Help please - emigrating to Australia

[sunnydelight]

I'm sorry if this has been done to death, but it looks like DH may be offered a job in Sydney in the next few months and I would love any advice/experience you can offer about moving to Sydney. DH and I met there 16 years ago and we lived there for a year before our immigration status got the better of us. We always vowed to go back but it never happened; we now have three children, 12, 7 and 3 so I accept I will not be living overlooking the harbour bridge and eating out five nights a week, but I really want to go. My biggest issue is schooing - DS1 is dyslexic. The one advantage I can see is that despite the fact that he is in his second year of secondary here I think he would be starting secondary there? (He's an August birthday so was always the youngest in the class and I always wanted to hold him back a year but couldn't). I would also really appreciate any input about areas to live and house prices. We see it as a way to afford a better house for less money - we currently have a horrible south-east England mortgage. I would be really grateful if anyone has time to respond.

Hi SunnyD.

We moved to Sydney about 10 months ago. We also have a house in London so I understand your feelings!

IF you know Sydney well, then take a look at www.domain.com.au or realestate.com.au. You can see property prices there - Eastern suburbs are nearly comparable to London prices. Other places in Sydney you will get a fantastic 5 bed place with pool for the price of a semi in London. You do need to know the areas though and also where your DP will be working and if you'll have a car (pretty necessary ime).

I can't help you with schooling, am still baffled about it myself - DD is 3.5. There are a few others here in Oz who will be able to help with that.

Regarding flights, Emirates have a great reputation and Singapore are great with small children and a good stopover choice.

If you will need daycare for your littlest one deal with it now - when I arrived in summer 2005 all the nurseries I phoned asked if I was looking for 2007 or 2008 (gasp!). I'm in the East and it's particularly difficult there though.

Take all the help you can get from your DPs company with paying for a serviced apartment/executive let while you look for somewhere permanent & arrange for shipping of your stuff.

If you have any specific questions just post and I'm sure one of us will be able to help.

Welcome - you are now part of our 'other side' clique!

come on over you know it makes sense

Hey we should ask MN Towers for a special " moving to Australia" board, it does seem to be immensly fashionable at themoent.

sunnydelight - in australia, the school year goes from january to december, and you would start in the year you turn 5 - so, if your DS1 turned 5 in August, he would start year 1 in Janaury of the same year (that is, at 4.5 years). Primary school is years 1 to 7, and high school is years 8 to 12. Generally, a child is turns 13 in year 8.

So, to make it simple, your DS would be starting in year 8 (which is good, everyone else would be too), and wouldn't be the youngest, but would be mid-aged.

at suzy - good plan except for becoming a cockroach - move to Qld and be a cane toad instead!! ( oh state of origin - bring it on!!)

sunny - I think it depends on the state as our state education system is undergoing change with regards to when children start school.

\link{http://www.schools.nsw.edu.au/index.php\state school information}

\link{http://www.nswfamilydaycare.com.au/\family daycare info}

\link{http://www.community.nsw.gov.au/html/childcare_serv/childcare_contacts.htm\child care info}

if you don't need childcare for your youngest he/she would be able to attend a kindergarten - which has a short day programme. My daughter attends from 9 - 2.15pm costs about $14 a day from memory.

You know you want to Shame to miss the experience - one of those eternal "if onlys" if you don't.

No clue about big ones but fab for the littlies - all that outdoor living. And you would have great weather with proper seasons and no cyclones

Thanks for your replies. There is no doubt that I want to go - I'm trying not to get too impatient as it's not something that's going to happen overnight! I'll have a look at the real estate sites (nothing I like better than looking at houses in any country!) and I'll have a look at the links for schools. Ideally I would like to be there for the kids to start school next January - if there is any way DS1 could start high school at the same time as all the other kids it's got to be better. Does anyone know about SEN provision (long shot I know!) DS1's dyslexia is not profound, but he certainly wouldn't be able to cope at school without some support. DH would be working in Darling Harbour so if anyone has any suggestions for good suburbs with decent transport links that would be fantastic.

sunnydelight- I have just posted on the other Australia thread. My dh is going to be working in Darlinghurst for a year from January 2007. Fance a coffee sometime when we finally get there?! We will be living in Revesby which is quite a way out. Anybody know anything about it ?

