Is sociology, business & politics A level combo a bad idea?

[LatinSisters]

A mum from school yesterday was appalled that my DD is wanting to study sociology, business and politics at A levels, saying that none of them are academic and she won’t get a place at a ‘good’ uni. DD has no clue about a career or a degree. She’s not taking any of those subjects at gcse so it’s a risk but this mum wasn’t getting at that. DD is definitely more interested in humanities than sciences. She works very hard and is likely to get the following at GCSE
maths 7, English x2 at 7, 3 sciences at 6, history 6, PE 7, Food 7/8. (Total of 9 subjects at 6/7 type results).
She thinks she’ll really enjoy sociology and politics, and that business could be interesting. BUT are these a ‘bad’ combination?

Cambridge list sociology and politics as preferred subjects. For goodness sake, they offer a degree in them!

But this girl does not sound Oxbridge bound.

FWIW, recent sociology students I have taught have gone to Cambridge, Birmingham, Warwick, Bath , Manchester, with no issues. Two of these were PPE, one law and one HSPS.

@Piggywaspushed indeed DD is not oxbridge bound! May I please as the degree here… ‘One with sociology, business (CNAT , not A level) and geography in fact has just started at Bath having turned down a Durham offer.’ Thank you! Your posts are very reassuring.

She's doing sociology obviously very bored in my lessons .

🤣🤣

Oh my goodness - I’ve just looked at Cambridge HSPS! She’d absolutely LOVE that! Shame she’s not oxbridge standard. What a great course!

No it’s about how you approach the material and the conventions of the discipline – the idea being that you develop the skills to approach any text / time period confidently.

That being said, I took Psychology at A Level, barely attended a class, just studied the textbook, and got an A. It was my easiest A Level by far and my first contact with the subject.

My ds1 did that exact combination, not through choice but by timetabling clashes, enjoyed all 3, is enjoying uni.

One of my DC considered a number of A level choices not studied at GCSE and found printing off past exam papers (for the relevant board), looking at Y11/12 summer transition work posted on school's website and a couple of those CGP type syllabus summaries you can buy at the likes of WHS useful in getting a feel for 'can I imagine studying this subject and sitting these exams?'. They stuck to subjects they had previously studied but felt the exercise gave them a more informed view and certainly did not put them off.

My DS applied. Ended up doing a similar course at Birmingham.

I think it's because they are all quite similar (and so maybe viewed in the same way, as fine for one option but not for all three) so narrow her down a bit too much. Why not take an initial look at degrees she might enjoy, and work back from that. Or try putting different subjects into this A level explorer https://www.theuniguide.co.uk/a-level-explorer
She has to be in control, but if it was me I would maybe swap in Geography (human geography BA degrees might be up her street) or psychology which are more established A level subjects. And maybe some core maths to support things like using statistics which might support her preferred subjects.
Maybe it's snobbery, yes, but it's also the kind of hidden trap of A level choices that not knowing how your choices 'read' to your preferred universities or employers gives you a disadvantage.

Yes @Runskiyoga i think core maths would be a great option as I’ve mentioned above, just not everywhere offers it unfortunately. That’s her kind of maths and would support social sciences.
@Piggywaspushed I’ll take a look at Birmingham courses - see what subjects they deem necessary for social science degrees. Thank you.

That’s a great idea @PerpetualOptimist thank you

I do feel the need to point out that all of these subjects have been around since as long as I have been teaching, which is a Very Long Time.

Politics is probably the 'newest'.

There is nothing wrong with any of those subjects – or even with them in combination – except that they close more doors than other options might.

Let me explain what I mean by that (as I don't mean that they are lesser subjects!) - if you want to do an English lit degree, you pretty much need Eng lit A level. But for sociology, politics and business, there is no need to have studied those subjects at A level.

So someone taking (say) history, Eng lit and French A levels could study those three subjects at uni, or equally, sociology, business or politics (and all the other many subjects that need no specific A levels, as you have found @LatinSisters ).

But as subjects they are all fine, and ofc it's probably not a bad idea to see if you enjoy sociology at A level before committing to a degree. AFAIK no uni will consider them not academic or in any way lesser. DS took PE A level and had offers from RG unis. Please ignore those who say these subjects would be seen as softer and that unis will not be impressed by that combo. Not the case at all.

But I would as others have caution against three totally new subjects. Could she mix in something she knows she likes from her current list - PE, English lit or lang (tho lang A level is very different from GCSE) or maybe history? Yes history subjects and Eng lit books will be new but at least she would know she enjoyed the subject. Or maybe she doesn't?

Why doesn't she take business for GCSE? Is it not offered?

I had a similar discussion with my DD ( similar grades/ interests) and tried to encourage her to add English to her mix but she ended up signing up for business, media studies and psychology although she did do business at gcse so only 2 new subjects rather than 3 though she had been considering sociology too.
I had reservations too but felt she’d do better and be more motivated with subjects she was interested in and wanted to study. We’re a couple of weeks into year 12 so far and she’s really enjoying the subjects and much more motivated than last year. The other option she considered that some schools offer is to start with 4 if just for a few weeks so you can get a feel for any new subjects and then drop one down the line.
My DS did politics A level ( alongside economics & History) and very much enjoyed it. It’s similar to History in a way as very essay based. Economics might be worth her looking too at as goes well with politics/ business.

