Oxbridge 2024 Entry Part 5

[YouOKHun]

Good Luck everyone whatever the outcome!

A friend asked the AO of Cambridge and was told that about 30% of the admittance would be picked up by whoever were the interviewers.

I think it’s as fair a process as possible and fairer and more transparent than most unis.

By the time someone gets to interview, they are already ranked. Their admissions test (if there is one - and if there is, it’s a good thing) and submitted written work and GCSEs (contextualised) and predicted grades have all been factored in. Those low down the rankings have to do more in interview to rise up the rankings and beat those who were lower down. It doesn’t just come down to interviews and they are at pains to say that. But often people imagine they start the interview in the same level as everyone else, it forget they don’t. Some are already ‘favourites’ and others an outside chance. And I think that’s right, as interviews do have a subjective element to them, and as has been said on the last couple of posts, different interviewers might like different answers and the questions themselves might suit one candidate rather than another. However, the admissions test marked centrally and other data analysis is more objective. The combination of the different aspects and the transparency and publication of data such as average admissions test results to get shortlisted or to get an offer make it all a bit clearer.

In the end, the interview will swing it for some candidates and go against others, but much if the rank order is already decided and it’s already clear that some will very likely get. A place and some won’t. As has been said, those in the middle are where the battle lies and where the litttle things and flunky things might make a difference between getting one of the last places or not.

It’s hard if you find out your admissions test score was very high, you written work ranked high and it was the interview that let you down. Perhaps it’s easier to take if you get the feedback and find you were always low down the ranking in all aspects, although good enough to get to interview.

In the end, I think the answer all those rejected need to hold onto is that they are very good candidates and all who get to interview are strong. But quite simply there are too many good candidates and they couldn’t give everyone a place. It doesn’t make them a poor or weak candidate. And these students are those who are likely to go onto get good degrees from other top unis. Beyond that, other stuff is important to like personality, character, team working, seizing opportunities. Some Oxbridge people are good at these and others aren’t and likewise some from other unis will be better at these. Lots of things will determine outcomes in life and Oxbridge is just one very small part.

Agree with most of that but I think better to say "those who didn't get an offer" rather than rejected. Rejected just sounds like they did something wrong and in the vast majority of cases they didn't.

Been through this a few times in various roles and I think generally the parents (and sometimes grandparents) find it harder to accept to than the kids, especially if Oxbridge graduates in the family from earlier times.

Saying that my daughter had a lot of problems with a classmate who didn't get it. Culminated in her coming up to my daughter at leaving ball and launching a drunken tirade along the lines of I'm cleverer than you, I should have got the place instead of you, etc. Was a bit of an embarrassing meltdown in front of everyone. This girl had huge family pressure and expectation and in the end got the rare full marks 45 at IB so she was definitely clever. Perhaps interviewers picked up on the sense of entitlement and bad personality and didn't want her around.

Not a good look Hertsessex.

Over the years I've been amazed by the grace with which some extraordinarily clever - definitely top of the superselective class - students at our school have dealt with not getting an offer. A few of them did reapply and succeed the following year but in the interim there was no apparent ill will shown towards those who had been made offers. I can't think of a single incidence.

DS1 was, I think, a surprise Oxford 'success' at his school. It's one of the same type as @RIPMatthewperry school.

I was a rather surprised by the comments I received from other people about his offer. I think a lot of parents think they know more about other pupils and their abilities than they actually do. There are some dark horses out there who are more capable than others might think.

@Hertsessex I don’t think I would have published that post

Why not janecrookall45?

@goodbyestranger This girl was drunk and showed a distinct lack of judgement, which was clearly unacceptable and embarrassing. However, she was clearly still hurting ; hardly surprising given her amazing IB results. It does not make her entitled, with a bad personality and the sort of student the college would shun.

Despite being hurt it is not acceptable to abuse someone else. Dont think it is helpful to excuse sour grapes and reactions like this.

janecrook she seemed to have nursed the hurt for quite a while then - this incident was at the Y13 leavers' ball. Also Hertsessex said it was an ongoing thing, not an isolated incident. As Runoutofinkagain says: not ok. It's entirely possible the tutors thought the girl was not teachable and not receptive to opinions other than her own if this was her style.

I read it as @janecrookall45 suggesting that it was a stretch to extrapolate that the interviewers picked up a sense of entitlement in the interview and that this may have been the reason for the rejection.

Found out the Oxford results through the schools newsletter as my son is useless at getting this kind of info unfortunately.

To give some context, It is an academic sixth form attached to a non-selective comprehensive with 130 pupils in each year group. Entry requirements to stay/join are 5’s in Maths and English and 5 x 6’s overall. It does provide good good support for university applications including early applicants and has links to multiple lOcad independent schools.