Sounds good if I make it robinpud! I've never heard of Revesby, but I'm guessing we are going to end up living a long way out of town as well. DH's commute to London takes so long at the moment he will be grateful for anything less and I'll be looking for space and proximity to beach!

I am in Sydney and can highly recommend Manly and its surrounding suburbs on the Northern Beaches. Your DH could catch the Ferry across the harbour to get to work - a great way to start the day. Manly has a lovely vibe, great beaches and plenty of expats and friendly locals. It is not particularly cheap, but comparable to other desireable Sydney suburbs it is pretty good. Re housing you get better value for money when renting. We have a v modern 3br,2bathroom +study and massive balcony with water views in security building with gym and double lock up garage, 10 minutes walk to the beach for AUD645/wk. My boys aren't at school yet so I can't help out there, but can vouch for the childcare in the area being not that hard to find for your 3yo if you want it a few days a week from about $30 to $60 a day depending. HTH

I've been thinking about it a bit more especially your DH working in Darling Harbour. While I would generally say that the North Shore and the Northern Beaches are more family friendly than the City, Eastern Suburbs and inner West, I would think that you might also consider areas such as Drummoyne and Hunters Hill which is on the same side of the bridge as Darling Harbour, and if you didn't mind being on the other side of the bridge, but want to catch the train into the city than you might consider the lower North Shore, like Crows Nest and St Leonards. You can check out how long and by which method of transport it is best for you DH to get to work by going to Whereis.com.au and inputting the addresses into the Get Directions page. Will your DH's employer not provide you with a Relocation Consultant? I would assume that your DH's employer would also put you up initially in some serviced accommodation while you find a place to live which can take a while as the rental market is a bit tight at the moment and you might want to have some input into where you want the temporary accommodation to be so that you are in a good position to do your search. If you don't say anything than you might end up in Darling Harbour somewhere which isn't really an area you would look for family accommodation. HTH

SD - I can back up AussieSIMs talk about Manly - it's lovely there. We often catch the ferry over from our side of the bridge. There is a beach that's great for children (Bondi and some of the famous ones are quite dangerous for littlies) Childcare prices seem better too - mine is double that in the East.

We've spent most of our time near Bondi/Bondi Junction/Woollahra - pretty much because we're locked into DDs nursery in Bondi Junction.

Bondi/Woollahra/Bondi Junction only take 15 minutes to get to the city, and are also close to the beaches. Not sure that you'll find a huge detached house in these areas unless your company is paying big bucks for your housing allowance though!

We've just found a nice place right on top of the beach in Coogee (you'll probably see it in domain.com.au!), so we're going to try there for a while.

We used to live in Blues Point Road...... not much help I know but all this talk about the North Shore reminded me.

Thank you so much for your replies. I was just talking to my sister who lived in Sydney for six years (two of her boys were born there) and they were in Drummoyne. I'd heard that I should avoid the Western suburbs, I didn't realise that Inner West was ok I'll check out the other areas you mentioned AussieSim and also transport links. I remember liking Manly many years ago, but my priorities as a loved up singleton were a bit different then. My big worry is how to co-ordinate the school/house thing as once I settle the boys into new schools I don't want to end up moving them again, but I really can't make proper decisions about where I want to live without living there if that makes sense! Keep it coming if you have any more thoughts.

HIYA MOVED TO OZ early December, we live in Sydney , Erskine Park, it's fab, best thing ever, Schools are fantastic, have 3 children, one-14yrs twins- 6yrs, they have never been so happy always outdoors playing, go for it.

Northern beaches (manly etc) is beautiful lifestyle-wise, and your dh can catch a ferry to work. Other public transport is dire, so you'll need a car for you and the kids. Schools are not really that great over there - OK but not as good as elsewhere. I presume you're thinking government schools?

Inner west would be fantastic lifestyle wise: not beaches but inner-city type stuff - great delis (big Italian population) and cafes, excellent public transport (your dh could get the light rail, ie tram, to work very easily, or could cycle if he's keen). Private schools in that area are pretty good, public schools are OK.

Northern suburbs, where we are, has much more suburban feel, but incredibly green, covered in trees and beautiful parks. Very, very family atmosphere. Excellent schools both public and private. Further from city. On the trainline, transport is good, otherwise bad. Your dh could catch one train to work and walk to office. We are a 25min train trip from the CBD.

Of the three areas, prices would be similar (less than eastern suburbs), although I think inner west is probably a bit more expensive. As always, it depends on exactly where within those suburbs...

