Do universities look at GCSE results?

[bendmeoverbackwards]

Dd didn’t do brilliantly at GCSE - 666665543

She hasn’t started A level study yet but is worried that even with good A level results, her GCSEs might be a problem. She wants a Russell group (I know, I know…. have tried to persuade her to keep an open mind).

How much do GCSE grades matter?

A very small number might for a small number of courses, but on the whole no they don’t. That said, 5s and 6s, if reflective of child’s natural ability, suggests A levels will be a tough ask, BTECs more suitable.

For highly competitive over subscribed courses they will be. Realistically, she's not going to be going for these so doing relatively well at A Level should be fine.

Some courses require minimum GCSE in certain subjects e.g. 5 in maths or similar.

This is the case at RG and non RG, where I've worked. Although it can IME be waived if there are contextual circs.

What subject does she want to study?

Those results are just fine, lots of passes. The 3 is a problem if it's Maths or English.

Some unis will want a 6 for Maths and English eg. UCL

Always check not only the course requirements but general admissions requirements page too. This sometimes catches people out.

The 3 was class civ so we can forget that one. The 6s were maths, English x 2 and double science.

Even if they don’t specifically ask for a minimum grade, she will be at a disadvantage against someone who got all 9s. However, if she does well at a levels it won’t close doors. Will she get into Oxbridge, no. A decent uni, most likely.

Yes some will have a at gcse as an entrance requirement

This is what I’ve been led to believe. My DS had identical scores. However, he is at a tech college where they require students to do AS levels in Y12 to check progress - they have to pass with a C or above to continue on. My DS managed to get AAB in those, so we are hoping that they offer ‘additional information’ in support of high predicted grades next year, but the college have been quite adamant that so long as they have: a 5+ in English and maths, good predicted grades, a well crafted personal statement (or the 3 questions this year), and strong references that is enough even with mainly 5s and 6s.

You need to check each uni criteria carefully. My dc needed a 7 from memory in English but no maths requirement. Don’t waste a choice on one not eligible for.

I agree those grades are fine as a base line. If she has excellent A level predictions that will help. And not ever RG is as competitive as the next one.

My daughter got similar GCSE results, she got 3 B in her A Levels and is off the a Russell Group Uni. Your daughter has got great results!

Some unis do look at GCSE results, and for some courses. But I am thinking medicine and Oxford/Cambridge/Imperial and I doubt she is looking there with those GSCE grades.

Otherwise some unis (for some courses or across the board) ask for 6 in eng or maths or Eng and maths. Many unis just want a 5 or a 4. It’s worth looking but as she has 6 in maths and Eng she should be OK. Which uni wanted a 7 in English I wonder? Probably for a English-focused course?

"She wants a Russell Group" - this indicates lack of knowledge which is probably understandable in a 16yo. The universities that make up the RG are not on an equal level and really a candidate needs to make a more focused decision than 'RG or nothing" (and hopefully she will).

Liverpool uni for example, or Cardiff, or Southampton (all in RG) would rank IMHO below Bath or Loughborough or St Andrews (not RG) for several courses. And would be easier to get into.

I would agree with a PP btw – her grades, solid though they are, don’t really suggest A levels. IMHO maths or science with a grade 6 is not a good plan, so that leaves English (fine with a 6) and what else? What A levels is she taking? If it's new hums type subjects like politics or sociology then the English grades are a good start.

I had higher expected grades than the course requirement for LSE but I didn’t get an offer. I can only think it was because I got C in GCSE maths as I was offered on all my other options. I wasn’t even applying for a maths / economics type course 🤷‍♀️ I went to Warwick instead but i guess sometimes they do look at GCSE grades.
Although I'm in the camp that you only need GCSEs for deciding your next educational decision such as A levels and then A levels for your degree and then your degree for your first job but even then that’s questionable as lots of graduates don’t actually go into the field of their degree. But after your first job I think your degree isn’t really relevant either more of a nice to have. Real experience is more important in my personal opinion. (Sorry side tracked the actual question).

Medicine does.

Some do and some don’t. It can vary between courses at the same university too so you need to check carefully.

Please get her to look beyond RG universities. They are definitely not the be all and end all, and can vary hugely between subjects in the same setting.

Does your dd know what subject she’d like to apply for?

She almost certainly won't be at a disadvantage against someone who got all 9s because only 1303 students across England and Northern Ireland got all 9s this year, out of 600,000, and so it's unlikely she'll come up against many of them, isn't it, really? I mean they won't all apply to the same university and subject and course as her, I'd have thought, indeed, I'd say the odds on that are diminishingly small (ie non existent).

