Do you need all A* GCSE for Oxbridge?

[Almostwelsh]

I have a DC who is doing very well at school. We are in Wales, which still has the old grade boundaries, so I believe there is less differentiation between the top grades than in England.

Noone else in the family has ever been Oxbridge material, so I'm unfamiliar with what is required.

DC is doing equally well in all subjects at present and is undecided which A levels to take, but is predicted As in all subjects at GCSE, with A* if he works hard.

He goes to a state comprehensive. Am I deluded to start thinking about Oxbridge as a possibility? Could he be penalised for it not being possible to achieve a grade 9 at GCSE (which I believe is higher than an A*)?

No. You can find Freedom of Informtn requests which shows that many successful applicants did not have all A* (or 8s/9s) at GCSE level. Occasional C grade in there, even.

That said, most successful applicants had majority A*s at GCSE level, and also depends which course.

Why Oxbridge? What's wrong with other Unis?

There's nothing wrong with other universities, but I want him to consider all the options and I think it's still undeniable that Oxbridge gives a unique experience, looks good on your CV and can also work out cheaper than some other universities, so if it's an option for him it would be worth an application.

He sounds like what they are looking for.

He can apply to any college, but some have particular ties to Wales.

For Oxford:

www.new.ox.ac.uk/oxfordforwales

www.gov.wales/partnership-between-jesus-college-oxford-and-wales-brightest-students-unveiled-major-education

Seren Network

No, you don't need all A* at GCSE.

My son applied to do Computer Science at Cambridge a couple of years ago. First they had a Maths exam in the autumn for all applicants to that course; the ones who did well enough in the Maths exam were given interviews. My son did the interview, but didn't get a place.

While my son didn't get a place, this was clearly not because of his GCSE results - Cambridge knew about his GCSE results from the beginning from his application form, but that didn't stop them giving him an interview. (They don't give interviews unless you're a serious candidate - interviews are a significant investment of time and effort for them.)

My son had a mixed bag of GCSE results, including one 4, but this didn't stop him getting to the interview stage.

No, it doesn't have to be 'straight A stars'.
Oxford typically puts more weight than Cambridge on GCSEs, but contextualised to some extent. I'm sure they understand the Welsh grades!

However - obviously their offers require high grades at A level (Cambridge moreso than oxford) and the degrees themselves require very hard work as well as brains. It's the 'if' about whether he works hard which might give more pause for thought about whether these are likely to be the best fit for your DC. Some kids mature, buckle down and develop the necessary self motivation - others don't.

He should be part of the seren network and if is he will have additional opportunities such as Oxford summer school in year 12. It is worth getting support around interviews etc and see how many students from his school have gone.

You don't need all 9s, Oxford counts 8s and 9s the same, and it's also done in context of school and quantity taken into account. Do need to also be able to do very well in entry tests if applicable. Cambridge interview a higher percentage than Oxford. Varies by subject as well but if you can go and visit and apply.

I seem to remember talk of him being in a Seren network, but that was some time ago when he was maybe year 8. I confess I don't really know what it entails.

His school sends one or two children to Oxbridge most years and maybe 40 to RG universities, out of a 6th form Yr13 of about 150. It is one of the better comprehensives in the area, so I doubt he would qualify for any contextual offers.

Basically most of his teachers indicated he should get an A in their subject if he put in average to minimum effort, but an A* if he revises effectively.

The one exception is French where the prediction is B to A on that basis. He does have another MFL predicted A to A* (Welsh as a non Welsh speaker).

I guess I'm just musing about whether I should point him towards Oxbridge as an option. He probably wouldn't think of it without prompting, as noone in the family or anyone we know has been

No.

I went to Cambridge and I got a B in woodwork.

Honestly they don't really care about GCSEs if you are interested in your subject, clever, and clearly bright.

My old school took a group of yr 11 students to Oxford to meet staff and students - think raising aspirations. We were told that only 1 in 4 applicants, with the required grades, gets offered a place simply because of the number of applicants. What can swing it for one candidate over another is if they have hobbies or interests which make them more rounded. This could be voluntary work, musical skill, sporting achievements or D of E award.

It's not extra curricular roundedness, it's supercurricular - ie a demonstrable interest in the subject beyond schoolwork. e.g. reading texts outside of the subject area for literature based degrees, or attending public lectures or reading scientific journals for science degrees.

