ex offenders in his factory to give them a chance and they do learn things like if the start time is 9am no you cannot saunter in at 11.30am which does surprise a lot of them. It gets them back on track (not all but some) and works well all round.

Also there is no correlation between the announcement of this new future scheme and the current redundancies. The redundancies are because we cannot afford to pay what we have been paying in the public sector.

If we can get the economy moving again then work will flow out of that. There are always these cycles and things will get better although perhaps worse in the short term for some people.

nice post, sumfing. Couldn't think of any coherent points to make, huh?

I think it's a great idea.

There are many jobs that aren't getting done because there isn't the money or funding available to pay someone.

Commanderdrool has a good point though: what happens to those who don't comply and get their benefits stopped?
Better make begging legal, and employ more police, and build more prisons...

Actually what on earth are you on about? Don't think I've said anything particularly startling on this thread. So why the abuse?

loudlass thats a really good point, this will seriously undercut wages. Employers would definitely take advantage.

Many people are already squeezed as it is, I dont think the government is helping.

I wish david cameron got kicked into the long grass. and that massive sense of entitlement "but my OH is only a higher rate tax payer, poor me".

There is nothing effective and/or productive about these proposals.

It will cost a bomb to administer it.

If those affected take up the work, they won't lose benefits, so no savings there.

If those affected don't take up work, the government won't see kiddies go hungry or on the streets, so no savings made there.

If those affected take up the work, they'll have to be reimbursed for travel, childcare costs, specialised workwear. More cost.

After 4 weeks, they'll just go right back to where they started. No more jobs created, no reduction in those on benefits.

So fuck off yourself ('cos that makes it okay to tell another poster to fuck off, yeah?)

easy on the vino sumfing!

Xenia....... Mothers with dc under 5 are not jsa claimants, so won't be involved in
'workfarce'

Tasmaniac........ Charities are actively looking for volunteers?? That's not my experience. I have found they are over subscribed. Someone already said their charity didn't have enough work for the volunteers. And who is going to pay these charities for the jsa claimants training???

lifeinlimbo - if that dig was aimed at me, you'll notice that I am not the ne who repeatedly starts threads about how poor they are, and nowhere have I claimed to be poor. We're not rich, but get by.

loudlass, however, posts endlessly about how poor sheis - despite posting details of her income through work/benefit which proved that her family's take-home pay was actually as high as our family, which includes a HR taxpayer and where both parents work!

So I'd just like her to stop koaning about being poor - because she isn't, any more/less than I am.

And when her new baby isborn will be richer. But will doubless syill moan ad infinitum.

And you'll doubtless still post guff like this in her defence.

Also, I hope the government are going to provide adequate insurance for the jsa volunteers.......??

may I take the opportunity to provide custard pies ?

I love the way the enemies of the New Order declare themselves...

wubblybubbly - it'll cost a pittance...local council offices...need a fence painting? Litter removed? Graffiti removed? Errands for the elderly??

If kiddies (bless 'em the little blighters!) go hungry...(it's their feckless parents fault and no mistake!)...tough!

I'll warrant wubblybubbly loathes people that earn more than £20k as it reminds her of her own inadequacies.

5 years, darling...we've got 5 years in power to truly f*ck up your sense of entitlement and force you to ponder upon your place in life.

I don't understand why people assume that people claiming JSA are 'scroungers', or that they are 'scroungers' if they've been claiming for a certain length of time. I'll just tell you about the experiences of a couple of people I know because I don't know where people are getting the idea that there are hundreds of jobs out there which nobody wants to do.

One of my friends works at the Job Centre. She was unemployed (with a degree) for quite some time until she found this work. Her contract will end soon and they are refusing to lengthen it. She will now have to sign on and be sent on things such as basic numeracy and literacy skills courses by people she once worked with. She has told me about the complete lack of organisation, support and motivation. Her 'manager' is less qualified than her and does not care about the job, as he is also on a short term contract. She told me that a lot of the time, if asked a question, she has to guess because she has received no useful training and doesn't know how to help people. She has also told me about the shame of professionals who have been made redundant and now have to come in and be sent on useless, irrelevant courses. I have often been shocked by the lack of knowledge of job centre staff. I recently had to explain what an exam board was to one of their workers. Will this scheme also be done through the job centre? I don't think I've ever come across a less helpful or knowledgeable organisation. If you do not need help with skills on a very basic level, then it seems that there is absolutely no help available to you.

