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Original poster

Parents of US student looking for general UK uni advice

301 replies

Valleysaurus · 28/01/2025 22:43

Hello

Our eldest daughter is a junior in high school in the States and is seriously considering pursuing her bachelors course at a UK university. Her high school marks and test scores will not be high enough for her to be competitive at the more selective universities. If we understand the UK entry requirements, we suspect our daughter would qualify for courses with entry requirements at the ABB or BBB level. We don't think she is particularly concerned about institutional pedigree, just fit. Likewise, international fees are not a primary consideration in our choice because, believe it or not, even at the international rate, many UK universities are more affordable than their US counterparts.

Like many high school students in the United States, she does not have a clear idea of what course she would like to study in university, but we suspect she will settle on a course focused on environmental studies, sustainability, conservation or tourism and hospitality. Which leads to the questions:

Given her applicant profile, which UK universities (if any) have a closer-knit campus community? Think a lot of students living in university accommodations and/or located in a city that is what we might call a "college town" in the States.

Are sandwich programs at all useful for international students in helping to find work post graduation?

Is it weird that admissions representatives are not returning our emails? We've contacted a few universities with questions about entry for 26/27 school year and it's been crickets...

Thanks!

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
itsallnewnow · 02/02/2025 08:49

Has anyone mentioned Leeds? Absolutely teaming with students so lots going on. Easy train to London and an airport nearby for connections to the US.

They have Leeds university if she can get in Russel group so more prestigious) but also Leeds Beckett a solid middle tier option.

OnGoldenPond · 02/02/2025 08:54

Valleysaurus · 30/01/2025 12:25

Really great thoughts! Thank you. As an American, I wouldn’t presume to know the quality of UK universities other than, and setting Oxbridge aside, they generally have a very solid international reputation. I can speak with some familiarity about US higher ed as an academic here for the past 15 years. I am confident in saying that pedigree, aside from the handful of American universities you all are familiar with, is worth very little. Even in careers where pedigree seems to matter more (e.g. NY finance/consulting, DC politics, west coast tech), a name brand school may buy you some access to networks and little else. Despite the Harvard club’s incessant reminder that they’ve gone to Harvard. And our daughter isn’t likely to be a competitive applicant at US pedigree institutions anyway.

You might be surprised at just what little stock employers here place in a college degree, from anywhere. My experience is that which uni you go to matters very little on the job market - aside from it ticking a requirement and, more valuably, serving as a conversation starter with an interviewer or hiring manager.

I’ve done a fair amount of hiring (admittedly in specialized fields of entertainment and media) and if I were to see an applicant from an overseas university - any university, it would be more interesting. I would, whether warranted or not, assume the candidate to be somewhat adventurous and would be curious to learn more about those adventures.

So, given my experience (biases?) I’m probably a little less concerned about reputation or direct vocational placements than most. Even a bit less so than our daughter to be honest. Wherever she ends up, it’s my hope that it’s a positive environment, where she’s surrounded by friendly people and pushed to grow - personally and academically. With those goals in mind, I think a lot of the schools everyone has mentioned could fit the bill. We shall see…

Thanks so much!

Interesting you have links to the entertainment industry OP, as performing arts is one area where the UK is definitely seen as world leaders. The top UK drama schools are generally regarded as the best in the world and quite a few of those are UCAS universities so quality for student loan funding for UK students.

DorotheaDiamond · 02/02/2025 09:08

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Wow that’s rude! I was looking at unis in mid 80s and have dc in year 13 so I have no idea why you think @TizerorFizz is too old to be in this thread!

OnGoldenPond · 02/02/2025 09:15

Needmoresleep · 01/02/2025 09:42

Oddly, as long as you stay away from the strongly sectarian areas, crime in Belfast, my left field suggestion, is very low. The University has a lovely situation in safe south Belfast not far from the City centre and adjacent to the Botanical Gardens. Housing and general cost is living is also reasonable. The City is served by an international airport and Dublin Airport is not that far away.