I know all 1303 children have parents on MN, but it isn't as common as MN likes to constantly pedal.

OP, do explain to your daughter than Russell Group means only that they pay to be in a nice club, it's named after the room they met in when the group was formed, and it is designed to show the universities in that group are committed to research. Really good universities like Bath, St Andrews and Lancaster aren't a part of the club.

Rubbish of course her grades support A Levels! OP take absolutely no notice of this comment

Depends what she's aiming for. If A-levels likely to be much better she might be better deferring and applying with A level grades in hand.

It depends what A levels she is doing.

Maths A level with a grade 6 at GCSE (unless for some specific reason it was lower than expected) is definitely not advised. It is likely to lead to a poor outcome and a low grade. Maths teachers on this board support this view.

MFL with a grade lower than a 7 is also (inc caveat above) not a good plan as it suggests a lack of the basic knowledge which A level builds on.

Science I would suggest is not idea with a grade 6, tho a lot of schools will accept it.

IME English and related subjects (like Phil and ethics, sociology, gov/pol, maybe drama) especially if not studied at GCSE, is fine with a 6. Which is what I said.

Most DC don't want to be struggling through two years of A levels only to come out with Ds and Es. I’m not saying that is the OP’s DC (depends on subjects) but it is worth bearing in mind.

Whilst I agree with what you have said in this comment your previous comment was a blanket comment that the OP’s child shouldn’t bother with A levels given her results which is simply not true.

That sounds fine. She definitely needs maths. And then it depends on what she gets interested in via the more intense A levels studies.

Children develop at different rates. She may really revel in the in-depth nature of A levels.

Don't panic!

I actually said:
I would agree with a PP btw – her grades, solid though they are, don’t really suggest A levels. IMHO maths or science with a grade 6 is not a good plan, so that leaves English (fine with a 6) and what else? What A levels is she taking? If it's new hums type subjects like politics or sociology then the English grades are a good start.

I did not say she shouldn't bother with A levels. But her grades include 6 in maths and science, which indeed do not suggest A levels (in maths and science). Grade 6 in both Englishes us a good start towards English lit A level and new hums subjects. Which is literally what I said. And hopefully what she is doing.

Agree with this. My DS’s college has an algorythm which suggested in his first week of college Y12 that his grades (the same as OP’s DD) would predict CCD in A Levels. On this basis - ie the fact that he WOULD get A Levels - he was allowed to proceed. By December his end of topic tests moved him to BBC and by Easter they were confident he’d get BBB - enough to get into most mid level unis and/or a foundation year at even a Russell Group uni. He worked his socks off, did every assignment with 100% commitment and focus, and has managed for the first time in his academic history achieved 100% attendance. He goes to lunch time clinics, takes the advice to read around the topic (teachers happily give recommended reading lists).

I haven’t had a chance to look back through OP’s posts, but to this day we have no idea why my DS did fine in mocks (predicted 7-9s) and flopped a bit in exams and we can only assume it was a mix of nerves, stress, overwhelm at the sheer number and lengthy period of examination, perhaps combined with a bit of overconfidence. It’s a snap shot and not definitive, as my own DS’s subsequent AAB in AS Levels this year reveals.

If DD is otherwise really bright and had good mocks etc, then I’d sit down with her and make sure she really wants to do A Levels and is genuinely interested in the subjects she has been offered. I would then invest in a tutor to go through exam and revision technique, even if you just have one block of 10 sessions mid y12, to make sure she really understands what she may have done wrong or how she could improve. If there is no back story of struggling with grades in Y10/11 and she is 100% committed, there is no reason she can’t pull off BBB+ with the right support at home and school/college.

Re RG unis - please do as others suggest and talk to her about the fact that it is a self-selecting club. Yes, they are great unis, but Bath, Loughborough etc are all brilliant universities, too, who chose not to join. She should be looking at which subjects she is truly interested in to devote 3 years to and then look at the modules available. If the best courses include a couple of RG unis, and she is getting the grades by the end of Y12, great - but it’s not the best all and end all.

Some med schools score GCSEs as part of their interview shortlisting process but many don't.

More common is minimum GCSE requirements in certain subjects. I think Edinburgh requires a 7 in English for studying medicine. I'm not sure about other courses.

Russell Group is meaningless for undergraduate teaching.