Brutal grad jobs market

[anotherglass]

Hello, my DS 22 graduated last July with an BEng from a Russell Group uni. Since then he has applied for around 60-70 jobs with no success. The whole process of online assessment, video interview and then rejection / ghosting is starting to grind him down. It is even tough to secure a part-time job in our area - such as a coffee shop or retailer - as he is considered over qualified and a risk, due to the fact he is searching for a full-time role.
I am finding myself worrying more and more about his mental health and future.
He is already less enthusastic about applying for jobs.

Any suggestions on what to do from here? Is it worth considering a Masters to try and ride out the horrendous job market?

Thank you

@anotherglass if you say where you approximately live people might be able to offer more tailored suggestions. When applying for 'filler' jobs, think about what might stand out on a CV and give him 'stories' for interview.

e.g. Are you near an airport? If so, even something like baggage handler will stand out in a CV for an aerospace engineering application over and above the hundreds of rival applications with hospitality/retail experience.

He could also get himself a CSCS Green Card so he can do casual labouring on building sites. This shows initiative and basic site safety knowledge, as well as showing he is not afraid of hard work.

After applying for months to the typical big company grad schemes with no success, DD was tipped off by a colleague about a scheme for the parent company of where she has had a part time job since sixth form.

Networking should be a big part of your job search, whether you're a new graduate or have years of experience.

LinkedIn etc can be good for identifying potential hiring managers in companies of interest. For larger companies, look for someone whose job title is Talent Acquisition and contact them directly.

For a profession like engineering, there must be plenty of industry events every month where you can meet engineers and potentially find out about opportunities for jobs or work experience etc.

Paradoxically, it's never been easier to search and apply for a job online by pressing the 'one click' or 'easy apply' button on the likes of LinkedIn, but jobs now get hundreds or even thousands of applications as a result.

DD doesn't know a single person on her course of c. 60 people who has secured a graduate job yet. It really is brutal, especially if you have no work experience, even part time work as many students seem to lack even this.

@FrancisBlundyActually I think there’s something in that. Now that I think about it, every job I’ve ever got has only asked for cover letter, CV and one interview (sometimes with a task at the interview). The most recent one was in 2023 so not that long ago. And it’s a good job with good pay, good conditions and we get treated very well in general. I’ve found that employers that ask for the moon on a stick at interview stage also do things like ghosting you and when you look at their reviews on Glassdoor they seem to have lots of unhappy employees and lots of turnover.

@JigsawTrouble He would have a three year gap if he didn’t mention it! Of course he should - it was a full time degree. Not a little course for one area of work. How would he explain the three years?

Lots of bigger employers have multiple rounds because they get a lot of applications. Smaller companies are less likely to do this because it ties up staff time and isn’t useful for them. I would not give up on any firm but getting to the interview stage is important.

I wish him every luck in this.

We run a small management consultancy company and I often receive speculative CVs and covering letters. The standard now compared to 4 years ago is mind blowing.

We used to be impressed if someone demonstrated they had taken the time to read about projects on our website - maybe 1% did this, probably only 5% mentioned the industry we consult within.

I remember speaking to a recruitment consultant at Gradcracker and they said they just couldn't convince grads to spend more time doing a really good application over doing hundreds of poor quality applications.

I used to be horrified at how poorly written covering letters were, but it didn't stop there. Online tests done at the last minute - not confirming attendance at interview, even then some didn't show up for interview or pulled out because we wouldn't supply them with the questions beforehand - at times it felt like I was parenting our applicants..

Whether it's AI or or the lack of opportunities that's driving application standards up - it was definitely easier to impress in the initial stages of an application. Of course AI is not as easy to rely upon as you go through the interview process.

Both my kids were lucky and got graduate jobs this year (dh and I both coached them and we put them in touch with a business contact. who helped them with their presentation skills - I think this was a game changer for them both - she was able to say things we couldn't).

Their friends are all starting to get somewhere too - it's taken longer than they had hoped, one of them has had to move across country - not her first choice but it's a good job, so she has compromised on location.

You just have to stick with it. My son applied for 50plus and eventually got one. I think going for a smaller more niche company rather than a big name one seems to be a bit easier. I have NO IDEA what the likes of TFL for example are looking for!

@NextLevel2
Agree no point sending 100s of poor generic cover letters but equally no point spending ages researching the company at stage 1 if this stage is standard numeracy/verbal reasoning/situational judgement and job motivation/interest in company not assessed to stage 3. DDs uni advice was focus on doing each stage well.

You want a covering letter to at least acknowledge that you have an interest in the job/company/industry, covering letters that are generic get passed over. An essay is neither wanted or required.