We spent some time in Belfast when DD was in a play at the Lyric there and found it a lovely, friendly city. Stayed near the Botanic Gardens and it had a lovely feel. Don't know a lot about the university but saw the campus which is very attractive with lovely old buildings and very well situated close to the city centre. Always felt very safe during our time there.

When I was applying to university it was a complete no no as were still in the middle of the troubles, but if I was applying now I would definitely give it a very close look.

OnGoldenPond · 02/02/2025 09:19

Phineyj · 01/02/2025 13:29

Liverpool is in the NE, facing across the Irish Sea.

North West!

boys3 · 02/02/2025 09:52

Ceramiq · 29/01/2025 06:30

OP - you need to employ a professional admissions consultant or you could go very wrong indeed. You mention "fit" and you are absolutely right to do so. A professional admissions consultant will suss out your family and your DC and give you a nice shortlist of appropriate universities and courses.

probably the single best piece of advice on the thread

TizerorFizz · 02/02/2025 10:00

@boys3 You haven’t read the thread then! Several of us have said this. However the op has hospitality and environment as possible degrees and that truly muddies the water. Not many high tariff unis do the former.

@DorotheaDiamond Some posters dislike older people. I don’t really understand why anyone thinks an older person isn’t capable of keeping up to date or have useful experience? I had dc later in life and I don’t feel ready to be written off as irrelevant. Yet!

Phineyj · 02/02/2025 10:20

Wow, this is fun, are posters going to tell me off for typing E instead of W as long as the thread runs? Do you think I also think Ireland is to the east of the UK land mass?

😂

boys3 · 02/02/2025 10:36

well I quite obviously have read the full thread @TizerorFizz given the wording of my comment.

it’s full of lots of well intentioned comments, though a number, as typical on any HE thread, are not necessarily well informed. As such @Ceramiq‘s relatively early post remains imo, and others are free to disagree, the single best piece of advice.

poetryandwine · 02/02/2025 11:33

boys3 · 02/02/2025 10:36

well I quite obviously have read the full thread @TizerorFizz given the wording of my comment.

it’s full of lots of well intentioned comments, though a number, as typical on any HE thread, are not necessarily well informed. As such @Ceramiq‘s relatively early post remains imo, and others are free to disagree, the single best piece of advice.

I think @TizerorFizz means that @Ceramiq is one of several to have mentioned on this thread that the use of a consultant is a good idea in this case.

However I wish to emphasise that I, at least, thought of her when writing it, as she has suggested it in similar circumstances on other threads. I am not sure who first mentioned it here, not that it matters.

TheGander · 02/02/2025 12:04

FWIW ( probably very little) I spent time in Belfast in the early 2000s and really liked it, it is warm, friendly and has an energy you don’t really find in many cities. Agree with Needmoresleep, the area around the university and botanic gardens is lovely. As an aside, if you want to find a nice area in any city just find the botanic gardens.

Original poster
Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 12:21

Thanks again for all the great advice! Here are the UCAS unis where we're going to really encourage her to take a deep look, based in part on previous comments. Whether she would be truly competitive at one or any remains an ongoing process of discovery.
Queens University Belfast
Exeter Penryn
U of Liverpool
U of Lancaster
Durham with foundation year

We should have a bit more clarity in March when she takes her SAT. We're also going to encourage her to look at attending a few open days, if we can make the scheduling work. If none of these unis end up working out, I'm pretty sure she can have a successful outcome through clearing, if she wishes. I've been encouraging her to consider options outside of the UK if she wishes to explore a course in tourism. So, I'm fairly comfortable in saying that her preferred course in the UK would be one focused on environmental science/sustainability.

OP posts:
HeronWing · 02/02/2025 12:30

I didn’t see it discussed further up the thread, OP, but why Exterior Penryn? I had a friend who used to run a now-defunct MA there (absorbed back into main subject offerings at thenExeter campus), and it always felt remote and rather forgotten, as Falmouth isn’t an exciting place in which to be student? This may have changed, obviously, but I certainly thought it was a depressing spot ten years ago.