My partner is privately educated and has a good degree from a Russell Group university, so not your typical 'scrounger'. He has now been unemployed for over a year. He has been applying for every job available and has yet to be offered an interview. He has even applied for volunteer work and had to compete for that! The only companies who've contacted him are scam companies. He can't move around because he can't afford to move out of his parents house. I don't see us being able to live together for a very long time.

My son's father has been unemployed for even longer. He is an almost fully qualified electrician. The job centre refuse to send him on a course which will complete his training and mean that he has up to date, useful qualifications resulting in him being able to work. He was recently on a placement for a few months. Some sort of scheme where they are paid to take on people claiming JSA. Only, the company stopped paying them a few weeks before the contract ended. He complained time and time again to the Job Centre, but nothing was done. He has also managed to find a few temporary electrical jobs and has had a similar experience of companies refusing to pay him. Claiming that he hadn't filled in his hours sheet or things like that. The latest is that they're going to send him on a basic bricklaying course. What a waste of money.

The whole system is a joke. I don't see how any of this can possibly help people get into jobs which don't exist. I realise that I'm a little off-topic here, but my experience of the 'help' offered to these 'scummy scroungers' has so far been depressing and a complete waste of money. I don't see why this is going to be any different (other than the slave labour aspect, obviously).

wubblybubbly - you might not be able to carry out masectomy but if you've had one I think you'd be reasonably placed to talk about its impact and advise others facing one, yes.

Your points about no savings made may well be tue - BUT this policy isn't, as far as I know, about making savings - except as it discourages those who actually are scroungers - which surely eveeyone agrees is a good thing.

It will have 3 positive effects, all non-financial:

1. give the unemployed work experience and (some) skills
2. improve our environment/society eg less litter etc
3. make clear the social contract whereby those who receive benefits make a contribution to society in return.

Dear me, you really are up for some aggro aren't you sumfing?

Don't claim benefits, never have worked all my life and I'm fortunate enough to be able to afford to stay at home and raise my son right now.

Perhaps take a moment to calm down, you're making it all very personal.

Need a fence painting?? ....... Volunteers might make a bit of a mess of it....... Counterproductive

Remove graffitti? ....... Specialised and no doubt expensive, equipment is used, would you trust an untrained jsa claimant to not break it/not injure themselves

Errands for the elderley??...... What if the purse gets nicked/ possessions stolen? Or are 'you going to crb every jsa!?

granted - but the bleeding hearts on here don't want people on benefits to make a contribution to society...they prefer that they make no contribution whatsoever, for otherwise, they might have to re-consider their support for them and that would never do.

They want us all out of work and all on benefits. That way, Big Brother wins.

Dear granted. Of course you dont start threads about how poor you are if you are not poor Sorry if you dont like to be reminded that poor people exist but loudlass' point is still valid.

Why do you think wages are so low, and living costs so high that the state has to support working people to such an extent?

In some areas, working for less than £16k would mean losing money every week.

Think about housing costs, transport, utility bills (privatised). Think of a solution instead of moaning. Thanks.

Sprinkledust - you appear to be implying that all those on benefits are total idiots/klutzes and/or dishonest.

Patronising or what????

Granted - I'm not on this thread 'moaning about how poor I am'. I am talking on this thread about how this scheme worries me because I can see it putting my DP out of his job, and us onto JSA...and thus into this 'workfare' scheme...And considering what I've found out today about retail managers in my town earning a salary of £14K for what is a job that requires a lot more responsibility than my DP has in his unskilled job that he earns £16K for, I TBH am thanking my lucky stars that he earns such a GOOD wage for an unskilled job!

And while I may get a little bit extra once my baby is born, that will only be until I can get someone to employ me, as I no longer have to declare my disability. I do not intend to be a SAHM forever, but up until the 1st Oct, I had to by law declare my disability, and out of 200 jobs applied for in 3 yrs, didn't get ONE interview.

Sprinkledust - straws, clutching at....

sumfing, are you that weird bloke under a new name? The one who said something on a tax credits thread about 'you will be returned to the state in which you should exist' referring to tax credits being cut? And didn't or couldn't understand that people who object to attacks on the poor aren't necessarily poor themselves - that it is possible to have a wider perspective than your own immediate circumstances?

granted, I could share my experiences and explain how it affected me, but I really wouldn't assume to tell someone else what treatment they would need. I'd leave that to the specialists.