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Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Oxbridge 2024 Entry Part 4

1000 replies

Lightsabre · 02/12/2023 09:34

New thread as our dc start the rollercoaster ride of interviews.

OP posts:
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6
Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 02:45

DS spoke to some of the other maths Oxbridge interviewees today at his college, now they've all had their interviews, and they all struggled slightly with various questions at various colleges. In that they had to really think about them. They all seem to have been able to answer them though.

They talked through the various questions they were given. Each college at Oxford had completely different questions. I can't remember what he said re Cambridge.

Two candidates interviewed at the same college were given the same maths questions.

DS says he did fly through the questions though at the second college and answered at least 6 as opposed to just 2 at his first choice college.

And now we just wait.

Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 02:53

DS said they all pretty much felt like they did badly and could have done better and took longer than they would ordinarily to answer what were quite frankly some bizarre questions.

Which DS took to mean that if they all felt like that and that they're all incredibly capable then maybe it wasn't as bad as they all think after all.

DS hasn't heard back from Kings or Imperial yet re Maths and neither has anyone yet who he knows for any subject.

Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 02:56

I hope that's helpful for anyone.

DS is at a State college that tends to have a fair few students getting into Oxbridge so we'll see what happens.

RIPMatthewperry · 14/12/2023 04:12

@Hertsessex i had this conversation earlier. Unis must know who they intend to take before the Xmas break. Why not just let the kids know now so they can either take a sigh of relief or have some time to regroup before the new term? Especially as a lot of students have mocks when they return - and as we now know, mocks form an integral part of assessments if the world goes to shit again with a pandemic.

MirandaWest · 14/12/2023 05:20

When I applied to Cambridge 30 years ago now (not getting in as I was never the right person to go) I remember getting a letter at the end of December. I doubt everyone got them on exactly the same date though!

losingtheplot999 · 14/12/2023 06:42

Why do they wait until January is there a reason for this?

bamboowarrior · 14/12/2023 07:30

Yes maths sounds like was a broad range of questions at the different colleges, some easier, some tougher, all fabulous!!! What an incredible experience and our young folks are all amazing and fabulous

now what will be will be

Rollergirl11 · 14/12/2023 08:31

@Hertsessex yes it’s definitely frustrating. DD was saying last night that she just wants to be able to focus on where she’s (hopefully) going and she doesn’t even care if she doesn’t get an offer but it’s the not knowing that’s insufferable.

She was placating herself last night by looking at accommodation at Exeter and Durham (even though she doesn’t have an offer from Durham so far!) to take her mind off things.

mondaytosunday · 14/12/2023 08:42

That's it @Rollergirl11. Last night my dd was saying she wished it was January 24 already - but then she doesn't to want to miss Christmas! It will be a very long six weeks.

Lightsabre · 14/12/2023 08:45

It's not going to be much of a Xmas break here as mocks start in the second week of January. Hoping to get in a few days holiday in February half term. We're all tired but need to keep trooping on until mocks finish.

OP posts:
IThinkIMadeItWorse · 14/12/2023 08:50

It does feel like a long wait but I'm sure there is loads of work going on behind the scenes to make all the decisions. Just think about how many applications they get! At Cambridge the winter pool all happens in early January so they do call a few people back for interview then, I think that is quite rare though.

What is frustrating me is the BMO1 has been marked but they haven't yet released the results and last year he didn't get his result until after the Christmas holidays as he had broken up before it was released. I don't see what the delay is there!

WombatChocolate · 14/12/2023 09:00

I think there’s more admin involved than we could imagine. Quite possibly the last few places are debated well into next week and then people are heading off for Christmas. UCAS have to be informed and before they send out offers/rejections, the analysis of each college and faculty has to be carried out and out together. I imagine it’s a frenetic rush to meet that deadline, with Christmas in the middle.

Re how 2nd interviews are issued and used, I think it probably changes a bit each year and is different between faculties and is also still being tweaked in relation to Teams interviews instead of real-life at Oxford. If you really root around on college websites you can often track down admissions reports for most subjects - sometimes they are 2 or 3 years old and sometimes you can find the one from last year, with very specific info about no.s of 1st and 2nd interviews and data about what the requirements in the admissions tests were to be shortlisted for interview, average scores of those shortlisted and average scores of those actually offered, and the same about scores given for interviews. In subjects I’ve looked at, last year it seemed that 1st interviews put the majority into ‘accept’ or ‘reject’ categories and less maybe 15% in these subjects were called for 2nd interviews at other colleges to pin down who would get the final and marginal places. Some of the 2nd college interviews will be for standardisation, but actually that’s likely to be few of them.

Each year is a bit different. In the last couple of years, GCSEs have not been contextualised to be used in shortlisting, due to Covid grades, according to reports. But this year’s cohort have done GCSE exams so could have been factored in. Different weights are given to any admissions tests, written work that had to be submitted and GCSEs. Many subjects only seem to look at the written work after shortlisting, but then use it to help rank candidates. Before they are interviewed they are already ranked. Those at the top have a better chance if an offer. Those at the bottom will have do extremely extremely well to beat the top ranking ones and get offers. Some will, but most of these candidates won’t. If you ask for feedback about interviews after the offers/rejections come out, it might become clear that before the interview you were already in a very strong or weaker position. Only then will it be clear quite how different elements were weighted and when they were used in ranking at the different stages this year.