Original poster
Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 12:38

HeronWing · 02/02/2025 12:30

I didn’t see it discussed further up the thread, OP, but why Exterior Penryn? I had a friend who used to run a now-defunct MA there (absorbed back into main subject offerings at thenExeter campus), and it always felt remote and rather forgotten, as Falmouth isn’t an exciting place in which to be student? This may have changed, obviously, but I certainly thought it was a depressing spot ten years ago.

Exeter is, admittedly, the one we've looked at the least, but it appears it has a focus on sustainability

OP posts:
boys3 · 02/02/2025 12:56

I know I can on the odd occasion be a bit of a facty person.🤣 The fact in this instance is that Ceramiq was - page one of the thread - the first person to propose this advice. Thus becoming the leader and as a leader has subsequently seen a number of followers emerge. Supporters might be the better word in this instance, given the eminent good sense of her suggestion.

equally on the first page of the thread a number, this might be of more interest to the OP, of Scottish universities were flagged as a consideration by many. With good reason.

St.Andrews - home to almost 1 in 5 US undergrads in the UK. The number one destination by some distance.

Edinburgh and Glasgow follow next. Together with StA these three are the choice for near one-third coming from the US.

a somewhat less positive view of London. And yet the next four institutions with the most undergrads from the US are in London. Royal Holloway not amongst them, seems the charms of Egham has yet to fully resonate. The more central charms of Arts, London, Kings and UCL do have an appeal.

7 institutions account for 45%, so not far off half, of all US undergrad in the UK.

we then add in Oxford (not Oxford Brooks which is not a great destination of choice), Aberdeen, Durham, Northumbria, Queens Belfast (again has had several mentions on the thread), Aberystwyth, both universities in York and a handful more in London to complete our list of unis with at least 100 undergraduates from the US. Taking 60% of the US total.

The fact that I’ve used the 100 cut off indicates that US students make up a very small percentage of the UK’s international undergrad population. And ignores the fact that the likes of Exeter, Manchester, Cambridge are only just below that arbitrary threshold.

Interestingly Lancaster, an excellent universityagain with several mentions, plus with an international undergrad percentage above the average has hardly any, not much more than a handful from the HESA stats, from the US. Clearly a growth opportunity.

The postgrad picture is a bit different Cambridge, LSE, Imperial all in the top 10. However UG is where the OP’s focus is, so little point getting into the PG profile.

Needmoresleep · 02/02/2025 12:59

If she can't get the Open Days to line up, she should simply phone or walk into the Admissions Office or Department and ask if there is some she can speak to. Most University websites have self guided tour maps. I visited a few London Universities (albeit ones with a lot of overseas students) with an Asian friend and her son, and they really rolled out the red carpet for him. Potentially 3 years of overseas student fees!

Penryn is an odd one. A friend of DDs missed his grades for Exeter so was offered Penryn instead. He was studying a STEM subject but really enjoyed the shared campus with arty students from Falmouth U, and he graduated with a well-regarded U of Exeter degree, and ironically is now doing better than many of his Oxbridge peers. He did well at the end of his first year so was offered the chance of transferring to the main campus, but decided he preferred Falmouth. But...it is a bloody long way from anywhere and attracts a certain sort of arty, outdoorsie, surfie student. Perhaps the closest we have to UC Santa Cruz.

If you are looking for somewhere which is reasonably vocational and which might be flexible on grades, I still think Bournemouth is a good pick. Good beach, good football (soccer) team, good connections and a large town rather than a city feel. It is a newish University but punches slightly above its weight because Bournemouth is seen as an attractive place to live.

Original poster
Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 13:13

@boys3 Glasgow is definitely on her list, likewise Aberystwyth. We're hoping we may be able to sneak them in via the common app rather than UCAS

OP posts:
Original poster
Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 13:28

I'll also chip in on the consultant recommendations. I know they're well intentioned. I appreciate the advice, and also appreciate those of you who have sent me a private message with specific recommendations. Perhaps I'm a cynical American, but some of the recommendations read like a sales pitch. I work with business consultants a lot and find, with few exceptions, they offer very little new information or value, save for saving time of those not interested in doing the research themselves. Is that rude?