What's your ds's month/year DOB? I'm a teacher and can compare his age to kids at my school. In NSW the rule is that they CAN start school if they turn 5 before July and you MUST start school if you turn 6 before July. Ds started at 4.5 years (May birthday) and is youngest by far - tendency is to hold them back. Off the top of my head, I'd say if he were 13 and starting high school he'd be about average - maybe a few months older than some of the others. SN provision is pretty good here, I think, but I don't know that much about it. I work in a private school and the provision is excellent, but don't really know the government system that well from that POV.

Thanks for latest responses - I was away for the weekend (DS1 on rugby tour in Cornwall - he was sent to school today with very strict instructions not to teach his classmates the songs they were taught by the coach's 19 year old son on the trip!!!!!). Whereabouts is Erskine Park newozzygirl? Any experiences re. finding schools, houses etc. gratefully appreciated! Was surprised to hear public schools not great bloss - I had heard they were, though obviously they vary. What kind of fees are you taking about for private in Sydney? I'm not against paying in principle, and have done before, but we have three kids now!!!!! DS1 will turn 13 on 1st August - Because of his dyslexia and the fact that I think he has always suffered a bit being the youngest in the class I really would want him to start his first year of high school in January if we went to Oz - I think this would be a year later than he would normally start there - am I right? To be honest though I would be happy for him to be the eldest for once if the system can accommodate it - they are SO inflexible here. I also reckoned it would be easier for him socially to start at the same time as his classmates.

Oh, look, in comparison to most countries I think we have EXCELLENT public schools. I'm just talking in relative terms here, ie north shore schools generally stronger than the northern beaches. When I say that, say, the northern beaches schools aren't that strong, I'm really thinking academically. They are not 'rough' or unpleasant places to be, for instance. For private, you're looking at two quite distinct sectors: Catholic systemic and independent. The Catholic schools are very, very cheap: often only $2000-$5000 a year. There are some low-fee schools along similar lines, but not nearly as many. (About 20% of students go to Catholic schoools.) Then you have the independent schools which are more like $10,000-$18,000 a year. These are the kind of 'top-tier' schools, I suppose. Obviously, despite the fees, they are of mixed reputation.

I have little doubt that your son could go into Year 7. Most of this year's Year 7s range between July 1993-April 1994 birthdates. So he'd be older but not by that much, and you can easily 'explain' it (if need be) by the move from the UK. But kids repeat all the time if they need it academically or socially, so there would be little difficulty in having a slightly older child there.

Oh, look, in comparison to most countries I think we have EXCELLENT public schools. I'm just talking in relative terms here, ie north shore schools generally stronger than the northern beaches. When I say that, say, the northern beaches schools aren't that strong, I'm really thinking academically. They are not 'rough' or unpleasant places to be, for instance. For private, you're looking at two quite distinct sectors: Catholic systemic and independent. The Catholic schools are very, very cheap: often only $2000-$5000 a year. There are some low-fee schools along similar lines, but not nearly as many. (About 20% of students go to Catholic schoools.) Then you have the independent schools which are more like $10,000-$18,000 a year. These are the kind of 'top-tier' schools, I suppose. Obviously, despite the fees, they are of mixed reputation.

I have little doubt that your son could go into Year 7. Most of this year's Year 7s range between July 1993-April 1994 birthdates. So he'd be older but not by that much, and you can easily 'explain' it (if need be) by the move from the UK. But kids repeat all the time if they need it academically or socially, so there would be little difficulty in having a slightly older child there.

Thanks bloss. To be honest I think a really academic school would be a disaster for DS1 - he's just about starting to shake his "I'm thick" mentality as despite his dyslexia he's doing ok at school at the moment (parents evening last night!). All my kids are baptised Catholic though I haven't raised them as Catholic as I have enough Catholic guilt for all of us I guess it might give us options though. We had a bit of a shock yesterday though - we knew salaries are lower in Oz but it looks like DH's salary would drop by about 1/3; my research on houses was based on having a similar mortgage to the one we have now, max. I have been told you can't make salary comparisons as lots of things are cheaper (and that's my memory from years ago), but we don't want to end up living somewhere grotty. Upper North Shore looks like where we would want to be, but is that realistic for $500-600k? We really need four bedrooms. Friends of my sister lived in Barowra which is supposed to be lovely and not too far from the city - do you know it? I've also just done a search on domain.au and there are lots of affordable houses but I haven't a clue what the areas are like - Turramurra, St. Ives? DS1 wants to be near the beach (don't we all!) and I don't want to be too close to the bush (arachnaphobic!) oh, and DH needs to be close to the train - am I asking the impossible? I just wish it wasn't winter with you at the moment, I think we really need a visit but am very reluctant to spend all that money and have the kids less than impressed because the promised sun doesn't materialise. Anyway, sorry for going on so long but I would appreciate your input if you have the time.

