Applying to top US universities from UK: SATs, essays and financial aid?

[phyllidafosset]

DD is in Y12, and so we have been discussing universities. The long and short is she doesn’t know what she wants to study, but she knows she wants to go to university (she is sure she doesn’t want to do a year out). After a lot of discussion we have started to wonder if a degree in the US would suit her because she can do a broad curriculum for a year or two and hopefully settle on what she loves. Career-wise she is focused on investment banking (!).

We have had a look, and some of the very top universities have good financial aid (and some do needs-blind admissions). She is doing 4 A-levels (maths/fm/econ/history), with a mix which I believe will be good for a liberal arts degree (or could lead to sciences/tech).

I know she would need stellar grades and stellar SAT results. I wondered how hard it is for UK applicants to achieve great SAT scores.

I am more worried about her ‘essay’ and her extra curriculars because they are going to be limited. She does do bits in school but she hasn’t done any of the stand out things I feel she might need. Has anyone got any experience of ‘normal’ UK students (with some supracurriculars) getting a place at a top US Uni?? Or any experience of applying? I am also unsure how far the financial aid goes (if you do get it) and what additional expenses (other than flights and visa) a UK student would have.

Realistically, is it too late to be considered this? Any thoughts/experiences would be appreciated!!!

She doesn’t want to live there. It is a concern but I know a lot of people in the US that are hugely distressed by the leadership. I think that the majority of people in the places she is considering would have that same mindset.

Some Dutch unis do liberal arts and sciences degrees in English.

Online searching is of course a valid form of research. However, if you want to join an investment bank in the UK, the recruitment calendar of Spring Week in First Year/major internship in the summer between Second and Third Year is only open to UK undergraduates. If you are at a US university you have to join the US recruitment rounds and without US work rights that is very complicated.

Does she know what investment banking actually entails? Yes the money but also the hours and misogyny. It's also not great for being AI proof. A lot of the entry level analyst roles are already going because spotting trends and writing quick reports for portfolio managers is so easy to automate now.

Thanks so much for the really helpful replies.

I should say that we will be so restricted by what Colleges we apply to because they will need very generous financial aid, and it is only the top top colleges that do that. So this is a long shot. But DD is bright and so there is a little shot at that long shot.

The challenge for all of this is her fixation on IB target unis. But the US widens that pool (in numbers at least, perhaps not so much for realistic chances!).

DD knows it is small chances at all. But if she doesn’t succeed, she will have to rethink.

@Itsbetterbythebeach that is really useful info, and reassuring about the SATs. My DD seems to have found one she tried online and thought the maths was super easy. But she does admit she might be a bit over confident about it 🤦‍♀️

What passports does your DD have?

@Monsterslam I don’t know if she really does and I am also very aware of the risk of AI to IB. Not sure if she is. I suggest Computer Science would be more lucrative, but she is fixated at the moment. But she is still so young. It is why a broader degree feels like it could work! It is so unrealistic asking kids to determine their lives so young. If you know what you like the UK system is great. It is crap if you don’t!

https://www.cdflaborlaw.com/blog/uscis-clarifies-the-100000-h-1b-visa-fee#:~:text=The%20easiest%20way%20to%20think,US%20Treasury's%20website%20pay.gov.

@Ceramiq I didn’t know that about the internships. That is really useful information, thank you. She only has a UK passport, so no working in the US (easily!). The challenge for me is that I want to support her aspirations but I don’t want her to limit her possibilities to discover other (less brutal) work opportunities/avenues!

Really useful! Would this: “Additionally, employers of F-1 students, H-4 Employment Authorization Card holders, or other nonimmigrants who wish to change their status to H-1B need not worry about the fee. These petitions are change of status petitions.” mean she was exempt? I don’t know if she would be on an F-1 visa?

I know she may not want to settle that, but she will be living there for a few years and universities are vulnerable to having programmes cut or overseas student visas revoked, under trump.

It really is a long shot OP. My kid had an SAT of 1570 with 800 in Math on her first attempt. Tons of extracurriculars and leadership experience. National Merit Scholar Finalist, etc.

She was rejected by all of the Ivies, but did get into a top 10 uni mainly because the Dean of Admissions personally reads all applications from his home state, which is where we live.

Just setting the scene a bit for you.

Her uni does give out full aid to students from abroad but she only ever met one student from the UK in her time there.

It is a long shot and will take a lot of time and energy. You’re up against people who have hired college advisors to help them navigate the process, edit personal statements and essays, etc. IIRC these colleges typically have an acceptance rate of about 5% or lower.

Good luck if you do go for it!

Tbh, I think that the visa information needs to be taken as a warning about how much harder it has become to work in the US and how new more restrictive laws may come into force in future. The worldwide direction of travel for work rights for non-citizens is more not less restriction.

@ZZTopGuitarSolo I really appreciate your response. I will share it with my DD because it really helps us to keep this (minuscule) possibility in context. Realistically, my DD can’t compete on an Extracurricular level. The UK just isn’t set up in the same way. It doesn’t mean some don’t achieve them, but structurally I would say it is very different.

