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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Physics degree

39 replies

alwaysonadiet1 · 12/09/2024 14:47

Are physics, chemistry and maths A levels all required at Cambridge for a degree in physics? Thanks.

OP posts:
cardboard33 · 13/09/2024 09:56

SeptimusSheep · 12/09/2024 15:23

how she might feel if she were one of the few students on this demanding programme lacking FM

Desperate, and behind.

I speak from experience.

To counter that, she might also flourish and end up in the top 10 of the year after 4 years and on the scholars list for all but one year. This is what happened to my husband on MPhys at Oxford.

He said it was VERY hard work for the year in particular due to the lack of FM but had prepared by self teaching some of the FM material over the summer holidays before he started which he continued in the first year. The key difference is that he loves maths but wanted a practical element to it (although regrets that he didn't do engineering given he went into that field) whereas if your daughter doesn't really like maths, what is she expecting a physics degree to be like? Could she consider something more practical such as engineering (many branches to choose from!) although again, it depends on how much she actually likes maths? There is a big step up from GCSE to A level which could also be something to consider.

Talipesmum · 13/09/2024 09:58

SeptimusSheep · 12/09/2024 15:23

how she might feel if she were one of the few students on this demanding programme lacking FM

Desperate, and behind.

I speak from experience.

yes, me too. They “covered” the further maths syllabus over the first few weeks. All physical sciences natscis need to take quite a hard maths course alongside sciences and honestly it’s so hard, please do further maths if you can. I went from being top grades 90+ % in maths, to completely lost and struggling to answer anything.
In the end it was all fine as I veered in the direction of geology instead of chemistry, but I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.

poetryandwine · 13/09/2024 10:05

Apologies, @LaerealSilverhand . I did not check that I was addressing you (and the OP of course) in my recent post. I didn’t intend to quote you to yourself

Talipesmum · 13/09/2024 10:09

I agree with others above - is it that she finds basic school maths a bit boring, or that she doesn’t really love it? I do think you have to enjoy maths if you’re going to try to do loads at a level, especially further maths. And with university physics depts, it’s entirely about what the cohort generally has. There are loads of good physics degrees where most of them don’t have FM a level, and the course will be paced accordingly. It’s all about doing it at the right pace.

And as others have said, have a think about engineering. It may well be that side of physics she likes, and while some engineering courses like FM too, it’s a less fundamentally maths based thing than pure physics. There are loads of videos on various engineering degrees on Imperial college website (was looking at them with my son recently).

Or, look through the biological sciences natsci options. There are different maths courses for people who aren’t taking physics / chemistry. Can’t remember exactly how it works. I wish I’d done those ones! Would have been v useful. But I was expecting to do full on chemistry which needed the physical sciences maths.

Good luck to her - it’s so hard thinking about what you want to do for your degree when you’re only 15. But the more you can look into options, maybe go to uni fairs at schools etc, the more she can build up a mental image of the possibilities.

Talipesmum · 13/09/2024 10:11

Talipesmum · 13/09/2024 09:58

yes, me too. They “covered” the further maths syllabus over the first few weeks. All physical sciences natscis need to take quite a hard maths course alongside sciences and honestly it’s so hard, please do further maths if you can. I went from being top grades 90+ % in maths, to completely lost and struggling to answer anything.
In the end it was all fine as I veered in the direction of geology instead of chemistry, but I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.

Just want to make clear here as I missed the edit window - I wouldn’t wish the “losing your grip on maths in hideous style” on anyone. I’d be v keen for people to become geologists, it’s the best!

HannahinHampshire · 13/09/2024 10:25

My son’s school didn’t offer Further Maths - his A levels were Physics, Maths and Computing. He did his MPhys in physics at Manchester and got a first, he’s now working as a software developer.

MrsAvocet · 13/09/2024 10:47

It's early days yet OP. It would be sensible for her to spend some time over the next few years looking at what different courses offer as well as what they need and to try to think about what direction she would want to go with a degree in physics. I know that's a big ask at this age, but I think that a lot of kids at this stage in their education, not unreasonably really, are imagining doing a degree in a particular subject is just an extension of studying it at school so tend to lean towards subjects they like, when there's actually so much choice. A good set of STEM A levels could take her in many directions, lots of which she probably hasn't even considered yet. And the same degree at different places will often lean in a different direction.
My DS and his best friend were probably just about the 2 best at physics in their school year at GCSE and they both loved it. But even by A level they were developing interests in different aspects, and chose different options. Next week my DS will be starting a degree in engineering, whereas his best friend is doing physics. They're actually really different people with different interests and skills and I imagine they'll end up in very different jobs. But they both loved, and excelled at, GCSE physics.
Obviously your DD's focus needs to be her GCSEs right now, but doing some Summer Schools, work experience, visiting Universities etc may help her decide. Keep as many doors open as possible at this stage.

poetryandwine · 13/09/2024 11:02

Great post from @MrsAvocet , OP.

