Advice please on failed degree options

[anotherglass]

This is a follow on from my post earlier this week about son not passing his engineering degree. I had some very supportive comments about the situation, given the shock and despair we had at finding out he had not passed.

He is doing resits in August but even if he passes his degree will be capped at a Pass, with no honours.

I am looking for advice on options from here, which include:

• resitting the year but the exam marks will be capped at 40%
• applying for extenuating circumstances and resitting the modules with the possibility of an Honours degree. Not sure what happens if he does not pass the resit, but all being well this will be good
• The backstop is a Diploma of Higher Education if the worst happens and no degree awarded.

He is being assessed for ADHD. I have always suspected there were issues with his focus and concentration but never went down the assessment route earlier but he has struggled at times with organisation. His exam results were a mixed bag of very good to poor. He is capable but has challenges.

Any advice on routes out of this would be much appreciated. I am trying to keep positive for him and hide my heartbreak. Thank you

Well look on the bright side! No job, no loan repayments. No decent job - very low repayments. Luckily for him it’s not debt. It’s free if you don’t earn much or don’t work at all. Repayments are based on salary and £40,000 is the bare minimum for 3 years fees and the minimum loan for maintenance. It could be much much higher and no masters to worry about at the moment.

Bloody hell that’s low, even for you.

You have been reported. I am dealing with a YP with extremely fragile mental health. Your comments amount to trolling.

Hi OP. I hope it works out for your son. Out of curiosity, how does the diagnosis help with resits? are the grades not capped?

Once he gets his first job it won't matter that it is no honours. If he is prepared to relocate and come across well at interview he will get an engineering job.

My daughters both have a lot of additional needs - they both went to special needs schools and get PIP - and the minute they turn 18 you, as the parent, are out of the loop. Actually with their ehc plans it was at 16. I do get included in one daughter's medical stuff as she gave written permission for me to deal on her behalf and they contact me. She can barely read but all letters from the NHS go directly to her.

You therefore have to work with your son and hope he will let you in. But if he doesn't, there is nothing you can do, sorry.

Thank you. As I understand, if a disability if extenuating circumstances are approved then the resit is uncapped.

@anotherglass Really? Just the truth. He hadn’t got a debt. He’s got to pay a graduate tax if he gets a job. You are not keen on anyone who has different opinions. You perhaps need to reflect on the fact he didn’t speak to you. He cannot get an Engimeerjng job leading to professional engineer status, CEng or IEng. So you need to work out how he’s going to get a job. Sorry if that’s truthful.

if he now has a diagnosis look into DSA , they supply funding for extra support.

students union are a good help to advocate and UNI disability support should now help as well if diagnosis in place.

@titchy True though! I hate it when people bring up “debt”. It isn’t and it’s besides the point. It’s like saying I paid for this rubbish degree and I deserve better for my money (or the debt!) That’s clearly not possible and the op says her DS didn’t speak to her. I didn’t make it up. Never mind - I’m glad I have made you think!

I am working with my son. He has been open with me and consented to my involvement with university and medical communications. We are now acting as a team. Thankfully now working towards acceptance of the situation and getting a good outcome.

You're saying he was fine all the way to year 4, then failed 2 exams and you think the uni should have taken that as some kind of red flag? Failed exams may more likely flag as a not studying issue than a needing support booking a GP appointment.
If he didn't tell anyone he needed help, you can't blame the uni for not giving him help, especially when YOU didn't notice either.
Funny how he was managing until this year and now suddenly he has ADHD. Strange.

Your post has an aggressive tone. I never said he was fine all the way to year 4. The issues came seriously to light in Year 4 but I do not have to explain the entirety of my son's situation to you. The path to diagnosis for adults is littered with issues, and there comes a crisis point when things come truly to light. We are dealing with a huge amount as a family and having to justify this to a stranger on mumsnet is pants.

Why are people kicking the OP when she is down?

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

@anotherglass I don't have any advice other than to say to your son that it isn't a failure to ask for help. I hope he can find a way through this and wish you both the best.

Thank you @RampantIvy x

In my son’s case, the diagnosis meant his first fail was discounted, the uni treated it as if it had never happened. It also gave him access to the disability and wellbeing department which is only open to students with a diagnosis.

There is this really weird idea on MN that as soon as a young person turns 18 that’s job done, they’re an adult and they do everything for themselves, parents who remain involved are mollycoddling or interfering. In the real world nobody I know is like that. When you have a uni aged child who is neurodivergent or has other needs of course you remain involved!!

I also agree that unis could do more. I had lunch with a friend a while ago, she is a uni lecturer albeit in a different uni and different subject to my DS. She and all her colleagues are measured on progression rates and she said they all follow up on students who are struggling to see what’s going on. Yes it might be partying or lack of interest but there can be other things going on too. Friend said that part of her role was part social worker, part Mum and she always had a box of tissues on her desk. She proactively contacts people who appear to be in trouble. In my DS’s case, he couldn’t even get support / advice when he asked for it. Complete disinterest from academic staff. It appears to be a big course, big uni problem, DS is just a number, he has no personal relationship with any staff and they simply do not care.