And congratulations to your DD for fantastic SATs and a place in a fantastic College.

Thanks - btw your DD could apply to Rollins College in Florida. Much higher acceptance rate and they do offer aid to international students, although the chance of getting a full ride is still probably not great. It’s a beautiful campus in a lovely town just north of Orlando.

www.rollins.edu/apply/international/

you could make up some UK extracurriculars. Wellie Wanging for example. If you start the application with "I have been named leader of the next ten generations of tea baffooning, a popular extracurricular activity favoured by Lord teaman the 8th of teapotshire"

Is she looking at Oxford, Cambridge, Imperial, LSE as well? As a PP has said, getting internships is critical to get the experience for entry level jobs in finance and banking. She could consider Economics and Management or PPE at Oxford, HSPS at Cambridge. LSE has some interesting courses.

Hi OP. Haven't rtft, DD did the SAT last year. No prep except she bought the SAT book.

First test she got 1280 second time she got 1350.

That was enough for the schools she was applying to (not academic). She'd hVe needed 1450+ for Ivy League.

You can retake several times and take the highest score for the comprehension/maths sections. You can mix and match the scores.

If she is interested in prestigious uni would she consider Trinity College Dublin or UCD which do take international students .

The universities this student is interested in have endowments in the $$$billions.

The visa situation would give me pause, but overall, given the fact that the man in question has only two more years to go, and in light of the DD's preference for the liberal arts model, an application is worth a shot. The only way to be sure of not getting in anywhere is not to apply.

It is actually easier to get into Oxbridge as a U.K. student than it is to get into an Ivy. My DDs school has a US college advisor and they laid out the reality.

At MIT they accept 2.4 students from the UK each year. They have all been worldwide Olympiad winners in a STEM subject for the last few years. It’s similar at the Ivys. There’s bright and there’s BRIGHT.

If you apply from the U.K. and need financial aid to even attend then many colleges will reject you right off. There is a trend of students getting in and then being offered scholarships once they’ve started. My friend has a child at Fordham who started on full fees and now has a 60% fee reduction.

You should budget $100k per year for fees, living (including compulsory meal packages), insurance and flights. It’s a four year commitment.

American children work on their applications for at least two years prior. There’s a huge number of boxes to tick - academics (minimum top 5% of your year), extra curricular at high level, service / volunteering etc. Many hire college advisors to help with application essays. We were told either apply to the U.K. or USA, not both as it’s so time consuming and you need to be fully committed.

There’s lots of less well known universities that do offer fee reductions to internationals but if she wants to work in the big league then having a top U.K. university on her CV looks far better than somewhere nobody has heard of.

Two of mine went to the US, one to an ivy and one to a small liberal arts college in the Northeast. One of them was also a maths further maths A-level and sure they were headed to a finance career, but the liberal arts curriculum completely opened them up to new things and they went on to do an MA and now work in a completely different field.

What I would say is that if she's serious, your DD might want to think about taking a gap year and really building her extracurriculars, which will help. If she's good at test-taking an online SAT course should be sufficient. One of mine took the ACT instead of the SAT and aced it. The essay is a very different experience to the personal statement - it's really meant to be about you and your experience and who you are, what shaped you as a person, with a lighter focus on academics. I'm sure there are examples of successful ones online. I agree with the PP who said to make sure her current school is able to support the application as it requires more input from them than the UK ones.

In addition to the big name universities, the small liberal arts universities tend to have very large endowments and give a lot of aid. Of my three DCs, one went Ivy League, one oxbridge and one liberal arts, and I'd say the third was hands down the best experience. I'd have a look at Middlebury, Wesleyan, Amherst, Bowdoin, Bates, Colby, Hamilton, Tufts, Trinity and Williams, Kenyon, Oberlin, Swarthmore and Bryn Mawr (I'm sure I'm missing a few), although do keep geography in mind - some of them are in beautiful but remote settings and can be a faff to get to from the UK.

There's nothing to lose by trying except a few application fees!

Oh, and UCL has something that might fit:

www.ucl.ac.uk/arts-humanities/arts-sciences/study/undergraduate-study/arts-and-sciences-basc

Last year Trump randomly stopped allowing visas for students. All the kids at my DC international schools were scrambling for alternatives. A few other points just to air some differences
Is she ok with sharing a room with 2-3 other girls? Single rooms are very unusual at American universities. For first years it’s a bit like boarding school. There are strict rules an out behavior as well. And alcohol.
Factor in the costs of flights and the time difference for catch ups.
Plus you are a long way away if anything god wrong.
Look into the costs of health insurance.
In the current climate she is unlikely to get a Job in the Us after graduation. I have several friends- again from my DC international school and despite doing v well at their degree in America they are back in the Uk we they were Brits and could not get a job there.

Extra curriculars are very important.

@Ritaskitchen Yes, the complexity of entering the labour market after graudation with a US degree but no US work rights is crucial to underline. And it's wishful thinking to believe this might improve in the foreseeable future.