Appalled? ffs

@clary thank you. I understand what you’re saying. That makes perfect sense. She wouldn’t want to study English or History or Economics at degree level. If she did then she’d be very interested in those subjects at A level and she really isn’t. She had to choose history (which at gcse she enjoys) otherwise it’d be geography, which at her school is lots about rocks and river’s apparently, rather than human. No, unfortunately her school don’t offer GCSEs in business, sociology, politics, psychology, or economics. They now offer them at A level bar sociology. Business A level is new this year. They’ve quite a narrow offering tbh as it’s not a huge school. No BTecs etc. She doesn’t fancy PE A level as the schools she’s looking at don’t offer her sports plus she’s not fantastic at the physiology (biology) aspects. I think she’s ok but there’s no love. It’s a chore. I think if it’s a chore at gcse it could be disastrous at A level. And not offering her sports is a huge issue. I don’t mean to sound argumentative as I understand what you’re saying & it does make sense!

They all sound fine and would not be "put down" by top universities as long as she's got the required grades for her courses. Psychology A Level is great though - DD would recommend it to anyone she loves it and I've had a look through and it seems fab! Sociology is quite dull though (might depend on the teacher). English language could be an option? Similar to sociology and history in terms of development of language etc. Politics is great and the A Level is a lot more challenging than lots of people assume. English language, psychology, and politics could be an option, still full of debate and thinking skills but more intellectually stimulating courses. But at the end of the day your DD will do best in what she enjoys x

The most favoured school atm doesn’t offer economics bizarrely, but offers business. Maybe their thinking is that maths is required for the most serious of economics degrees and of course they offer maths. So not offering econ doesn’t thwart students applications. Maybe! I’ve no clue what their reasoning is. I agree that starting with 4 coukd be a good idea but it’d probably be 4 new ones as she’s interested in psychol too. And that doesn’t open any doors as biology is needed for psych and she’s no interest in a Psychol degree/career. At least atm!

Fair enough, if she is not keen on Eng lit then the A level is not a good idea. What about food - that's looking like her strongest grade at GCSE? Or is that also not of interest?

AFAIK PE A level only requires one sport (certs DS only offered footy). What do you mean when you say that the schools don't offer her sports? Plenty of people take A level (and indeed GCSE) PE offering sports not played in school - bc they do them outside school - or they do them outside school to a better standard than school can offer (athletics on a proper track for example). But if the biology element is not enjoyed then that is a potential issue.

I presume she is looking at a new setting for sixth form - does it offer GCSE business and will a lot of the A level cohort have taken it? Not that it should matter but it may set her off on the back foot.

I don't think you are being argumentative btw! But does she enjoy any of her GCSE subjects enough to take them forward? You say she enjoys history - is that not an option? I personally would suggest subbing that for business.

I think concerns about three new subjects, for me anyway, would focus on that. If you don't like what you chose for GCSE then who's to say you will like your totally different untried A level choices? And you really need to like what you choose for A level IMHO.

I used to teach A level Politics. It's very relevant and not a soft subject at all. DD can maybe spend a day in the local MPs office and go up to Parliament. Really interesting. Of those, Sociology possibly raises a question but if DD finds it interesting, that's the important thing. Maybe Psychology? They are all quite wordy A levels so lots of revising and remembering.
DD is doing well at slightly more hands on subjects , PE and Food Tech. (I know PE has a chunky written element) Would she think about one of those?

It's really worth having a look at syllabuses, trips, assessments etc. Whether or not she's changing schools, talk to teachers at her current school and any future ones. If they know her well, they can help.

I used to be a bit of an academic snob and quite rigid in my thinking.
Time and experience has changed all of that.
The best advice I can give is that if you aren’t ‘using’ your A levels for a particular career, pick ones you feel will enjoy.
I have never understood why people think some A levels are so much ‘easier’ than others! They are called Advanced Levels for a reason.
All three of her choices are interesting subjects which also are easy to research just by looking around at the world - TV, news, podcasts etc are packed full of content that is relevant.
I think ‘seats’ of higher learning are also getting better at looking at the skills and interests of individuals now. I would definitely tell her to pick the subjects she fancies and have a good go at them. People get so hung up on mapping out a future - students I have encountered who have enjoyed their studies and aren’t too rigid enjoy Sixth Form and Uni more than ones who are stuck to one path.

I think they sound fine. However, I did sociology a lifetime ago and didn't find it boring! I also did history and found it tough.
For a more modern perspective, my ds found history consumed more of his time than other A levels and though he did well he found it hard and a bit tick boxy. He loved politics A level!

Why does sociology raise a question please? This is the one she’s most interested in.
I don’t know anywhere that offers food A level. She’s doing food & nutrition gcse as her ‘creative’ & really enjoys it but it’s not going to be a career for her. Why would Food or PE be ‘better’ than sociology?

Of her GCSEs she enjoys history & food. She likes English (now) as she’s an amazing teacher. The rest she tolerates. I don’t know anywhere that offers A level Food. Her current teacher has advised against history A level as she’s predicted a 6 in the gcse and has told her she’d be lucky to get a C even if she worked her socks off. She’s doesn’t mind hard work but is worried about a C or less. The other issue is that we are looking at a number of 6th forms and they all differ in what topics they cover for History. They don’t all appeal. Whereas business, sociology & politics all seem to be similar content from school to school, exam board to exam board with little variation.