A factor this year is also the disruption of some admissions tests and some being abandoned or some which were still used having to be given less weight when schools and colleges filed reports about technical problems during the admissions tests. I know this isn’t about interviews, but those admissions tests where used,do play role in final ranking. They will be looking to make sure people are not disadvantaged so it is likely these will be given less weight this year or certainly for affected candidates.

I’ve heard it said that the interviews are for confirming what is already mostly decided. In the majority of cases, those ranked high before interview will get places and those at the bottom won’t. The most movement up and down is likely in the middling ranked students who by shining rise into the accepted category or by nit doing quite so well lose out to others who do better.

It’s not perfect but it seems logical to me and unlike other universities which are often purely deciding based on predicted grades and little more than that, at least there are a range of evidences being considered. They’ve all done so well ti get to the stage where they statistically had roughly a 1 in 3 chance, even if actually their starting ranking means it’s probably less than that. And in the end they are all up against the best of the best and most can’t have a place.

goodbyestranger · 14/12/2023 10:09

I had this conversation earlier. Unis must know who they intend to take before the Xmas break. Why not just let the kids know now so they can either take a sigh of relief or have some time to regroup before the new term?

Oxford until relatively recently used to send letters/ emails before Christmas for all subjects but there was no fixed date. It was usually 20th, 21st or 22nd type of thing. Made for a great Christmas for some, a not great one for the majority and an absolutely horrendous one for the admin staff at each college who had already had weeks of very heavy admin sorting the interviews. They moved to an after Christmas fixed date in either 2012 or 2013.

The decisions are made extremely quickly after the relevant interview rounds are complete.

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 10:52

I wonder how contextual data is used in the process? Some of our DC will have had help in the process for several months due to the school they attend and other will have next to nothing. DS has friends at a selective school who were surprised that he hasn’t had prep lessons for the MAT/oral maths at interview at his school ( a bog standard non-selective comp that sent no-one to Oxbridge last year).
I wonder if there is data to show what the proportion of kids are interviewed from state non-selective schools vs selective state and private and then the proportions for the same groups for whom interviews result in offers.

User11010866 · 14/12/2023 11:00

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 10:52

I wonder how contextual data is used in the process? Some of our DC will have had help in the process for several months due to the school they attend and other will have next to nothing. DS has friends at a selective school who were surprised that he hasn’t had prep lessons for the MAT/oral maths at interview at his school ( a bog standard non-selective comp that sent no-one to Oxbridge last year).
I wonder if there is data to show what the proportion of kids are interviewed from state non-selective schools vs selective state and private and then the proportions for the same groups for whom interviews result in offers.

There must be an algorithm to deal with state non-selective applicants. I remember a famous case in mumsnet when an applicant scored 4th on the aptitude test and wasn't shortlisted for a 14-invited list in one Oxford college not long ago because he came from a super selective Grammar.

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 11:16

Thanks @User11010866 I know that contextual data is used to rank who gets interviewed ( for example how a candidate’s GCSEs are in relation to their school’s performance) but I’m wondering how that translates post interview into actual offers. (Ie does contextualisation carry all the way through the process).

Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 11:20

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 10:52

I wonder how contextual data is used in the process? Some of our DC will have had help in the process for several months due to the school they attend and other will have next to nothing. DS has friends at a selective school who were surprised that he hasn’t had prep lessons for the MAT/oral maths at interview at his school ( a bog standard non-selective comp that sent no-one to Oxbridge last year).
I wonder if there is data to show what the proportion of kids are interviewed from state non-selective schools vs selective state and private and then the proportions for the same groups for whom interviews result in offers.

I found data for this on the Oxford website. I'll try and find a link as I'm in my phone but looked it up on my laptop

User11010866 · 14/12/2023 11:24

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 11:16

Thanks @User11010866 I know that contextual data is used to rank who gets interviewed ( for example how a candidate’s GCSEs are in relation to their school’s performance) but I’m wondering how that translates post interview into actual offers. (Ie does contextualisation carry all the way through the process).

Don't know much about Oxford. At least for Trinity Maths in C, the offers were mainly based on the interviewers' scores https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/555835/response/1336105/attach/2/Copy%20of%20Sonya%20Plestina%20Maths%20data.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1

That's probably the reason why the top mathematicians in DC's school all applied to C as getting to the interview stage and taking the STEP are more predictable for them.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/555835/response/1336105/attach/2/Copy%20of%20Sonya%20Plestina%20Maths%20data.pdf?cookie_passthrough=1

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 11:27

Thanks @Mirrormeback . I have only just figured out that for Maths each college has only 4-5 places and interviewed 12-15 for these so they are tiny pools!

Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 11:32

Go to the bottom of the link for the stats

www.ox.ac.uk/about/facts-and-figures/admissions-statistics/undergraduate-students

Mirrormeback · 14/12/2023 11:35

You need to download the report which is in a pdf format

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 11:35

Thanks @User11010866

goodbyestranger · 14/12/2023 11:44

There must be an algorithm to deal with state non-selective applicants. I remember a famous case in mumsnet when an applicant scored 4th on the aptitude test and wasn't shortlisted for a 14-invited list in one Oxford college not long ago because he came from a super selective Grammar

It won't have been because of school type, purely to do with prior attainment within a high achieving context. Oxford is stuffed with students from super selective grammars, always has been and continues to be.

goodbyestranger · 14/12/2023 11:46

But sometimes people feel better if they cling on to some notion of unfairness, which is a shame because they only feel harder done by (albeit on behalf of their child).

mushroom3 · 14/12/2023 11:51

Thanks @Mirrormeback very interesting to look through.

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