Only 2 Oxford offers for this year. There were 33 early applicants, 18 made it to interview but I don’t know the split between Oxford, Cambridge and Medics. I do know were 6 History based applicants, 3 got to interview stage at Oxford with only 1 gaining a place for one of the joint schools (my son was the only Cambridge history applicant). There didn’t seem much between the history applicants - they were all very strong. Last year they had 5 Oxford History offers which translated to 4 places. They had been told previously that this year was the strongest recent cohort. Just shows how close and variable it can be.

@Maggiethecat Thank you. That was exactly what I meant.

I would say probably not a particular stretch. That behaviour is not ok even in the immediate aftermath of a rejection, let alone months later. It suggests an attitude that the tutors may well not have welcomed encountering in a weekly tutorial.

Thanks for this post. I find the statistics very interesting. I was always fascinated by posters saying their school had lots of applications to Oxbridge and wondered how big the schools were. My child is at a similar sized school but there was only 1 Oxbridge applicant this year and that is pretty standard, 0-2 applicants a year. There is zero encouragement to apply.
Do you have any stats on the predicted grades of the 33 applicants? Were they all 3 xA stars?

Even f that is what you meant by your post I don't think it is a stretch to think her attitude at interview must have put them off since her academics are clearing top notch. It is pretty easy to spot over confidence and entitlement.

@Runoutofinkagain Sorry no idea of grade predictions - even for history - but it definitely wouldn’t have been all A Star. They probably would be a minimum of 3 A’s though as although they encourage students to aim high, there is no point making an application if it is going to be automatically rejected.

Glad someone else likes this kind of data. I probably should have also said the sixth form only offers A Level qualifications.

@Runoutofinkagain, our school has a 6th form cohort of around 250 pupils, approx 80 -90 applicants most years for Oxbridge. I would imagine the school wouldn't encourage an early application unless 3 x A star are predicted but it's left up to the pupils and they would support pupils with a lower profile as long as they meet the minimum standard for entry.

@Lightsabre That's more applicants than people in DD's year! It's a big school but lots go to college (especially agricultural) after GCSEs.
They are very encouraging in principle, but utterly clueless about the process. There were a few potential candidates this year (from around 60 in year, non selective), but two decided they didn't want the extra stress, one wants to stay local, one potential medic wants a shorter degree and is going for paramedicine instead, and another is taking a gap year and may not ever go to uni. I'm pleased these bright young things have options and aren't pressured into Oxbridge, which must be the case in some places (looking at you, my former school).

On decisions, I wonder if they are looking for growth potential in some cases. So a 'rough diamond' might get the nod over someone already very accomplished, even if they are lovely, non-entitled human beings who could excel there, if they are perceived to be the finished article. The uni's are the first to admit they don't always get it right, and how could they? I too am interested in the stats and the decisions process, and agree this is fairly transparent; but they can't explain everything without breaching data protection, so definitive answers will remain a mystery.

@KazzaV and @BiancaBlank. Congratulations to both of your DC. Lincoln is a wonderful college

Wow that is such a high % of predicted 3 x A*, or maybe that is 'normal'?
I am in Scotladn it and wouldn't be normal for so many pupils to get 5 x A at higher except possibly some fee paying schools but research has shown that being at a fee paying school raises grades by a whole grade per subject as far as I know.
Sorry haven't researched England to see if it is the same there

@WombatChocolate that is a very good point to remember that it is not ground zero as they enter interview stage. My DD said earlier today 'I'm 100% positive I will not get an offer', but how can she be so sure? She did have a written assessment, but specific to her college (I mean for the subject only a few colleges require an additional assessment) and it was an essay so no exact right or wrong - she obviously doesn't know how she did but she's a good essay writer. She has three A stars plus A star EPQ already. Her written examples were very good and I believe her PS was excellent. Her school references were great. Her interview? It was not as expected (no challenges to her answers, no debate) so she can't tell if that's good or bad. So all in all there no one 'bad thing'. So guess she's in that middle of the pack, maybe a bit towards the upper end as she has her grades. So I'm thinking with a fair wind she's got as good a chance as most. But it is a thin line and I do believe what @Hertsessex says about on one day it could go to this candidate and a different one on another. I don't think she could have done any better and at the end of the day she's still the same hard working person who will have a bright future wherever she gets her degree from.

there were 15 in my son’s year of around 250 who got 5 As including him and that is the most the school have ever had. Normal state school, decent enough but not east ren standards. I suppose that there might have been kids predicted 5 As who never got it mind you