Unfortunately sports and music etc is where he lacks a bit. I'm a single parent who works full time and I have an above average number of children. I've simply never had the time to facilitate extras, although he could do D of E in 6th form if that would help.

No you don't need all Astars at GCSE, Cambridge didn't care that my DS has a 4 in French, they cared about how good he is at maths (he started 2 weeks ago). They would probably want/expect Astars in the subject(s) relevant to the degree he wants to do and they want excellent A level grades.

No you don't need to do sports/volunteering/DofE - my DS did none of this. As pp said what they are interested in is supercurricular so reading around the subject, competitions etc.

Yep, this seems borne out by what I've seen. DD is at Oxford (one of the less competitive courses, with only about three applicants or maybe interviewees per place). She had a mix of 9 to 7 at GCSE, but her interview really drilled down into what she had read and where that had taken her thought processes.

It also made her think on her feet -- she misread the start of an extract they were given to analyse, was brought up short on it, and had to stop and say, 'In that case, scrap what I've just said, my new theory is...'

Don't worry about it, 'extracurriculars' are actually pretty much irrelevant. That's old advice...as is the applicant to offer ratio, unfortunately for most subjects it's quite a lot higher now. But nothing ventured, nothing gained if they want to give it a shot!

What can be relevant is 'Supercurriculars' - activities which demonstrate the applicant's engagement with their subject. So my engineer DDs cv had things like the robots she'd built, Arkwright award ... maybe one line on the end re non-subject related activities. For other subjects it might be books they've read, competitions they've entered. Hobbies and DofE are of course good as ends in themselves for the youngsters well-being and development but they really don't seem to be of much interest to uni admissions.

(And some 'extracurriculars' are tbh merely an indicator of privilege)

What he might currently lack is sufficient obsession with one direction or area of study. Three/four years of being grilled weekly on something that doesn't really grip you could be hell.

DD is... on the outer edge of being sufficiently interested in her subject (she's also an all-rounder who wavered between arts and sciences for A-level), though she gets enough joy from some aspects of it to compensate for the hours of tedium.

Hi op
You sound a bit like me, I also have larger than average amount of kids (5) and single parent, though their dad is very involved too.

My daughter went to our local comp and got 11A*s (here in Northern Ireland) and she got into New College Oxford after a fairly in depth and gruelling interview process.

But it was well worth it and she loved her time there. I would say to your son to go for it, he has nothing to lose and incidentally she would have gotten an interview without all the A*s as As would have been fine as well, don't know about Bs but again they look at the whole picture not just gcse results

He does not need perfect GCSEs, and (at Oxford at any rate) GCSE scores are contextualised and those assessing can see how he sits in terms of the school’s wider performance. As others have said, GCSEs in subjects not relevant to what he plans to study will be considered less important anyway.

He does not need extra curriculars. Admitting tutors could not care less if he plays hockey or is good at the clarinet.

Super curriculars are relevant in terms of showing your motivation and aptitude for the course, but that is what they are for, they are not badges to be ticked off in own right. Reading around the subject, listening to podcasts etc is all fine. He doesn’t need to be winning competitions or essay prizes (which under-privileged candidates may not know about and so not get the chance and support to enter for). What tutors are looking for is someone who is passionate about the subject, teachable, and shows real aptitude.

If he is applying for a subject with an admissions test, that will be a big factor in whether he gets an interview. If he is applying for a subject where he is asked to submit school work, that will also be read very carefully.

One thing I'd say is that maybe a parent shouldn't exactly 'point him towards Oxbridge'. Sometime in yr 12 when you know how he's done did at gcse and how he's getting on with his A levels is probably an appropriate time to start generally discussing uni options, ahead of going to some open days. (Though going to a few open days after the end of yr 11 may be useful for deciding on subject choices too). Whatever they do, while we can support and guide it obviously has to be their ambition and choice.

Here’s a page about applying to Cambridge from Wales, including entry requirements.

My child then can use this year to revise for entrance exams should he wish to do so.

Just to pick up on that: the aptitude exams for Oxford are in the first term of the academic year, so he would have to register for them and put in his application by about mid October, not towards the end of the gap year.