There are some good (short) summer opportunities for both coed pupils and specifically girls interested in STEM. Next summer or the one after would be the time for that, so if DD is interested this Autumn is the time to start looking into it.

SeptimusSheep · 13/09/2024 12:58

Talipesmum · 13/09/2024 09:58

yes, me too. They “covered” the further maths syllabus over the first few weeks. All physical sciences natscis need to take quite a hard maths course alongside sciences and honestly it’s so hard, please do further maths if you can. I went from being top grades 90+ % in maths, to completely lost and struggling to answer anything.
In the end it was all fine as I veered in the direction of geology instead of chemistry, but I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.

Yes, I sidestepped into materials science and then electron microscopy, but then I was torn between physics and chemistry in the first place.

What aspects of physics does she love? Optics, astronomy, quantum stuff, engineering, transport, geophysics, chaos...?

poetryandwine · 13/09/2024 14:46

SeptimusSheep · 13/09/2024 12:58

Yes, I sidestepped into materials science and then electron microscopy, but then I was torn between physics and chemistry in the first place.

What aspects of physics does she love? Optics, astronomy, quantum stuff, engineering, transport, geophysics, chaos...?

These are great questions but TBF the DD has just started Y11. How many of ys could have discussed most of these fields meaningfully then, even those who eventually became physicists?

SeptimusSheep · 13/09/2024 15:52

Fair enough! What fascinated me at that age was lenses, flame colours, planets and Newton's optical experiments, rather than, say, car engines and wind power, so that's the sort of level I was thinking. I remember discussing that plus my love of ecology with a blank faced careers advisor when trying to choose A levels, and she suggested aiming for a biochemistry degree as 'sort of in between it all'.

To be fair, it would have been a great career choice if I'd been interested.

Malbecfan · 13/09/2024 17:13

If the school offers FM at A level and your DD wants to study NatSci at Cambridge, she really should take it. I have 2 NatSci graduate DDs, one from C. She took Maths, FM, Physics and Chemistry at A level. She found FM a challenge and when she got to C, there were 3 Maths "streams": hard Maths, Maths and Maths for Biologists. DD took the middle one and even with her A star and A in Maths and FM said it was really tough. Despite her starting there thinking she would specialise in Chemistry, she specialised in Materials Science and is now based there working for a PhD in that field.

DD went to a Women into STEM course at Corpus Christi college and that really spurred her into applying there. As others have said, there are lots of summer courses available, so suggest your DD signs up to receive information about them. It might also be worth contacting the college attached to your location to see if they have any outreach or taster programmes. DD's college does a lot of these, but sadly they are not attached to my location. The college that is attached here doesn't seem to be so proactive. Sorry not to name-check them; this is to preserve what is left of DD's anonymity!

poetryandwine · 13/09/2024 20:10

cardboard33 · 13/09/2024 09:56

To counter that, she might also flourish and end up in the top 10 of the year after 4 years and on the scholars list for all but one year. This is what happened to my husband on MPhys at Oxford.

He said it was VERY hard work for the year in particular due to the lack of FM but had prepared by self teaching some of the FM material over the summer holidays before he started which he continued in the first year. The key difference is that he loves maths but wanted a practical element to it (although regrets that he didn't do engineering given he went into that field) whereas if your daughter doesn't really like maths, what is she expecting a physics degree to be like? Could she consider something more practical such as engineering (many branches to choose from!) although again, it depends on how much she actually likes maths? There is a big step up from GCSE to A level which could also be something to consider.

This is a truly inspiring story and I am delighted for your DH.

However my STEM School with a standard entry requirement above AAA without an explicit requirement of FM is now in an odd position. The large majority do have FM and although we make formal provision for those without it, I fear that their experiences are for the most part similar to those of @SeptimusSheep and @Talipesmum .

If we don’t require FM, those without it deserve an equal chance to succeed. Are we in my School honestly providing that? No. Is Cambridge Nat Sci and is Oxford Physics? IMO they are not.

It is heartening to us all as academics for a whole host of reasons when an underdog succeeds. The success of your DH, @cardboard33 , and the very few like him, enabled Oxford to believe they were doing it right.

My School and Oxbridge Physics are by no means outliers.

How to get it right is a huge problem

poetryandwine · 13/09/2024 20:12

SeptimusSheep · 13/09/2024 15:52

Fair enough! What fascinated me at that age was lenses, flame colours, planets and Newton's optical experiments, rather than, say, car engines and wind power, so that's the sort of level I was thinking. I remember discussing that plus my love of ecology with a blank faced careers advisor when trying to choose A levels, and she suggested aiming for a biochemistry degree as 'sort of in between it all'.

To be fair, it would have been a great career choice if I'd been interested.

This is a wonderful post. I am so sorry you didn’t thrive doing a Physics concentration at Cambridge

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