@OhDear111When I was looking for a stop gap job after graduating I left out my degree but listed the part time jobs I’d had while at uni, so there was no gap.
If he hasn’t had part time jobs at uni, then just be more vague - don’t put date of birth on the CV, then put what experience he does have, either from previous jobs or things like volunteering. Make it a skills based CV so the list of skills are at the top and there’s less focus on the chronological order of things.
This approach has always worked for me and I’ve always had job offers of some kind.

My last 2 jobs have been with large employers and neither of them had multiple rounds of recruitment, so they do exist. I don’t know how it is in engineering though.

Lying that you had a qualification would be bad, missing one off is fine. I tend to miss off my D in GCSE PE 🤷🏻‍♀️

Agree it's perfectly fine to omit qualifications from a CV.
In fact recently to keep my CV short enough I've just cut my gcses out (even though they are v good). My degrees and postgrad academics speak for themselves and any prospective employer is only really going to want to know about my career accomplishments

@Bufftailed one GCSE is not a 3 year degree! Most employers would think you had something to hide if you deliberately missed out three years! When I’ve had anything to do with recruitment it would be a red flag. We valued honesty and a coherent cv with no gaps!

@OhDear111I’m glad you weren’t a recruiter anywhere I’ve applied to then, because no one is obliged to put everything they’ve ever done on a CV, especially if not relevant to the job. There could be any number of reasons why someone has a gap, some of them could be personal and they don’t have to share that with you.

Yeah I know what you mean. But I think there are ways to present gaps and experience. If I genuinely thought my DC was failing to get an unskilled job because of a degree I’d help them to gloss it over with voluntary work/ travel/ part-time work…

What is your dd's course, out of curiosity? It sounds brutal out there for these young people.

A variant of Media Studies.

Not a typical media studies course as it is based around quite a lot of practical work but even so, I feel for the students when the potential jobs in that field are far fewer than the number of grads.

Young people have been let down by teachers and parents encouraging them to believe they can be whatever they want to be by studying whatever interests them most, and by a university funding system that just needed to get bums on seats. Parents can better help their children (and the UK economy) by encouraging them into sectors where there are skills shortages.

Make sure all the key skills or requirements from the job advert are included in the CV / cover letter / application. A lot of the big companies will be using automatic screening at this stage so including the key phrases and requirements will help you get through.

If he's getting though to interview or assessment centre is not likely to be the BEng that's the issue. It will be poor (relative to other candidates) interview technique or presentation style or group working. Or not researching the role and organisation. Has he had any actual feedback? He can request all and any data held on him so would be worth going back to some organisations and asking for the interviewers notes and feedback.

I'm involved in early careers recruitment at a large consultancy (not engineering specifically). The key things we are looking for are drive, curiosity, ability to work in groups and also independently, and professionalism and confidence when presenting and answering questions.

Good luck to him.

ETA - the networking won't get you that far at my firm. Maybe some interview tips or insights into key projects, but a lot of that can be found on the company website. A lot has been done in big organisations to make recruitment fair and unbiased, rather than getting the job because you are mates with the boss. Any approaches to recruitment leads or partners will direct you to the website to apply, they have no sway over who gets through. May be different in other places but that's just my experience.

@strungling And what are those sectors? Who does want employees they cannot get? We anre still importing people. How do we fit people into vacancies?

Unemployment is growing. A dc doing media studies simply cannot become a maths grad. Or an engineer. Their brains just don’t work that way. I totally agree we have over provision of second rate degrees but until people realise this for themselves, it won’t change.

If people think getting a 5 at GCSE is good enough for A levels (as they do on another thread) and then justify it by saying that schools which allow this are being inclusive, we have lost our marbles! What will these A levels lead to? Even if passed? Media studies possibly but we need to look at talent and be clear about what the best routes are into employment and it’s possibly not university. This is so tough at the moment so being honest would be a good start.

@OhDear111 "And what are those sectors?"

They're well documented, e.g here: https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/assessment-of-priority-skills-to-2030/assessment-of-priority-skills-to-2030

...and here: https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/skills-england

... and they don't all need maths.

I am part of our grad recruitment process, we had 5,000 + applicants this year for multiple disciplines including engineers.
We read each application ourselves and have seen so many strong candidates who just sit in silence when we've put them through to the assessment centres .

What do you want the kids who get 5s to do? So they may not get A stars, but what do you think they should go and do?

I think lower level apprenticeships or practical courses - trades. However it won’t suit many who went en office job - but they are going. Jobs in some sectors are available and employers just want reliable trainable people.

So much for Labour’s growth policies!