OP posts:
ocs30 · 02/02/2025 13:30

Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 13:28

I'll also chip in on the consultant recommendations. I know they're well intentioned. I appreciate the advice, and also appreciate those of you who have sent me a private message with specific recommendations. Perhaps I'm a cynical American, but some of the recommendations read like a sales pitch. I work with business consultants a lot and find, with few exceptions, they offer very little new information or value, save for saving time of those not interested in doing the research themselves. Is that rude?

I don't know who has been recommended to you, but, yes, I think yours is a bit of an unnecessarily cynical take. Some of them are really quite good, there are big differences in systems and cultures, and it's a big decision, so I'd be careful about being too hubristic. You want to make a really considered choice and there may be factors that are hard to see from where you stand.

poetryandwine · 02/02/2025 13:35

boys3 · 02/02/2025 12:56

I know I can on the odd occasion be a bit of a facty person.🤣 The fact in this instance is that Ceramiq was - page one of the thread - the first person to propose this advice. Thus becoming the leader and as a leader has subsequently seen a number of followers emerge. Supporters might be the better word in this instance, given the eminent good sense of her suggestion.

equally on the first page of the thread a number, this might be of more interest to the OP, of Scottish universities were flagged as a consideration by many. With good reason.

St.Andrews - home to almost 1 in 5 US undergrads in the UK. The number one destination by some distance.

Edinburgh and Glasgow follow next. Together with StA these three are the choice for near one-third coming from the US.

a somewhat less positive view of London. And yet the next four institutions with the most undergrads from the US are in London. Royal Holloway not amongst them, seems the charms of Egham has yet to fully resonate. The more central charms of Arts, London, Kings and UCL do have an appeal.

7 institutions account for 45%, so not far off half, of all US undergrad in the UK.

we then add in Oxford (not Oxford Brooks which is not a great destination of choice), Aberdeen, Durham, Northumbria, Queens Belfast (again has had several mentions on the thread), Aberystwyth, both universities in York and a handful more in London to complete our list of unis with at least 100 undergraduates from the US. Taking 60% of the US total.

The fact that I’ve used the 100 cut off indicates that US students make up a very small percentage of the UK’s international undergrad population. And ignores the fact that the likes of Exeter, Manchester, Cambridge are only just below that arbitrary threshold.

Interestingly Lancaster, an excellent universityagain with several mentions, plus with an international undergrad percentage above the average has hardly any, not much more than a handful from the HESA stats, from the US. Clearly a growth opportunity.

The postgrad picture is a bit different Cambridge, LSE, Imperial all in the top 10. However UG is where the OP’s focus is, so little point getting into the PG profile.

@Ceramiq , this is correct and I apologise for not crediting you; I simply missed your post.

Interestingly, it is unclear how far out of reach Edinburgh and St A’s are for Overseas students in these fiscally challenging times.

OP, that lower A level entry requirement both list of ABB for Env Science refers to Contextual (Affirmative Action) offers. But the bottom line is that admission is at the discretion of the tutors.

Unless you have spaces to spare between the use of the Common App and UCAS, I would choose between them. They are both enormously desirable universities and whether they would go below ABB even for Overseas is a long shot. This is a perfect question to ask of The Student Room and also of admissions teams, once information from DD’s SATs is available.

Many Schools and Departments at St A’s have fantastic student satisfaction ratings (we do a national survey of final year students annually, by School or Dept, The National Survey of Student Satisfaction or NSS. Results online). Awful weather, however.

@boys3 Oxford Brookes has some good niche programmes, just like so many of the post 1992 universities. I am still learning about the many pockets of excellence scattered throughout the UK, and I write that as a former admissions tutor in a highly ranked RG STEM School. You might also be interested in broadening your knowledge.

