Question about Natural Sciences

[QueenMabby]

Dd is currently in year 11. Loves chemistry and the intersection between chemistry and biology.

She's really interested in the natural sciences course at Cambridge and wants to apply.

I've heard that natural sciences at other unis don't work as well as it splits over three departments rather than being cohesive like it is at Cambridge.

Is this right? If so, is it common to apply for natural sciences at Cambridge and then chemistry or biochemistry say at the other choices?

Where else is best for these subjects?

Thank you.

Not quite the same subjects, but I got some useful advice here!
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/higher_education/5122134-natural-sciences-not-just-cambridge

I'm from New Zealand and did my degree at Uni of Auckland so can't answer the first questions re Cambridge, but I can answer the last one.

Geography is a good match for biological sciences I found. I really rounded off my degree. If she's interested in Geography that is.

The students I know who applied in recent years to Cambridge for NatSci (biological sciences) put Biochem as their other UCAS options; the advantages are that Biochem is a cohesive course and entry requs for higher tariff unis can be high but not as stretching as for NatSci eg MBiochem at U of Bath is AAB but for NatSci is AstarAA.

It sounds like your DD is looking to choose Chemistry and Biology for A level and these would both be mandatory for many of the higher tariff Biochem courses. Certain very high tariff unis also look for Maths A level if taking Biochem or Chem (Camb, Oxford, Imperial, several Scottish unis, and Durham if I remember rightly - do check). Others do not, so trying to assess, realistically, likely appetite for and performance in Maths at A level will be a factor; better an A in, say, Psychology than perhaps a B or C in Maths even if that rules out the highest tariff unis.

As @PhotoDad's early thread illuminates, the devil is in the detail with NatSci courses, and in terms of genuine co-ordination across departments. I suspect a trap to avoid (or at least be aware of) is that if your 'dream' NatSci course composition looks very close to a standard Biochem course, you will have had to pass a higher entry threshold for the same course experience. Effectively there is an entry premium for future course flexibility.

DD just started in Bath with natural sciences with chemistry and biochemistry (with some optional maths).

"Warning" about entrance exam at Cambridge, which has now changed anyway. Look carefully whether you want to apply through biological or physical ns.
DD with interest in chemistry wasn't interested in plant biology but unfortunately her interview questions were all plant based questions.
I know they aren't testing knowledge but made it more difficult to "show passion".

Also think carefully about doing further maths as a 4th subject. Not a requirement as such but several colleges like you to have further maths.

And yes, look carefully at various courses. Eg, Dd didn't like how in Durham you couldn't do a "study year abroad" as an extra year when choosing the MSci option .

Cambridge provides useful stats on the A levels presented by successful applicants to NatSci (biological sciences); see link below. 36% of successful applicants across 2018/2019/2023 had FM A level. The successful students I know did have FM as a fourth A level. However, a marginally weaker candidate would need to consider the potentially dilutory impact of taking four subjects inc FM rather than three.

www.undergraduate.study.cam.ac.uk/courses/natural-sciences-ba-hons-msci

Thank you all.

@Surf2Live - dd not doing geography gcse so can't move in that direction unfortunately.

I think dd is wanting to do maths, FM, bio and chem A-levels. She's very good at maths.

It's very interesting about the grade requirements for Nat sci / biochemistry elsewhere.

Dd likely to be predicted 12 9s for GCSE. She's very able.

I hear that the Oxbridge application process can be a bit of a minefield so even though on paper she's an "ideal" candidate (academically very able, super enthusiastic and a knowledge sponge with a passion for her subject) I appreciate that it might not be enough to get her over the line.

@QueenMabby I went to Oxbridge and I have taught lots of students who went on there. Also lots of equally bright and talented students (sometimes more so!) who didn't get in. Unfortunately it's always going to be a bit of a lottery depending on who else applies, and how things go with tests and interviews. So (as I've advised my DS) by all means go for it, but also have a backup plan!

There's a certain amount of biochem in the Biology A-level and that might help focus your DD's mind, too.

Thanks @PhotoDad. She's determined and I think will interview well but you can never tell!

In regards to your original question, DD is a Phys NatSci at C. All of her other applications were for straight Physics as NatSci at the other unis to which she applied didn’t interest her in the same way.

Both my DDs are NatSci graduates. DD1 studied Physical NatSci at Cambridge, DD2 BioNatSci integrated Masters with a year abroad at Leicester, but that brilliant course has now been discontinued. Both applied for NatSci at various different institutions including Durham, York, Bath, Imperial and maybe Warwick - sorry DD1 applied in 2016 and I can't remember now.

Now is a great time to start looking. If your DD is at a state school, there are Sutton Trust courses worth checking out.

To add to the list of places that still do NatSci (as several of those no longer offer it!), DS is currently applying to Cambridge, Durham, Leeds, Lancaster, and Nottingham.