@anotherglass I would also suggest that you ask your son whether he feels he’d benefit from tutoring. We used an online tutoring service and it was not expensive at about £30 per hour. The tutor helped DS focus on the areas he struggled on in a way we could not support him with as his degree is very techie.

Ignore the critics OP, I’ve been where you are more or less and it’s a very worrying time when you have a distressed and upset son or daughter, whatever their age.

There is this really weird idea on MN that as soon as a young person turns 18 that’s job done, they’re an adult and they do everything for themselves, parents who remain involved are mollycoddling or interfering. In the real world nobody I know is like that. When you have a uni aged child who is neurodivergent or has other needs of course you remain involved!!

I agree @tammienorrie DD is NT but still asked for a bit of hand holding at times as an undergrad student. I suspect the posters who think this have DC who have never had any kind of problems and these posters simply don't get that other young people aren't like their DC.

I also agree with your comment about big universities with large subject cohorts. DD didn't get to know any of the teaching staff on her course. They often saw lecturers only once and there was no opportunity to build up a rapport with any of them. There were over 300 in her cohort and the whole experience was very impersonal.

Her masters is a completely different kettle of fish. There are only 40 of them and DD often chats to tutors after tutorials. They are approachable and she asks questions that often flummox them.

@anotherglass read the thread on this page titles “missed y3 resits” as that situation is very similar to yours.

It will vary between universities, but in my department all fails are notified by email at the same time as the provisional results being released. This email outlines the process if they have realised that they have Mitigating Circumstances and the steps they should follow. It also cc's in the Programme Manager and then the PM usually reaches out to the student too. Usually, the PM will know about the student already and if they don't then a good PM will make it their business to know. Obviously if the student doesn't reply to the email (they may also mention it in passing if they see them around) then there is nothing they can do as we can't force engagement. If the student does engage with a member of staff then they can be signposted to what/where/who they need to see/do for whatever the issue is which led to the fails. In my experience, most students do engage, it is rare to hear radio silence from a student, because they want a first attempt at their resit and will go out of their way to tell you all about their life.

In terms of finding out, he will have to tell you and/or give you the log in details for his email. He is an adult and unfortunately that means the university will not be able to discuss it with you, unless he gives explicit consent. If you do get consent from him, and he has deleted the emails, then the staff should be still able to show what was sent from their end as we have to have records of every interaction/what was said in case a student appeals and/or we want to review correspondence at a later date.

That said, all universities are different and that staff are very stretched. It may be the terminology is different (I had a Director of Studies rather than a Programme Manager, and some colleagues have Administrator in their job title) but essentially, there will be someone who is his designated point of contact at the uni and should have had some level of engagement with him at the time of the provisional results release. All of the information about applying for MCs/academic support/disability support/who to contact should also be available on his Moodle platform or similar, and will likely have also been presented to students at some point by someone like me. Once you have knowledge of who this is, it will become much easier to navigate.

Edit: Who sent him the email with the provisional degree outcome? This wpuld be a good place to start. There will also have been a detailed conversation at the exam board (with external examiners present) about individual student outcomes which will have been noted somewhere specific too.

No my DS is not a design engineer but he is a member of the Institute of Mechanical Engineers and to become a member you have to prove yourself as an engineer not management!
I must admit to not knowing what level he attained, there are several, but I was pointing out, with hard work, a ND adult can go on to have good careers in the area they had set their sights.

Hi OP, I haven’t managed to read all the thread (gave up at some of the trolling) but things I would suggest:

• your son should apply for DSA with his finance for resit year
• separately he should speak to the disability team about support direct from uni (student support plans, study coaches, ND support groups, there will be loads)
• there will be someone on his student portal or account where he can allow you to speak to people on his behalf, enable it
• if he is amenable, get his log ins for him and check his emails
• with his log ins you can see his timetables including submissions and exams. If he is agreeable, support him with reminders and check ins

normally I would be against what I have advised above as I’m a big believer in students need to stand on their own two feet but with a late adhd diagnosis and a final attempt at getting a degree I think it’s got to be done

OP I can’t help with the uni side of things but I am an engineer in the automotive sector. If you think DS would do better in a work environment then my 2p is to take the diploma rather than putting him through another set of exams. We have many, many levels of technicians, engineers, technical specialists- some (actually quite a few) of our best came in with ‘lesser’ qualifications. It’s an industry that naturally lends itself to the talented climbing the ladder. And as well as the obvious engineering roles the man on the street could name there’s a whole plethora of other roles, with varying degrees of technical content, within an engineering company.

I can understand the disappointment and feeling of having been let down, but I think you/DS should consider just getting out there, getting a job somewhere he likes the look of, settling in, and moving up in time. Best wishes to DS.