OP, yes Oxford is a real city. The other side of this is that there is a lot to do, and of course it is full of YP. Good food, great pubs, can’t get more characterful. It is close to both countryside and London. It isn’t overwhelming and public transport is pretty good. I love it.

Original poster
Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 13:46

@ocs30 Perhaps you're right, perhaps it is hubris. But I'm also pretty confident in our ability to successfully navigate this process. I'm also not super focusd on optimizing in the extreme here. So much will be beyond our control once she gets to wherever she ends up going. She's not a kid whose ambitions depend on a narrow and prescribed handful of paths. Daughter is a confident self-advocate and knows herself well-enough to make a solid choice - one that we'll fully support. And if it doesn't work, for whatever reason, she'll end up alright.

OP posts:
Cakeandusername · 02/02/2025 13:47

My dc is at Glasgow. Lots of Americans at Glasgow and the Glasgow uni parents Facebook group is predominantly USA parents.
We really liked Belfast. Lots of international students and they offered lots of activities and trips at weekends. Very affordable accommodation/cost of living.

ocs30 · 02/02/2025 13:52

Valleysaurus · 02/02/2025 13:46

@ocs30 Perhaps you're right, perhaps it is hubris. But I'm also pretty confident in our ability to successfully navigate this process. I'm also not super focusd on optimizing in the extreme here. So much will be beyond our control once she gets to wherever she ends up going. She's not a kid whose ambitions depend on a narrow and prescribed handful of paths. Daughter is a confident self-advocate and knows herself well-enough to make a solid choice - one that we'll fully support. And if it doesn't work, for whatever reason, she'll end up alright.

There's a difference between optimising in the extreme and maximising the amount of information you have when making an important decision. By which I'm talking less about future outcomes and more about your daughter's health and happiness over the next three (or four) years. As someone who has sent two of my kids across the ocean for college, I can tell you, there are a lot of variables along the way, and it's nice to go into it with some degree of confidence. But everyone follows their own path. I wish you the best of luck and a successful outcome for your daughter.

poetryandwine · 02/02/2025 14:23

It isn’t rude, OP, but as I said earlier this is the first time I’ve ever recommended a consultant. I think I understand. In another sphere, my mother for years had a decorating consultant who really excels in drawing out and executing her clients’ tastes. The one time I tried one, it was a disaster. She only wanted to push her own ideas, and one vendor who was pretty clearly giving her sales commission. I am sure it is the same with HE consultants.

However. Now that DD is concentrating on Environmental/ Sustainability Sciences for the UK, IIRC, one aspect of the need is removed.

Also, now that she will consider FYs - and many good ones that are not strictly International (which may not be right for native speakers anyway) are delighted to take Overseas students - she might want to change tactics. She could limit the intake of information from the post 1992 universities to what she finds from reliable sources instead of researching them systematically. At the national universities she likes, if she doesn’t quite meet the Entry standard she could enquire about the appropriate FY. I think she would get a good proportion of positive responses. Durham, by all means, but why stop there?

boys3 · 02/02/2025 14:54

You might also be interested in broadening your knowledge.

Gosh @poetryandwine never associated you with the snarky comment brigade.😮

But to clarify:

Oxford Brooks (sic) which is not a great destination of choice

was written in the context of where international students choose to go, not as a criticism of it as a university. In a post wholly about international undergrad destinations I assumed that did not need to be restated in every sentence. However, my wording was undoubtedly clumsy and open to potential misinterpretation. And that's before we get to the spelling issue!

I should have written something more along the lines of:

Oxford Brookes - a somewhat less popular destinatiion for international undergraduates.

a factual statement statement leaving limited opportunity for misunderstanding, but perhaps an eyebrow raise or two. Even I was surprised by its international figures - expecting them to be at least in line with, if not a little above, the sector average,

In terms of broadening knowledge, well I've always embraced that. In a world where we see an ever increasing casualisation, acceptance and celebration of ignorance, broadening and championing knowledge and understanding,s something all of us should actively embrace.