Sunny, i went to school in Aust and have a september b'day, turned 13 in Sept year 7 and that was completely normal...was one of the older ones but by no means the oldest. Your DS would be absolutely fine and there will be kids older than him.

My younger bro is dyslexic and went to school \link{http://www.sacs.nsw.edu.au\here} and my parents were very happy with the help he got. Not cheap but not one of the dearest either. Its right in the middle of the City and not particularly strong in sports, so may not suit your DS. Friendly school though.

I lived on the north shore and loved it - we will take the family back there in a few years to live. As someone else said, being on the trainline is good, or at a wharf (if you can afford to be that close to the harbour - lovely!) There are some good bus routes where your DH could get a bus straight into the CBD, but agree you and kids will need a car for sure.

Some suburbs that are lovely but expensive: Mosman (especially near balmoral beach), Cremorne, Neutral Bay, ...not on the train line but near ferries (depending on where in the suburb you are...busses normaly run to the wharfs). Waverton, Crows Nest, St Leonards are on the train and nice, but not as green as are near the North Sydney CBD...Artarmon, Chatswood, Lane Cove, Roseville are all lovely, good transport, slightly cheaper (as further from city) than Mosman etc, and Chatswood is only about 20 mins on the train from City.

Cheaper again but still lovely and green are Frenches Forrest, Belrose, Davidson...these are a fair bit further out but still on the North Shore so generally good schools, fascilities, parks etc. Not sure about transport here though.

\link{http://www.sydneybuses.info/\buses}
\link{http://www.cityrail.nsw.gov.au/\trains}

Let me know if you have specific Qs about suburbs, schools etc...might not know but might as I'm a Sydneysider!

Berowra is not that close...a long drive in peak hour! but very nice. St Ives is also nice but would take about 40 mins (maybe more?) to drive to the city in peak hour and are not on the train. Lindfield and Pymble are nearby and are on the train line...I think Turramurra is too...not sure though...

\link{http://www.schools.nsw.edu.au/schoolfind/locator/summaryschool.php?selectOption=8457\Killara High} is one of the best public high schools in Sydney(or so I've heard...did not go there) and is in the area you are talking about...but I've heared its hard to get into if outside the catchment area.

Oh and Sunny, try not to worry about the spiders! Any of these suburbs could have spiders, whether near the bush or not (Turramurra and St Ives are, so is Pymble, Roseville, Lane Cove, Chatswood...it depends where in the suburb you are, but they are all 'green' enough suburbs to have spiders - even the inner city can have them).

But honestly, its not as big a thing as people think...its not as though you are finding spiders in you bed every night or anything (actually its never happened to me or anyone I know...relax! :o). Sometimes a spider will come in the house,so you kill it (or catch it and take it outside if you are my kind DH or my Dad!). They are awful, but its not a big part of your daily existence. You can buy outdoor surface sprays and spray all around you window sills/doors etc if you like, and I would definately spray any outdoor cubby house/shed/garage where there are toys and bikes stored. But don't stay away from the beautiful green, bushy areas because you are afraid of the spiders...you would really be missing out.

Thank you very much astrophe for all the info - I had a look at the website for Killara High and it looks really nice - not sure if we can afford to buy in Killara itself but we can certainly afford to rent in the catchment (nice 4 bed house in Gordon for $580 a week). Ideally I would like to get there, rent for a while and see how things pan out - I don't want to end up buying a house I'll regret later. I'm going to work my way through the other suburbs you mention on the property websites - I might have more questions for you if you don't mind! One thing that occured to me is: if you start a child at a school and move out of the catchment area can they stay there? I have also heard that if you move within the catchment area the school has to take you regardless of whether they are full or not - not sure how this works but is it tru? The kids schooling is my main priority in this move and I don't want to keep moving them all over the place, on the other hand if we get it wrong location wise when we arrive I don't want to end up driving hours every day to an area where we no longer live.